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Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #25 on: March 14, 2010, 04:41:02 PM »
So you're saying that without changing a blade of the fine fescue at either course, you'd give Deal some extra marks were it on TV once a decade like Sandwich?

Jamie Barber

Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #26 on: March 14, 2010, 04:47:09 PM »
What did you think about the first green at Deal?  I think it has some of the most imaginative contours on the course.

Agree the green is good. Tony Muldoon mentioned that at BUDA, David Dobie (Deal club historian) said the green was built on shingle and contours became more pronounced when a gas pipe was put in near the road, which changed the water flows in the ground.

Locally it's always said that RSG has the worst greens of the Kent's 3 championship links. The greens at Deal always putt superbly, but I'd like to see them a touch firmer.

Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #27 on: March 14, 2010, 04:49:57 PM »
Quote
So you're saying that without changing a blade of the fine fescue at either course, you'd give Deal some extra marks were it on TV once a decade like Sandwich?

Yes! Because it would be an additional dimension of enjoyment for me, just to see how Tiger plays a course that I have a personal experience on. Don't you think that seeing something like this on the teebox:



will make playing this hole just a bit more exciting to you? Aren't you going to compare where your second shot ends up on that hole?

Ulrich
Golf Course Exposé (300+ courses reviewed), Golf CV (how I keep track of 'em)

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #28 on: March 14, 2010, 05:25:15 PM »
Locally it's always said that RSG has the worst greens of the Kent's 3 championship links. The greens at Deal always putt superbly, but I'd like to see them a touch firmer.

Do you mean worst greens as far as design, or quality of the putting surface?

I agree Deal's greens could do with being a bit firmer in summer.

Jamie Barber

Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #29 on: March 14, 2010, 05:33:28 PM »
quality of the surface. I've always been told Deal and Prince's putt truer.

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #30 on: March 14, 2010, 05:42:29 PM »
I will have to re-examine the 4th when I play at Sandwich tomorrow.  Honestly, I was a bit surprised that I did not like the 4th more.  I have read much praise about the hole.  Yet it did not excite me the way some of the other holes did.  I feel I definitely need to re-evaluate the hole.

I will probably only have time for a few golf excursions, so I am trying to narrow it down to a few key courses.

Sandwich (twice), Deal, Huntercombe, Swinley Forest, and no telling where else.  I knew once you got over there you would get your priorities in order!

What do you think of Kummel?

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #31 on: March 14, 2010, 05:55:15 PM »
I bought him a kummel at Swinley and did ask how he liked it, but he appeared to have lost the faculty of speech! ;D

John has a mind-boggling day planned during his stay, but it's not for me to divulge the details!

Adam Clayman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #32 on: March 14, 2010, 05:56:51 PM »
The place looks very familiar.  ;D

Ran's review.


http://golfclubatlas.com/courses-by-country/england/deal1
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Dan Moore

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2010, 06:00:10 PM »
They're some pretty great pics, Dan. Looking forward to meeting up at Rye.

Scott definitely looking forward to meeting you and the others at Rye.
"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2010, 06:12:03 PM »
I bought him a kummel at Swinley and did ask how he liked it, but he appeared to have lost the faculty of speech! ;D

John has a mind-boggling day planned during his stay, but it's not for me to divulge the details!

I think Kummel was the only thing I didn't love about my trip.

JNC Lyon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #35 on: March 14, 2010, 06:38:22 PM »
I will have to re-examine the 4th when I play at Sandwich tomorrow.  Honestly, I was a bit surprised that I did not like the 4th more.  I have read much praise about the hole.  Yet it did not excite me the way some of the other holes did.  I feel I definitely need to re-evaluate the hole.

I will probably only have time for a few golf excursions, so I am trying to narrow it down to a few key courses.

Sandwich (twice), Deal, Huntercombe, Swinley Forest, and no telling where else.  I knew once you got over there you would get your priorities in order!

What do you think of Kummel?

I mean, I thought I would only play a few times here.  It turns out that the lure of great golf is just too strong here.  60 quid for an Open Championship venue?  GCA outing at Swinley Forest?  Countless GCAers who play at Deal?  It was all too much to resist.  Now I am determined to get a full perspective on British golf.

I must say I am a fan of the Kummel.  Three or four of those things and you are done for the night.

I do indeed have an adventure planned for this week.  I will have more details tomorrow...
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2010, 06:51:21 PM »
John you sound like Scott Warren but a year ago.....and membership would only cost you £160.

Mayhugh you disappoint me, you even had the finest Kummel delivery system known to man serving you!
Cave Nil Vino

JNC Lyon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2010, 06:59:11 PM »
160 quid?  I think I could handle that...
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #38 on: March 14, 2010, 07:00:08 PM »
Yes, the 4th at Sandwich has to be a top contender for best hole on the Kent coast.  I think where Sandwich does falter is in its one-shotters.  They are not a bad lot, but the club could have done with Colt having something to say about them.  I think Sandwich is probably harder on balance, but this isn't necessarily a positive attribute.  For me, its usually the championship qualities of a course which drag it down.  Often times quirk eliminated and Sandwich has gone through a long process of reducing quirk.  Besides, for handicap play, Deal can play plenty tough - its more than enough to handle for likes me.  Deal has a much homier feel, but for its hominess it also suffers for views which Sandwich has a bit of.  To me, the thing which really separates Deal and Sandwich are the routings.  Its sounds like a small matter, but I believe it to make Sandwich clerlay the better course.  Deal is greatly hampered by its out n back routing.  I know there is precious little else that could have been done, but that merely means the site isn't the class of Sandwich, but at least many of the holes try to make up a bit of ground with true old fashioned humpty bumpty ground.   Finally, I think Deal is a good enough a course that it would make up all the ground for me on Sandwich if they stopped trying to price themselves with the big boys.  If the green fee were more reasonable I would be glad to pay it, but at £110 Deal is overs-stepping the mark - a disease which drives me away from clubs quicker than I can smoke a Cuban.    

Ciao  
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

JNC Lyon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #39 on: March 14, 2010, 07:51:50 PM »
Sandwich and quirk...I think the two have an unusual relationship.  The club seems to have done all it can to eliminate the weird holes and blind shots.  Yet the course has remained too quirky for the likes of Nicklaus and others!  I still think there is just enough quirk out there to make Sandwich endearing.  The big bunkers at the 4th, the split dune at the 5th, the hidden green on the 8th, the Suez Canal, and the 17th fairway are all quirky enough to keep Sandwich from being a cold, unrelenting test.  Yet I still wonder if the club eliminated too much quirk.  Deal's wild holes are much more exciting than those at Sandwich.  There are no greens at Sandwich like Deal's 3, 12, 16, or 17 where you want to sit around the ground all day, practicing and watching.

As for the green fee, it seems as if there are enough Deal members on GCA that you should never have to pay the full price! ;)
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #40 on: March 14, 2010, 08:39:18 PM »
RStG probably have the balance right they may hold the Open every 8 years or so but that leaves an awful lot of member days in between and members do not want a souless slog. IMO the 3rd has gone downhill over the years, I never played the old 8th and 11th but 8th is now an extremely good tough par 4. The 14th is still jury out, I like the greensite but not the tier in the green although it has mellowed. There has been some strange work on 16 reducing the depth of the Bjorn bunker and removing back right bunker. I believe 18 has been tightened with some new left fairway traps.
Cave Nil Vino

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #41 on: March 14, 2010, 08:44:56 PM »
John L,
I'm just glad you came to your senses and are making time to play.  Isn't English golf great?   Try to make a trip down to West Sussex.

Chaplin,
Sorry.  The Kummel delivery system was great, but not good enough to overcome the taste.  I'll just have to love the concept of Kummel but drink something else.

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #42 on: March 14, 2010, 08:53:37 PM »
Our Swedish members were drinking KGVs after a match against Cambridge Uni the other week, neat Kummel, Gin and Vodka....sensible head kept me well away. No wonder they were pillaging a 1000 years ago!!
Cave Nil Vino

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #43 on: March 14, 2010, 10:35:05 PM »
John L,
I'm just glad you came to your senses and are making time to play.  Isn't English golf great?   Try to make a trip down to West Sussex.

Chaplin,
Sorry.  The Kummel delivery system was great, but not good enough to overcome the taste.  I'll just have to love the concept of Kummel but drink something else.

On the other hand, my first Pimms Cup (first of many as it happened!) was well received in the clubhouse at Deal.

Is that 160 quiid the annual fee for overseas members?   Where do I sign?   ;D

Michael Whitaker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #44 on: March 15, 2010, 02:13:18 AM »
John you sound like Scott Warren but a year ago.....and membership would only cost you £160.

Tell us more about this £160 membership!!!
"Solving the paradox of proportionality is the heart of golf architecture."  - Tom Doak (11/20/05)

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #45 on: March 15, 2010, 02:56:46 AM »
As for the green fee, it seems as if there are enough Deal members on GCA that you should never have to pay the full price! ;)

John

I would rather work off my diary rather than a member's.  I am happy to pay full whack if its good value.  Deal is one of those courses that is worth seeing again and again. but the price is prohibitive.  I am sure many more golfers feel the same as me.   

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #46 on: March 15, 2010, 03:04:46 AM »
As for the green fee, it seems as if there are enough Deal members on GCA that you should never have to pay the full price! ;)

John

I would rather work off my diary rather than a member's.  I am happy to pay full whack if its good value.  Deal is one of those courses that is worth seeing again and again. but the price is prohibitive.  I am sure many more golfers feel the same as me.   

Ciao


I'm sure Mark will add more but the new club accounts show that last year there was an increase in Green Fee income and either side of an Open at RSG visitor no's are traditionally up.  Safe to say the market has spoken and that price is unlikely to drop any time soon.


The club has spent a lot of money on the course and facitlites of late and has more plans, visitor income is key to being able to realise them.


NB after a brutal winter the course is in excellent nick.
Let's make GCA grate again!

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #47 on: March 15, 2010, 05:50:51 AM »
Michael & Bill I'm affraid you have too many rings on your bones for the price quoted. Drop a few years and sign up for university and you become eligible!!

Tony is right the members have invested £1.5m in additional cash in the club over the past 5 years and retained the services of some of the best in the business. Despite the recession our numbers were exceptionally rosy in 2009 with visitor income up well in excess of the greenfee rise, a position many other clubs would like to be in. Member dues have risen by inflation plus approx 3% pa for five years so it's not just the visitor who is paying for the work.

I will leave others and the market to judge whether we are on the right track.
Cave Nil Vino

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #48 on: March 15, 2010, 10:02:58 AM »
Our Swedish members were drinking KGVs after a match against Cambridge Uni the other week, neat Kummel, Gin and Vodka....sensible head kept me well away. No wonder they were pillaging a 1000 years ago!!

That sounds dangerously like George Thorogood's classic: "One scotch, one bourbon, one beer!"

"Bartender, I'll have what the guy on the floor is drinking!"

Michael Whitaker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: So How Big of a DEAL is it?
« Reply #49 on: March 15, 2010, 11:35:37 AM »
Michael & Bill I'm affraid you have too many rings on your bones for the price quoted. Drop a few years and sign up for university and you become eligible!!

Mark,

As an overseas member at Deal I understood what you were proposing to John... just thought you should clarify the offer before the club is inundated with impossible requests!  ;)
"Solving the paradox of proportionality is the heart of golf architecture."  - Tom Doak (11/20/05)