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David Kelly

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Best Course Built in 1940s
« on: April 05, 2002, 12:18:55 AM »
A friend and I were talking about the best golf courses built by decade.  When we got to the 1940s we were stumped.  The only one I could think of that some might consider to be a great course would be Peachtree in Atlanta (which I haven't played) which I believe was designed by Jones and Jones in the late 40s.  Does anyone know of any others or am I missing an obvious one?

And before anyone says it, yes, I have heard of WWII.  :)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

TEPaul

Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2002, 03:01:38 AM »
It's good you even thought of Peachtree!

Basically in a golf architectural context the decade of the 1940s was the decade that never was!

Certainly WW2 had a lot to do with it but I think the extended severity of the Great Depression ultimately had as much to do with it. That 15-18 year span took a tremendous toll on golf architecture and existing courses too! It was the span of time that the natural evolution in architecture was broken and at the end of that span a new and vastly different "era" began.

It is sadder than we realize, I'm sure, to chronicle the plights of those that we now consider the Greats of the former "Golden Age of Architecture". Most dead and gone but the ones that survived working in antique shops, local government offices, or just retired somewhere with nothing to do, etc! Somebody should write a book about what happened to all those guys--it would probably make people cry today--might even reinspire the idea of Carpe Diem!

God knows what would have happened in the last fifty years if one RTJ jr. had not stepped to the plate the way he did. But the interesting thing and little known fact about RTJ jr is he had a very solid base of understanding and architectural principles from the "Golden Age of Architecture".

Some say although he wasn't one of the pioneers of classic architecture in America, he was one of those that helped perfect and popularize the idea of "strategic" golf design coming out of the "Golden Age"!

But even with that solid base of understanding, for a variety of reasons, he took architecture after the War, some think almost single handedly for a time, in a whole new direction without bringing along with him some of what he must have understood to be the hopes for the future of those old "Golden Agers", many of whom he knew so well and worked with in that time. Some say RTJ jr created the "Modern Age" of architecture almost by himself!

The life and times of RTJ jr himself and the evolution of his work in architecture would be a fascinating study in itself. Most people have no idea how early he got started and how long he continued!

But the 1940s was definitely the decade that never was in golf architecture!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:04 PM by -1 »

Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2002, 04:17:02 AM »
David:

Peachtree is, indeed, very special.  Since this decade didn't
produce many courses, that's a worthy candidate.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Chris_Clouser

Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2002, 04:19:46 AM »
I also think the fact that there weren't many people designing courses during that time frame made a huge difference.  People like Maxwell, Ross and Thompson were at the end of their careers and most of the other architects from the pre WWII era had passed away.  I agree with Peachtree as that is the course most often associated with ushering in the post golden age era of golf course design.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Ran Morrissett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2002, 04:30:51 AM »
Paraparaumu Beach, Turnberry, and The Dunes in Myrtle Beach.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2002, 04:45:18 AM »
Ran:

Good point about Turnberry. :)

IMHO that would be the top course from the '40's, with
Peachtree next in line.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2002, 04:48:00 AM »
Didn't the Highlands open in 1940? If that's so, there's my vote.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Scott_Burroughs

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Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2002, 08:16:04 AM »
Sean,
 
If you mean CBH, that was 1935.


Carnoustie was built in the 40's.  The 1840's.

Some of Ross' later work was in the 40's (the decade he died), such as Alamance CC, Raleigh CC (his last), and Cape Fear CC.  His muni hidden gem Mark Twain (Elmira, NY) was built in 1940.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:04 PM by -1 »

TEPaul

Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2002, 08:26:49 AM »
Chip pointed out I kept mentioning RTJ jr in my post above. I didn't mean that if RTJ jr is Rees's brother. I meant RTJ.

Or for some of you younger contributors, Rees Jones's father, who happened to be an architect too!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2002, 08:52:03 AM »
Scott - are you sure about that date? i trust you are, but just thought i would double check.

Cape Fear was built in the teens, or the 20s, at the latest. It was probably remodeled in the 40s, but not built. Under that criteria Pinehurst 2 could count as well seeing as Ross never stopped tinkering with it.  ;D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Richard_Goodale

Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2002, 09:01:08 AM »
My understanding was that Turnberry had a course prior to the War and that McKenzie's work was at least partly a "restoration."  Am I wrong?  Does anybody know anything about the pre-War Turnberry course?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

BCrosby

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Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2002, 09:26:21 AM »
I don't have my C&W handy, but wasn't the original Firestone course built in '49?

Bob
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

ChipOat

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2002, 09:27:27 AM »
There must have been a pre-Ailsa course on the site as the RAF is known to have trashed it w/runways, etc during WW2.

Need better expert to confirm but my recollection is that the current Ailsa is darn near from scratch on property that was already designated for a golf course.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Scott_Burroughs

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Best Course Built in 1940s
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2002, 10:21:24 AM »
Sean,

CBH is listed as 1935 in the GM Top 100 listing from a few years back.

You're right about Cape Fear (1926 remodel & added 7 holes, 1946 remodel), I looked in the wrong column of the Ross Society listing.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »