[Jay Flemma]

I always thought that pricing was a function of the quality of the product ?   ?    ?

What's gone wrong at Pound Ridge ?

What's gone wrong at PR was that it cost far more to build than expected - they had to dynamite a lot more than they thought - and that Mr. Wang thinks the only way to make it back is by charging a ridiculous fee and branding it as a destination resort.

Who the hell wants to take vacation in Pound Ridge?

Who the hell wants to play that course for a week straight while losing a dozen balls a day?  Pound Ridge is not a vacation spot and the course isn't that much fun to play over and over again.  There are a few great holes, but the whole isn't greater than the sum of the parts and the cost is prohibitive.

Nicklaus once said something like Pebble made him proud to be a golfer, Spyglass made him want to go fishing.  I felt the same way about PR...fun ride, but it's not the Knoll Club.

And in a recession, even rich people don't burn money needlessly.  The $1,100 on a foursome there is well spent in many other ways than a round of golf.

[Matt_Ward]

Jay:

I do agree w you -- PR does have a few hole of note -- would I call them "great" -- well, that's pushing it a bit.

The short par-4 5th is a good hole -- I also like the short par-3 15th. Yes, there's a rock slab behind the green but the approach from the tee makes the green look really tiny -- especially when the pin is pushed more to the left.

The issue w PR is that you have tight driving holes with narrow turning points -- the slightest push / pull and it's re-load city. That kind of formula can simply destroy higher handicap types and frankly only serves to diminish interest in returning.

A softening up of a few of the features at PR would go a long way -- ditto w the inclusion of tiered pricing.

[Colin Sheehan]

Just want to add my opinion. I think PR is a golf course that just shouldn't have been built in the first place. I played it last year and all I could I think was (metaphorically), if the owner, Mr. Wang, really knew how deep the water was going to be, he wouldn't have jumped into the river.

There is no way to recoup the costs associated with building it....ever. The land was expensive and extreme. As for the product, my group found no joy in the actual course, though we enjoyed each other's company. A quick straw poll had no takers on ever wanting to play it again.

Some people may think he doesn't care--he's got deep pocket--but trust me, there's not a super-rich person anywhere who enjoys taking a bath on his golf course year after year.

[Mike Sweeney]

Trivia: Name the Brooklyn Dodger who used to play Pound Ridge when it was High Ridge?

High Ridge sold off their Stamford CT 9 holes just south of the current course for housing.

http://www.nytimes.com/1997/04/27/nyregion/remembering-jackie-robinson-the-golfer.html?pagewanted=all

[Matt_Ward]

Colin:

Here's what you may want to consider -- $225 for golf has a way in turning people off -- even those who reach into their pockets for the $$ for a Pinehurst #2 or PB really develop short arms and deep pockets for a return engagement.

I think the demands can be softened to reflect a greater latitude with a number of the holes that are beyond fair.

Let me list those that would need some serious attention ...

The 2nd -- tight driving area is pinched in with bunkers left and H20 on the right -- taking out the bunkers left would not hurt the hole in any measurable way but would allow for greater width and bailout.

The 3rd -- the head-on nature of the H20 is definitely over-the-top for many players -- even the top tier players really must nail it when the prevailing south wind hits your face. The hole doesn't have many options because of the tight acreage and because the water is a direct head-on situation. The champ tee should call for a carry of no more than 225 yards and with corresponding lesser carries for the forward tee positions.

The 4th -- decent par-3 -- fine as is.

The 5th -- good short par-4 -- leave as is.

[Matt_Ward]

Continued from my last post ...

6th hole -- the dropshot par-3 is quite good but the demands to both the right and left of the green need to be softened to give players some hope of a recovery.

7th hole -- decent par-5 no need to change

8th hole -- blind approach will likely never be changed. mounding on side of fairways should be cut down to provide for recovery.

9th hole -- truly hard driving hole for most people -- should be played from shorter lengths and right side to be cleared further back to allow for bailout.

The back nine holes are where most of the issues are needed for correction if it's even possible. More to follow ...

[Patrick_Mucci]

Matt Ward,

I think PR has some very good holes.

Unfortunately, I think the bad holes overshadow the good ones

And, the constant, flanking, tall grass overshadows everything

[Matt_Ward]

The 10th hole is hurt because of the narrow passage way you are provided as the hole turns left and plunged downhill. Anything pushed to the right has no where to go except for a re-load option.

The 11th is a good par-3 -- well done and quite demanding.

The 12th is another forced hole situation -- comes back the other way and literally has the 11th tee in its sites should one push the tee ball that far. Very narrow landing area but gets away with it because of the short hole distance.

The 13th is simply way too narrow. Anything pushed or pulled off the tee is likely a reload.  The narrow landing area near the green is OK but should you pull too far left you face another lost ball situation.

The 14th is a good par-4 -- the sole issue is the mounding that needs to be cut on the right side so you can play a recovery shot from there.

I like the par-3 15th -- great short par-3 and although some bark about the rock slab behind the green I think it's fair game for the architect to use it.

The par-5 16th is a good hole - the key is deciding upon how far to hit one's second shot to avoid the bunkers nearer the green in the landing area.

#17 is a tough hole that is way too narrow and features some of the most demanding high grass left of the target. Tough green to hit as well given the usual length of approach. More width and a somewhat bigger green would have helped here big time.

The home hole is hurt by just featuring overkill to the max. The tree that blocks the fairway is just a joke -- especially when playing from the tips. The hole also has water down the left side and the green is especially narrow. I have little clue on what could have been done to make it better -- but as much as people fear the finale at TPC / Sawgrass -- that hole is child's play when compared to the torture chamber you find here.

[Mark Woodger]

in case anybody was interested in playing i received the below information from Pound Ridge this morning.

Pound Ridge Golf Club will be opening on Saturday March 20th.
(Due to winter maintenance the greens will be aerated, and we will operate under cart path only rules.)
Rates:  March 20, 2010 – April 30, 2010
-         $150 per player until 2:00pm
-         $100 per player after 2:00pm

[Mike Hendren]

Fascinating comments on a site populated by libertarians and capitalists.

What's next, residents playing the imminent domain card?

Please.

Bogey

[Matt_Ward]

Mark, et al:

The early rates quoted should be the ones they use for the season ahead.

PR is just too demanding and without some course adjustments I don't know if the numbers from a $$ perspective will matter much.

[Jay Flemma]

Mark, et al:

The early rates quoted should be the ones they use for the season ahead.

PR is just too demanding and without some course adjustments I don't know if the numbers from a $$ perspective will matter much.

When you say "Should" is that "should" as in a recommendation?  Or "should" as in "will be going forward?"

[Jason McNamara]

What's next, residents playing the imminent domain card?

Is that a pace-of-play issue?  "I must be home in 4 hours because my wife says so!"

 

[Jay Flemma]

Imminent Domain?! Yeah, that's where  If you don't get home in time, your wife gets to take your MEMBERship away

[Mike Hendren]

Jason, yes: domain, any moment now.

[Matt_Ward]

Even with the lower fees -- the course will easily make up for that with the amt of balls lost for most players.

[Tim Nugent]

Imminent Domain?! Yeah, that's where  If you don't get home in time, your wife gets to take your MEMBERship away

Jay - LOL

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