Swinley Forest in winter - some thoughts and pics

[Scott Warren]

For a proper course tour, see: John Mayhugh's excellent thread

They say if you walk off the 18th green and want to head straight back to the 1st tee, you've just played a very good course. So what does it say that I walked from the 36th hole of the day thinking that if I headed back to the 1st tee I might get manage another two or three holes before darkness fell?

Swinley Forest is simply a special place in golf. If religions have cathedrals, mosques and synagogues to celebrate their traditions and faith, golf has courses and clubs like Swinley Forest. If the Old Course at St Andrews is the St Peter's Basilica of golf, then Swinley Forest is Sainte-Chapelle: smaller, less well-known, but no less spiritual.

Below: the 4th and 5th


Harry Colt's course might not look daunting at 6019 yards (5504m) with a par of 68, but a brilliant set of par threes (probably the best I have ever played), a mixture of par fours measuring between 285 and 455 yards (the shortest and longest played back-to-back at the 11th and 12th) and some wonderful greens combine to thrill and test the golfer in equal measure.

Among the course's many strengths is the fact that the similar holes are spaced perfectly: long par fours at the 6th, 9th, 12th and 15th; par fours with a downhill tee shot and uphill approach at the 1st, 9th and 18th; holes along flat ground at the 3rd, 6th, 11th, 14th and 16th; par threes at the 4th, 8th, 10th, 13th and 17th.

Below: the 13th and 14th (heading to the left of the shot)


Ample heather provides a penalty for missed fairways, and while many holes are isolated in their own corridor through the towering pines, the trees rarely interfere with play. Yet despite the fact the course is carved through a forest, there are many wide open vistas to be enjoyed from high the high points on the site.

The bunkering is also a masterstroke, from those short of the 7th and 10th greens that cause distance gauging issues to the fairway bunker at the 1st that obscures your view of the green and on to the severity of those on many of the par threes.

Below: From the driving zone, it appears the 7th green is just behind the bunker...


... when in fact there is 60 yards or more between them


As well as the fantastic and at times downright cruel sand bunkers, Colt's beloved grass bunkers are also well used here - as at Canterbury and Royal Wimbledon - ranging from narrow, snaking channels to large "bathtubs". The course also draws on some unconventional hazards in the form of narrow heather-clad ridges set perpendicular to the line of play at the 7th, 9th and 15th.

Below: A heather-covered ridge crossing the 15th about 80 yards short of the green


Below: A snaking grass bunker left of the 2nd green


While a glance at the scorecard shows some similar distances on certain holes (the 2nd, 14th and 18th all measure within two yards of each other and the 6th, 9th and 16th have less than 20 yards separating them), Colt's routing of the course up, down and across the rolling slopes ensures each has its own character and challenge.

The 12th and 15th holes - at 455 and 450 yards (uphill) - are two of the best half-par holes you will ever play, with two of the trickiest sloping greens on the course.

The variety of the par fours is a real strength of Swinley Forest, but it's the one-shotters that steal much of the glory: the Redan 4th with its left side defended by caverns of sand, the 8th - played to a green set beside a fearsome 15-foot slope that somehow tempts you to flirt with it, the 205-yard 10th over a valley of heather to a hogback green boasting some vicious pin positions, the drop-shot 13th defended in front by sand to catch the golfer who underclubs and - perhaps best of them all - the wonderful 170-yard 17th, with its pulpit green and deep bunkers.

Below: the 17th


They combine to call for a range of shotmaking skills, with greens that can be approached wisely by a golfer happy to play short or wide of the green in the right place and try for an up-and-down par.

I commented as we were ushered from the clubhouse at closing time: "I'm like a kid at his friend's birthday party, who doesn't want to go home, even though it's over!" You can have your modern 7000-yard par 72 "championship" courses: Swinley Forest is golf as it was meant to be played.

[jonathan_becker]

Scott,

Thanks for the photos.  Well done.

I've never been to England, but if this is the standard look of your courses in the middle of winter, then I am very impressed.  In the other thread when you said you were going to post photos today, I never expected the playing conditions to look this good. 

If I hadn't know that you guys played there the other day, you could have told me that these pics were from the middle of summer and I would've believed it. 

How fast was the course playing?

[Eric Smith]

Where are the satyrs?   Seriously this place looks almost storybook (in my mind anyway.)  Love the look of it.

Great pictures Scott.

[Anthony Gray]

Where are the satyrs?   Seriously this place looks almost storybook (in my mind anyway.)  Love the look of it.

Great pictures Scott.

  I could not agee more. Love the isolation. If accomodations are close is there another place in the world that woulkd provide that much relaxation?

  Anthony

[Tom Birkert]

Scott,

Is there a rain filter built in to your camera?!

Sadly I don't think any course could have played firm and fast given the rain that was hammering down. That the course was playable at all is testament to the quick draining soil. Most courses would have been closed.

[Scott Warren]

If I hadn't know that you guys played there the other day, you could have told me that these pics were from the middle of summer and I would've believed it. 

How fast was the course playing?

The course was a wet due to heavy rain, so green surrounds weren't really ripe for the bump'n'run, but the greens remained pretty quick despite the rain, with false fronts and tiers still doing their job rolling the ball everywhere you didn't want it to go, rather than letting the ball hang up on the slopes.

Swinley has more pine than a lot of other English courses I've played, so while most trees here are deciduous, the evergreen pines make Swinley look a bit different to other courses in winter.

Tom: I took most of those towards the end of the first round and during the afternoon round. I said early in the day that I wouldn't bother with pics because of the rain, but still ended up with 90 shots from the day!

The great thing about my camera is that it's waterproof. So even when it's pouring, I can just leave it in a pocket ready to grap quickly when I see a shot I like.

I agree re: the draining. It was amazing how much standing water had disappeared while we ate lunch, despite a little shower then.

[Adam Russell]

Unbelievable contrast to the seasons! The contrast and textures really make the holes and contours pop. One of the only times I've seen a course look better in winter than peak season.

[John Mayhugh]

Scott,
I'm really glad I posted my photos before your comments, because otherwise I wouldn't have wanted to be compared to you.  Great job encapsulating what a round at Swinley is about.  The Sainte-Chapelle comparison is perfect.

[James Boon]

They say if you walk off the 18th green and want to head straight back to the 1st tee, you've just played a very good course. So what does it say that I walked from the 36th hole of the day thinking that if I headed back to the 1st tee I might get manage another two or three holes before darkness fell?

It says that they were lucky enough not to be last out and probably didn't have a 2 and a half hour drive home ahead of them!  

Joking aside, great pics for such a miserable day, and some great observations of what makes Swinley Forest such a special place.

I'll post some of my pics shortly when I've got them onto Photobucket.

Cheers,

James

[James Boon]

I cant really add anything new regarding Swinley Forest, other than to echo what John, Scott and many others have already said about this fantastic course! But here are a few extra pictures and observations from a rather wet day…

Colt created plenty of great vistas at Swinley Forest. Here is the view from the 2nd fairway, back down the 1st hole


or looking back down the 15th from the 16th green, complete with bench for relaxing (not on this day though) and bowl for your 4 legged friend to drink from


As on many of Colt's courses the par 3s are a great collection. Here is the 8th, showing the bank off to the right


The greens have a great mix of subtle contours and bold false fronts or slopes. Here is the 15th green


Or the 18th seen from the 1st tee


Colts use of the existing paths across the forest as hazards is very effective. This is the ridge short of the 6th green. The approach is from the right, with the green on the left and you can see how the ridge of the path or track creates a good bank to build the bunkers into and also a tricky little dip short of the green


The heather covered ridge Scott mentions on 15 is actually also the side of a track running across the course, and the drop off to the right of the 17th is another track.


Scott has already mentioned the grass bunkers like this one on the 2nd (photo chosen to show the standing water on the greens)


Or this one to the right of the 9th seen from behind the green. You can’t see this one from the fairway and with such a sharp dogleg if you aren’t brave enough on your approach or you block one a little this is where you will end up

Other quirky features include this ditch / cops mound to the right of the second


and the private driveway to the nearby houses that runs behind the 18th green, that plays as an integral part of the course leaving an interesting downhill putt (did anybody mention it was raining by the way?) 


Cheers,

James

[Kevin Pallier]

Thanks for the photos guys - one can never get enough of Swinley Forest !!

The course looks in pretty good nick despite all the weather reports that I've heard from the 'old dart' this winter ?

[Mark Chaplin]

Tom - to be honest the front nine in he morning wasn't playable, the greens were pretty flooded.

[Mark Pearce]

Tom - to be honest the front nine in he morning wasn't playable, the greens were pretty flooded.

Mark,

We probably went off 1hr 20 minutes behind you (there was a 30 minute gap between 1st and 2nd groups!) and the greens were fine on the front 9.  The fairways held water (but were always playable) but I was impressed how quickly the greens drained.  Who needs USGA spec?

[Scott Warren]

Mark P: There was also a squeegy crew helpfully following us around the course so the rest of you would get better greens

[Gareth Williams]

Tom - to be honest the front nine in he morning wasn't playable, the greens were pretty flooded.

As you were in the first group Mark I guess you were bound to see the worst of the standing water on the greens. To be fair by the time the rest went out the greens were all pretty clear with just the odd patch of water that you could negotiate over or drop to the side of.

I know that plenty of other local courses would have been closed on Tuesday with those conditions and as Tom rightly said it is testament to the turf and the green keeping staff that Swinley was presented so well.

[Sean_A]

Fine pix gentleman.  Though I believe they hide how wet it really was out there.  I think the course was just about playable and very awkward because of the wet.  The fairways were squiggy and difficult to get clean shots off.  Many chips just stopped dead. Lets put it this way, not many people would have been happy with a comp card in their hand given the conditions.   

Does anybody wonder why Colt didn't get a really good par 5 out of this property?  Okay, the 5th has been mucked with and it is not very attractive to look at from the tee, but the hole isn't special anyway. 

The 8th, did anybody else find this hole perplexing?  There is something bout the angle, shape and mounding which makes people go right?  I even tried to hit the fat rear part of the green and failed miserably.

Ciao

[Scott Warren]

I agree re: the 8th, Sean.

Is it that the severity of the slope is partially obscured from the tee?
Is it the mounds left that looks like an awkward place to chip from?

[Mark Pearce]

I think it's simply that it is very difficult to look at a pin only 130 yards away and make yourself play away from it.

I don't agree regarding the conditions, by the way.  I may have played poorly in the morning but I don't recall wetness being a problem, other than it being very soft around the green, and a couple of chips skidding on, rather than grabbing.  In the afternoon I was in an area of standing water in the 15th fairway but the nearest relief was unattractive (and yards away), so played my shot as it lay and was surprised how clean contact the wet fairway provided.

I have real reservations about how heathland courses drain and hate wet, sloppy, muddy fairways but was very pleasantly surprised.  Perhaps, having arrived around the water course that the M25 had turned into, I just had low expectations?

[JNC Lyon]

Good pics Scott and James.  James, I did not notice a few of those features you pointed out.  I am especially intrigued by Colt's integration of the existing walking path on the Sixth.  The Sixth was one of my least favorite holes on the course.  However, if I examined this feature again, I believe I would appreciate it much more.

As far as the wetness goes, I did not think it was bad at all.  The greens were on the slow side, but they needed to be with some of the pin placements.  I could not imagine putting on the greens on 1 or 7 at higher speeds.  Additionally, the greens were very true.  Putts were rolling well, and it was not impossible to make a few.

The fairways were a little soft, but they still allowed for the bump and run.  I played a 8-iron chip shot into several greens with no problem.  I never had problems with mud in the fairway and played the ball down the whole day.  That being said, many of the holes at Swinley would be much more fun in dry conditions.  The approach to the 12th was very wet and boring on Tuesday, whereas I imagine it would be the most exciting approach shot on the course in dry weather.

Overall, I was really impressed by Swinley Forest.  No part of the course, with the exception of the 15th green, is really dramatic or bold.  However, I cannot find anything wrong with the course.  The indifferent holes (1, 5, 6 come to mind) were still solid golf holes.  At the end of the day, Swinley is a collection of solid holes that add up to a nearly perfect layout.  It would be an ideal course to play every day.

I have played two great courses in England thus far: Royal St. George's and Swinley Forest.  RSG has more "all-world" holes and thrilling architecture.  However, I feel that I have to play Swinley Forest again at the end of my semester.  I did not get that feeling with Royal St. George's.  To me, that makes Swinley Forest the more timeless and more desirable layout.

[Dan Boerger]

A beautiful course anytime of the year, but I was fortunate enough to play it with the Rhododendrons in full bloom and it was jaw dropping in places.

[Sean_A]

A beautiful course anytime of the year, but I was fortunate enough to play it with the Rhododendrons in full bloom and it was jaw dropping in places.

Speaking of rhodos..did folks notice how close that bank of rhodos was to the 7th green?  What is that all about?  Surely there has to be a better way to protect those on the 13th tee.

Ciao

[Mark Pearce]

Sean,

I think they're a great hazard.  How many balls are left short in the front right bunker and how many players face a scary chip from left of the green, towards them, because a golfer knew he had to avoid the risk of losing a ball in there?  I don't actually think they protect the 13th tee at all, that's a little before the green, isn't it?

[Scott Warren]

I thought so, Mark. I'd have said they protect the 12th green more than the 13th tee.

[Sean_A]

Sean,

I think they're a great hazard.  How many balls are left short in the front right bunker and how many players face a scary chip from left of the green, towards them, because a golfer knew he had to avoid the risk of losing a ball in there?  I don't actually think they protect the 13th tee at all, that's a little before the green, isn't it?

Mark

My problem with the rhodos is there is no play out of them.  The approach is also obscured with the land feeding that way.  You can't see where it enters the rhodos and so there is fooling around for a drop (assuming the ball is found) or go back - it slows everything down when another hazard could be used to make the point.  No, rhodos don't do it for me - just as gorse doesn't that close to play.  In fact, these are two of the worst hazards I can think of - even worse than long rough.  Finally, most of the year its just a green wall which adds nothing in terms of texture.  Blah.

Ciao

[Mark Chaplin]

Swinley without rhodos would be like a blonde without breasts.