The two trees on # 18 at Pebble Beach

[John Blain]

What is the general opinion out there about the two trees on the right side of the fairway in the landing area on the 18th hole of Pebble Beach? Good idea or Bad idea? It just seems like a strange place to have two trees, after all it's not the easiest driving hole and you sure can't bail left! Seems like you could pipe one onto the right side of the fairway and end up with nothing.I know the game isn't always meant to be fair but it just seems a little contrived.

I have a feeling if any other course did this it would likely get a lot of criticism but since it's PB they get the hall pass.

Thoughts?

-John

[Adam Clayman]

You get nothing is where your premise is inaccurate.

There's tons of ways to play under and or around. The player who gets stuck directly behind the tree within the tree well, can even get a club on their ball to make a stroke.

There's a ton of width out there and the trees in question only affect those who bail a little too much right. Fair hazard, and not over used at Pebble.

[Bob_Huntley]

Adam,

We know that if you are blocked out by the trees, you have hit a rotten drive and need to be punished.

Bob

[mike_beene]

John,they don't get a pass here.The one by the green and its death filled pages a few years ago.

[ChipOat]

Ah, one of my favorite pet peeves - those awful Stupid Trees on the 18th at Pebble.

I don't know how to search and paste the archives, but we've had our share of threads on this before.

As you can tell from the above, I have a strong opinion on the subject.

[paul cowley]

In the early seventies there used to be three trees there....pines btw....I used to mow around them.

Things change.

[jim_lewis]

I don't remember ever see a tree(s) that improved a hole.

[Bob_Huntley]

Stupid trees on the 18th at Pebble Beach. My God, wait till you play the 18th at Cypress Point.

Bob

[Michael Taylor]

Anybody have a tee shot of the 18th PB, or 18 CPC for that matter?

Thanks,

Pup

[ChipOat]

Bob Huntley,

Yes, #18 at CPC, as well.  That hole doesn't get on TV any more, so PB #18 takes all the heat from those of us that abhor such things.

Chip

[Wade Whitehead]

I don't remember ever see a tree(s) that improved a hole.

Jim: Have you seen a photograph of the 18th hole at Ballyhack?

WW

[Matt_Cohn]

For Pup

[Patrick Kiser]

I don't remember ever see a tree(s) that improved a hole.

12th at Stanford in the old days?

[Michael Taylor]

For Pup

Thanks Matt.

Those trees seem like a good aiming point to me. So from my perspective they should be removed.

[Jason Topp]

Did they move right with the most recent replanting or has the fairway shifted?

[Adam Clayman]

Look at how much actual width is out there. The trees are a mere fraction of the lines of play.

[Chuck Brown]

For the uninitiated (my only experience is having walked from the Lodge, down the cart path to the Beach Club, not playing the hole) can somebody just give us a brief history of the hole and its trees?

As I understand, the current trees are the third(?) effort at creating interest/hazard in that fairway.  There was originally an old pre-construction Cypress tree there, from when the course was originally built.  (Or were there two?)  Then, when that tree or pair of trees was lost to old age and/or disease, there was a stand of three pine trees planted there, to preserve the original "interest" created by the accidental location of the originals.  Then, after one or two of the second-generation pines died, they re-did the entire hole, and planted the current pair of Cypress trees, in a slightly different, deeper location.

Have I got that right?  I welcome the inevitable corrections from the GCA membership's expertise...

[Adam Clayman]

Chuck, I'm unfamiliar with the past history of those specific trees. I do recall seeing a very old photo of the hole where there was a lone short scrubby pine  (maybe a young Cypress?) on the left side of the fairway, approx. 200 out from the teeing ground, on the aggressive line. Just about where someone would aim to hit a slight fade, straight up the coastline.

I never played the course with the goal posts on #2, at that time there was only the lone tall tree on the left portion of the baranka that guarded the left half of the green. If that was an original concept, I could see where having the goal post affect also on #18, would makes some sense. 

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

I actually have no problem with trees there. It requires two incredible shots to hit green in 2. The tee shot left to theright is really not punished just made a bit more challenging. The landing area is fair and left is dead. The same with the 2nd shot.

[Jim Sweeney]

The tees do a service to the hole. Without them, the bombers would hit their seconds to the green every time. The trees make them think and hit good shots if they have a dream of going for it in two. However, the trees will rarely negatively affect the player who plays the hole as a three-shotter out of necessity.

[Erik J. Barzeski]

I'm glad I found this topic as I wanted to start a new one, but then searched again before submitting.

Though the original topic was about the two trees on the tee shot, I wanted to discuss both trees - the tee shot tree and the green side tree. (There are two images below, side by side; you may have to scroll the image laterally to see the other.)



If anyone else has thoughts on these, I'd love to read them.

[Jim Lipstate]

I remember playing no. 18 at Pebble for the first time when there were no trees present in the fairway off the drive. The old ones had to be removed and the new ones not yet in place. I was disappointed. Just didn’t seem the same hole we had watched for years on television. I was glad to see them replaced (and I am far from being a tree hugger - nickname back home is “Chainsaw Jim”).

[Tom_Doak]

The trees in the fairway landing area serve one purpose -- to make it more difficult to bail out on the tee shot, because then you might have something in your way on the second shot.  Without them, everyone would take a prudent line off the tee, and only the dumb player would ever bite off more than he could chew.


It's an awkward solution, always has been, but they do serve a purpose.


Same goes for the tree by the green.  If you don't stay left with your second [or whatever] shot, that tree could very well be in your way for the pitch to the green.  In that case, it encourages a more conservative play on the second shot, as the further up the fairway you get, the more the tree will come into play.

[MClutterbuck]

Anybody have a tee shot of the 18th PB, or 18 CPC for that matter?

Thanks,

Pup

Actually 17 at CPC is the one with trees in the middle, right? 18 is a mess of trees but on either side...

[MClutterbuck]

I don't remember ever see a tree(s) that improved a hole.

12th at Stanford in the old days?

Those are still there, right? Hated the damn trees.