News:

This discussion group is best enjoyed using Google Chrome, Firefox or Safari.


Ran Morrissett

  • Karma: +0/-0
The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« on: January 08, 2010, 01:00:07 PM »
In this national bestseller by Stieg Larsson, there is an underlying theme that the Swedish financial reporters have a responsibility to poke, prod, and analyze the numbers of big Swedish industry. In particular, a global empire run by Hans-Erik Wennerstrom got a free pass from all the business writers except the book's protagonist, who eventually exposed systematic fraud.
 
My question: is that what golf writing has missed over the past twenty years? Magazines starved for ad revenue certainly aren't in the best position to rail against advances in equipment technology or the fact that there is one (or one thousand!) too many poorly conceived golf real estate projects going up.
 
Who or where does the honest writing come from in golf? And would that have helped head off the golf real-estate bubble?

Cheers,

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2010, 01:03:21 PM »
Geoff Shackelford's writings and blog have filled that role. Lawrence Donegan's writing has a healthy dose of skepticism as well.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2010, 01:07:08 PM by David_Tepper »

Brent Hutto

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2010, 01:06:20 PM »
The pen may be mightier than the sword but it can't hold a candle (to mix metaphors) to financial expediency. I can't see how any amount of writing, talking, evangelizing, browbeating or advertising could have kept people from building golf courses with money from housing development and selling housing developments on the basis of golf courses. Just too much money to be made.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2010, 01:13:46 PM »
David,

I think Geoff acknowledges the issues he is most concerned about, and provides links to stories by others that educate us about the issues, but there is little critical analysis like what a Matt Taibbi does at Rolling Stone with his blog. There is no investigative journalism in the main golf press. What exists is for our entertainment and amusement, it does not exists to delve deeply into the issues that affect the game.

Kelly, I think that is unfortunately true of all media today.  The hard charging, find the truth investigative reporting of the past has degenerated into today's blogosphere with no fact checking or much more than opinion.

Richard Choi

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2010, 01:21:41 PM »
Who or where does the honest writing come from in golf? And would that have helped head off the golf real-estate bubble?

I think that is too much to ask. It wasn't just a golf bubble, it was real estate bubble of historic proportions. Golf course developments were just swept into it like everyone else.

When mainstream publications like NY Times, Washintong Post, Newsweek, Times, etc. all missed the boat, you can't really blame golf media for blowing it as well.

Yannick Pilon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2010, 01:26:31 PM »
These days, I find the only honest writing come from blogs or sites like this one, where people express their minds freely - sometimes poorly or with bad results, but nonetheless, honest, IMHO.  This is especially true of anything relating to golf course architecture in the media.

As a golf course architect, I find it is next to impossible to get constructive criticism of the work we do in the mainstream media.  Every new course, or every change to a golf course is often described in glowing terms by the media, no matter what is done to a course.  It's only on sites like this that we can actually get feedback that we can build on.  Even golf course architects are shy to criticize other people's work for fear of being criticized in return, even if we are probably some of the most qualified to do so.

I am so tired of reading course descriptions where the writer talks about the number of sets of tees this new course has, or the number of lakes, or the insane amount of piping that was installed for such and such reason....  What about the architecture?  Is it good, yes? No?  Why?

It is quite sad!

Thankfully, there are Ran's reviews to enjoy on this website, but they mostly describe great courses....  I would sure be interested to read a review about a middle of the road type of course.  Now that would almost be even more interesting, IMHO!!

YP
www.yannickpilongolf.com - Golf Course Architecture, Quebec, Canada

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2010, 01:27:29 PM »
The golf-specific problem as I see it is that you need a completely impartial, widely read guy like Robert Parker is to the wine trade to build up enough of a following without pandering to the industry or taking anything from it.  Unfortunately, most golfers would apparently rather wade through page after page of advertisements to get to the "How to break 100" feature than read hard hitting journalism about the state of the industry, or architecture for that matter... :'(
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Brent Hutto

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2010, 01:35:33 PM »
And frankly, how big is the constituency for "hard hitting" prose about "issues" that some of us here might feel are afflicting the game. There's barely enough golfers willing to look at pretty pictures to go around, where's the funding going to come from for publishing a bunch of mostly accusatory blah-blah-blah about how the industry has gone to hell?

Anthony Gray

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2010, 01:38:09 PM »


 When I first read the title of this thread I looked in for the photo tour.


  Sorry,could not help myself.

  Anthony


David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2010, 01:53:30 PM »
Ran -

By the way, how many of the Stieg Larsson "The Girl" books have you read? I believe he wrote 3 before he died.

Here is a review of the books in The Economist:

http://www.economist.com/books/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14743378

DT   

Eric Franzen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2010, 02:09:34 PM »
Ran -

By the way, how many of the Stieg Larsson "The Girl" books have you read? I believe he wrote 3 before he died.

Here is a review of the books in The Economist:

http://www.economist.com/books/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14743378

DT   

Yes, Stieg Larsson only wrote three books. He produced around 200 pages for a fourth book before he passed away. His family has refused a couple of lucrative offers to let other writers finish up the manuscript.

Carl Johnson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2010, 02:19:36 PM »
. . . My question: is that what golf writing has missed over the past twenty years? Magazines starved for ad revenue certainly aren't in the best position to rail against advances in equipment technology or the fact that there is one (or one thousand!) too many poorly conceived golf real estate projects going up. . . .

I think what we're looking for is a nonprofit, no-advertizing publication following the "Consumer Reports" model.  Unfortunately, I can't see a market to support it.

cary lichtenstein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2010, 02:27:50 PM »


 When I first read the title of this thread I looked in for the photo tour.


  Sorry,could not help myself.

  Anthony



Mee too
Live Jupiter, Fl, was  4 handicap, played top 100 US, top 75 World. Great memories, no longer play, 4 back surgeries. I don't miss a lot of things about golf, life is simpler with out it. I miss my 60 degree wedge shots, don't miss nasty weather, icing, back spasms. Last course I played was Augusta

Andrew Brown

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2010, 03:15:44 PM »
In this national bestseller by Stieg Larsson....

A little bit of an understatement to call it a "national bestseller" Ran. According to Wikipedia, During 2008, he was the second best-selling author in the world".

The books are very engaging for those who enjoy the genre.

BTW, the original title "Män som hatar kvinnor" in Swedish (translated to "Men Who Hate Women") is a pretty shocking title. The transformation to become "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo" is a little more PC, palatable and marketable.

Regards from Norway
 Andrew

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2010, 03:46:42 PM »
Where are the photos and where is the tattoo located?
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #15 on: January 08, 2010, 03:58:26 PM »
Ran, the real culprit is Tim Finchem.  Finchem thinks the press is nothing more than a PR arm of the PGA Tour, and looks down his nose at anyone who doesn't walk in lockstep.  For the moment, skip the issue of course design, the steroids issue and Woods's boorish behavior are more hot-button issues right now.

Just look at the recent interviews Finchem gave regarding the Tiger imbroglio.  Look at how he dodges every question about the woefully inadequate PED testing regimen and about its lack of transparency.  Look at his umbrage when guys like Ferguson, Elling, gola, and others press him for answers.  When I sit there in these interview rooms there are people asking tough questions, they just get sluffed off. 

I asked Tiger about his club slamming and swearing last year at his PGA Championship presser.  I'm hammering the Tour to bring testing and transparency up to the WADA AND USADA standard.  I'm doing my part.  Talk to Golf Channel...they're the ones who are petrified right now.
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Bryan Drennon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2010, 05:20:25 PM »
Sorry, somebody was going to do it eventually.

Bruce Katona

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2010, 05:24:56 PM »
I'm reading this book now...almost @ the end...what a great story...very entertaining.

Ken Moum

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2010, 06:12:09 PM »


 When I first read the title of this thread I looked in for the photo tour.


  Sorry,could not help myself.

  Anthony



Well, it's not a dragon, but it is a tattoo, and it's on a girl. 

And, thankfully, it's even on-topic.   ::)

Over time, the guy in the ideal position derives an advantage, and delivering him further  advantage is not worth making the rest of the players suffer at the expense of fun, variety, and ultimately cost -- Jeff Warne, 12-08-2010

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2010, 10:55:05 PM »
Back in the good old days when Bernard Darwin was as big or bigger a celebrity than the golfers he wrote about, (and Melvyn and McBride were middle aged) they were dependent on him for their celebrity and he could get access and meaningful information from them. Now, golf celebrities and "captains of industry" are of far higher than journalists that actually have to do real investigation. Sure there are big celebrities on TV news for example, but they are for the most part just reading the news of the grunt journalists. Therefore, you get pieces like the writer that took a Byron Nelson driver to a PGA tour event and got access to players that would not otherwise have given him the time of day. So he writes a total fluff piece about the so called results of the players hitting the driver. How can a journalist get any real information if he is a member of what is a very low paid, low status profession? I would suggest that the people that are pushing the money around and creating golf courses have too much power, influence, and receive too much deference for their ideas and actions. No one really "holds their feet to the fire" because of their percieved power and status.

At the time that the great depression came about, we had reached the point where newspapers (which actually influence at that time) were writing stories about how no one is worth as much money as the salaries had gone to for what the so-called leaders were earning. Look where they led the country. We have reached the point where executive salaries are as proportionally as far out of balance as they had gotten then. Look where they have led us as recently as the end of 2008.

I guess it all comes back to society forgetting what the 60s generation used to say, "question authority."

"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

AndrewB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2010, 11:07:39 PM »
David,

I think Geoff acknowledges the issues he is most concerned about, and provides links to stories by others that educate us about the issues, but there is little critical analysis like what a Matt Taibbi does at Rolling Stone with his blog. There is no investigative journalism in the main golf press. What exists is for our entertainment and amusement, it does not exists to delve deeply into the issues that affect the game.

I'm not familiar with the Rolling Stone blog you refer to, but I think Geoff's book The Future of Golf: How Golf Lost Its Way and How to Get It Back likely gets much closer to what you're asking for than his blog does.
"I think I have landed on something pretty fine."

Steve Lapper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2010, 06:50:48 AM »
David,

I think Geoff acknowledges the issues he is most concerned about, and provides links to stories by others that educate us about the issues, but there is little critical analysis like what a Matt Taibbi does at Rolling Stone with his blog. There is no investigative journalism in the main golf press. What exists is for our entertainment and amusement, it does not exists to delve deeply into the issues that affect the game.


Kelly,

   First off, my condolences for Longhorns. I did think about calling you and weaseling my way into another wager, but thought such an effort would have been contradictory with my New Year's resolution to be kinder to my fellow man. 8)

   I think you have confused Matt Taibbi with a high quality investigative journalist. No doubt he is a critical questioner and insightful commentator, but his brand of "slam first and retract later" shouldn't be mistaken for factual analysis and journalistic integrity. His recent pieces on GS and high frequency trading reveal his ability to selectively twist a series of events into a conspiratorial weave, while conveniently omitting critical facts and viable alternative explanations.

  As to Ran's larger question, the media has spent the better part of the past three decades morphing themselves away from the boundaries and ethics of critically investigative and honest journalism and into the dollar-chasing, power-seeking, fame-grabbing behavior of the subjects they are covering. They've been enabled by a slovenly and complacent populace that defines our present society.

Traditional news venues such as newspaper's, periodicals, TV and radio (with the exception of NPR to some degree) have all become measured not by the quality of their reporting or news gathering, but instead by their ad views and revenues. Such institutionalization of refined capitalistic pursuit will most always and inevitably transform the pursuit of truth into a panache of agenda-driven pacification. What is most sad, is that the Fourth Estate has few, if any, reliable critics with enough following to meaningfully effect any positive and critical change.

Only the emergence of a disruptive forces (re: blogospheres and those internet-deliver newly driven investigative agents) can effect any significant change and only once the larger population has access to and critical mass in these venues, will the seeking of the truth again carry a premium. The Tiger Woods story is a perfect example of this phenomena.


Golf, often cited as a metaphor for life, is no different. Golf journalists (read: HACKS), for the most part, traded their principles for access and profit. They ignored what they knew would challenge the hands that enabled them (see Jay's remarks about Finchem and the PGA Tour). They sought not to question the manufacturers, sponsors or developers whose dollars trickled down to their paychecks and frankly, they weren't much asked to do any differently by the audiences they served.

The golf world has provided too much pleasure to likes of otherwise critical journalists (i.e. Verdi, Murray, Anderson, et.al.) and it's too insular to allow for the likes of a Sam Smith to emerge and write a "Jordan Rules" style tome on one of it's stars. The fear of retribution, combined with the absence of monetary promise, has effectively stifled such efforts. As many others hear have already noted, Geoff Shackleford does the very best job of exploring the real issues and exposing the places where corruption of principle exists. Unfortunately he's alone....save for, from time-to-time, our own Gib Papazian ;)
The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking."--John Kenneth Galbraith

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2010, 10:27:42 AM »
As soon as I saw this thread title, I thought "follow the white rabbit" from The Matrix.  God I love that movie


Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2010, 03:52:29 PM »

 . . . Who or where does the honest writing come from in golf?

I wonder if because golf is such an escapist activity if maybe these are the personality types that tend to write about it.

  What I mean is : if their brains are wired for escapism,  they may escape from the underlying rationalities and interwoven structures of golf's effect on society.


  (Shees! What a pile of doo!     John Kirk! Richard Goodale!  Can I borrow your brains?)
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Lloyd_Cole

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2010, 11:46:43 AM »
Q - Who or where does the honest writing come from in golf? And would that have helped head off the golf real-estate bubble?

A - 1/ Shackleford, Donegan, Huggan, Clayton in Australia. RIP Dobereiner.
 
     2/ Re - real estate. No idea. Long term, is it a bad thing that it burst? I won't miss looking at MacMansions when I play.

Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back