Old Mac Stellar Review

[George_Bahto]

“A get-together of the various C.B. Macdonald clubs, also in May“

The Macdonald Cup being played at Old Macdonald this year is a great idea.

For those who do not know, the Macdonald Cup is hosted every year by one of six clubs whose courses are generally attributed to CBM as being the main architect:

National
Piping Rock
Sleepy Hollow
St. Louis
Creek
Mid Ocean

I guess because of the attention Old Macdonald has been getting, now Yale and Chicago Golf Club (both Raynor designs) are sending teams also.

Great, the more the merrier.

[Adam Clayman]

George and Tom, Thanks for the replies.

I asked because in the feature interview with Mike K., I asked the question which ODG would he like to hire if they were still alive. When the answer came back Mackenzie, I wondered why he would do the C.B homage.

Your explanations make it clear that it was a collaborative effort.

Which brings me to my next question.

Since it was team effort, are there any plans to make sure history will record and reflect the efforts of Bahto, Klien, et all? Or, is it similar to other design teams where only the names get the recognition?

[Wade Whitehead]

All I can say is that it's a privilege to eavesdrop on a conversation like this one.

WW

[Pete_Pittock]

Adam,
Tom Doak can just change the title on his book about building the courses at Bandon and add a few chapters.

John,
I'm pretty much a low track guy around the course and it is not going to be easy. There are enough contours, angles and slopes involved so a bump and run can have a low margin of error. I will be doing a lot of walking forward and inspecting before hitting some shots. Considering the Bandon courses, OM is probably the most likely to benefit from hiring a caddie in subsequent rounds.
 
 

I pretty much agree with the article. I couldn't find any real negatives about Old Macdonald in my trips around it. That puts OM a step ahead of the other courses and why I think that it will win the 'which is the best course at Bandon' debate on points rather than by knockout.

[Tom_Doak]

Adam:

It is a team effort.  I don't think you can really compartmentalize who did what, at least very effectively.  George will be the first to tell you that some guys who were not on the design team [shapers and finish guys and Ken Nice and his crew] created some really cool features without much guidance from any of us, other than "that looks cool".  And Jim Urbina came up with a lot of those things, I'm sure more of them than I know about.

The amazing thing to me is that there are a lot of architects who won't let their guys contribute like that ... and, of course, a lot more who don't mobilize that sort of talent in the field to begin with.

I am sure that Michael Robin, who's now seen the process, would say that a golf course project REALLY needs the same sort of credit roll that you see at the end of a TV show or movie, to do justice to everyone.  But the appropriate shares of any creative endeavour are hard to distribute; the only ones you'll get right are the ones that failed to take advantage of everyone's talents.

[Ronald Montesano]

This love-in just reaffirmed my faith in humanity.  Thanks, George, for dangling that tantalizer about Raynor's mystery course.  Like I'll sleep now.

[George_Bahto]

"Raynor's mystery course.  Like I'll sleep now."

hah

[Michael Robin]

Adam -

I am working on a record of sorts as I was lucky enough to be granted permission to document some of this project. Actually, it was my same feeling that there needed to be a record of this historic effort that led me to ask to do this. I think you will enjoy seeing Tom, George and Mike discuss the genesis of the project much as they described earlier in the thread. In fact, I'm finishing a little preview right now that might make its way into some of your hands in the not too distant future.

I'm hoping to have the much bigger finished project done in early summer so that all can see the cavalcade of participants that Tom alluded to. There is George Bahto describing how he was "floored" when Tom called him and told him Mr. Keiser wanted to do Macdonald; There is Brad Klein describing his participation and input re how the course will be perceived; There are Tom and Jim Urbina discussing a bunker that Brad wants added to "Punchbowl" and whether they like the idea, and then we watch them flag it in the sand and tell Brian Slawnik how they want it constructed, watch him build it, and then Tom and Jim reveal the finished product to Brad 6 months later; There is Bruce Hepner discussing the eclectic nature of the bunkers at Old Macdonald as he points out CBM's same approach while standing on the grounds at The National; There is Brian Schneider discussing the difficulty of building the 7th green with a bulldozer; There are Jonathan Reisetter, Mike McCartin and Kye Goalby discussing their different roles and particular things that they each built; There is a master class from Tom as he re-creates the actual routing of the course on a Topo; There is a section on floating and finish work from Jim that ends as he finishes the last bit of construction work on the project before seeding the 18th green, which is followed by Jim driving away with tears in his eyes as the design work is now complete; There are interviews with Ken Nice and CJ the Asst. Super. A lot of those whose work is seen in result only will get shown during process. As Tom said, it would require a Feature length credit roll to do everyone justice, but we will get to acknowledge a good chunk of them.

[Kyle Henderson]

Adam -

I am working on a record of sorts as I was lucky enough to be granted permission to document some of this project. Actually, it was my same feeling that there needed to be a record of this historic effort that lead me to ask to do this. I think you will enjoy seeing Tom, George and Mike discuss the genesis of the project much as they described earlier in the thread. In fact, I'm finishing a little preview right now that might make its way into some of your hands in the not too distant future.

I'm hoping to have the much bigger finished project done in early summer so that all can see the cavalcade of participants that Tom alluded to. There is George Bahto describing how he was "floored" when Tom called him and told him Mr. Keiser wanted to do Macdonald; There is Brad Klein describing his participation and input re how the course will be perceived; There are Tom and Jim discussing a bunker that Brad wants added to "Punchbowl" and whether they like the idea, and then we watch them flag it in the sand and tell Brian Slawnik how they want it constructed, watch him build it, and then Tom and Jim reveal the finished product to Brad 6 months later; There is Bruce Hepner discussing the eclectic nature of the bunkers at Old Macdonald as he points out CBM's same approach while standing on the grounds at The National; There is Brian Schneider discussing the difficulty of building the 7th green with a bulldoser; There are Jonathan Resieitter, Mike Martin and Kye Goalby discussing their different roles and particular things that they each built; There is a master class from Tom as he re-creates the actual routing of the course on a Topo; There is a section on floating and finish work from Jim that ends as he finishes the last bit of construction work on the project before seeding the 18th green, which is followed by Jim driving away with tears in his eyes as his design work is now complete; There are interviews with Ken Nice and CJ the Asst. Super. A lot of those whose work is seen in result only will get shown during process. As Tom said, it would require a Feature length credit roll to do everyone justice, but we will get to acknowledge a good chunk of them.

Sounds like a GCA enthusiasts dream! Thanks for the synopsis, Mr. M.R.

[Jonathan Cummings]

Here's a real poser for Brad Klein and the various rating panels.  Should Old Mac be classified as modern or classic?  There sounds like a damn good case could be made to classify it as classical.  JC

[Tim Bert]

Michael

Is the intent that the final product will be for sale, distributed on YouTube (or similar site), shared only among a relatively tight circle, produced for TV, or something else all together?

[Mike Hendren]

The course looks ideal for low trajectory play in general.

John, you're playing my song.

Happy New Year.

Mike

[Michael Robin]

Tim -

Working on a Broadcast or Cable home for the piece this year with a subsequent DVD that can get into even more detail.

[Tim Bert]

Tim -

Working on a Broadcast or Cable home for the piece this year with a subsequent DVD that can get into even more detail.

please keep us all posted.

[Morgan Clawson]

I concur.

A documentary on the creation of Old Mac would be really cool!