Can there be great architecture without great patrons?

[Ian Andrew]

“There will never be great architects or great architecture without great patrons.”
Sir Edwin Landseer Lutyens


Last night I watched a wonderful program on Frank Lloyd Wright and Darwin Martin. Darwin Martin was one of Wright’s most important patrons. He helped Wright secure his first commercial project and he later commissioned one his greatest houses. Wright was left to decide every aspect of The Martin House (which is currently being restored) right down to the furnishings and stained glass window patterns.

(As an aside: you must go there on a sunny day in the fall and see the way the stained glass pattern interacts with the surrounding foliage - it is one of the most incredible things I have ever seen.)

The opening and closing of the program features the quote from Edwin Lutyens and it got me thinking.

The last decade or two appears to have been the second Golden Age for golf architecture. This was a fantastic period of excessive wealth which brought about some impressive opportunities in unusual locations for golf architects. Without the build up of wealth, many of these great projects could not have found people to fund them or the people to fill the facilities.

We are now on the far side of that cycle and things have clearly changed. It doesn’t mean an abrupt end to the great projects since great architecture is not bound by economic cycles. For example artists like Frank Lloyd Wright built their greatest work in less than ideal times. But it theoretically does suggest that we will see far fewer great projects in the decade ahead.

Do you think Lutyens is right and we should expect fewer great clubs or courses to be built because few have the means?

Or do you think that just as many great projects will be developed by people with far lesser means that have the perseverance or ingenuity to accomplish what seems close to impossible?

[George Pazin]

I have no doubt that Ian, Tom, Mike, Gil, whomever, can build greatness for much less, given the opportunity. I just hope enough of those opportunities arise in the future. My short answer is no, everyone still needs clients, unlike many of the other arts.

Ian, I'd love to tour FLW's Falling Water with you, if you find yourself in the Burgh.

I won't clutter Ian's thread with my thoughts on the current political/economic scene.

Merry Christmas everyone, may the New Year bring you health and happiness.

[Adam Clayman]

Ian,

 Leading to the end of that cycle, (50 years) I'd classify most of the projects commercial. Wouldn't you? Those that wanted a golf course wanted it for the wrong reasons, (housing) and, others, (perhaps good patrons?) fell victim to not hiring the right man for the job. Likely  being swayed by some ignorance, and, a lot of salesmanship. Theses potentially great patrons over paid for work that turned out to be strictly commercial.

 Few great courses were built before 1994. Yes, there were some (That I've seen) that are very very good, but, fall just short of greatness. i.e. Shadow Creek Spyglass Hill, Pinon Hils, BWR etc.

 In 1998 this site helped remove the ignorance card from the equation.

So, getting to your Q, the commercialism will likely never leave us, but for the time being, the great patrons have emerged and clearly have spawned more real artists and great works.  If that creates more great patrons...We will see more great works (and have) because few have the means, and those who do have the means, don't want to waste their money on models, that are proven failures. Which is nice!

[Tom_Doak]

Ian:

The people with the means to develop great courses have not gone away ... in fact, many of them have not particularly suffered in this downturn.  However, they don't want to throw away their money, and they realize they will not so easily sell out memberships or make a windfall on a new resort project in the current economy, so they will be more cautious in what they do.

The people with lesser means are also out there, but it is a much tougher environment for them right now.  They should be VERY careful in proceeding without the proper financial backing, or they'll wind up in trouble.

There will be fewer great projects just because there will be many fewer projects, in toto.  But the standard of quality ought to go up, and there will still be some great ones.

[Matthew Mollica]

Interesting thread Ian.

I immediately think of St. Andrews Beach & Barnbougle Dunes, where the clients oviously had some money, but weren't exactly Howard Hughes. They were not overly knowledgeable about golf either, with the client knowing less winding up with the better course. Yet, both courses are gems.

However, in a recent thread on golf in China, Tom Doak said the following -

"From the limited sampling I've seen of courses in China, I really don't think anyone has yet built a course in China which belongs in a top 100 list. To tell the truth, it doesn't look like anyone has really even tried. Too many big-name designers have just mailed in designs and haven't sent anyone over there to make sure they turn out great. And I think many assume that the clients don't really know any different, which is probably sometimes the truth. It takes a great client to wind up with a great course."

MM

[Tom_Doak]

Matthew:

There is a difference between not knowing and NOT CARING.  Both of our clients in Australia really cared about building something exceptional, even if one of them forgot to pay everybody.  But those sorts are exactly the ones I was warning about in my previous post.

Coincidentally, I was reading something about golf in China in one of the latest magazines and saw a photo of a new course there by Rick Jacobson that really looked good.  The Chinese market is starting to care.

[Mac Plumart]

Guys...

I actually typed up a long reply to this thread earlier in the day, but deleted it for some reason.

I concur with what Tom said.  I look at it this way...recessions have a way of returning capital to their rightful owners.  At least that is how the saying goes. 

So, if you were pretending to be richer than you really were and were using borrowed money and leveraged yourself too much...you got hammered in this last go round.  BUT if you were really rich and were well advised on how to allocate your assets, you are fine...and in fact you might be richer on a relative basis.

With this in mind, were there is a real opportunity for a quality golf course...one will be built.  However, the get rich quick real estate flip courses won't happen as that model burned a lot of fast money guys.

Money is made and returns are the highest were capital is the scarcest.  If golf course developement dries up, then when one does come on line...it will fill the need that this delayed and pent up demand creates.  Does that make sense?

Think oil and gas...for years and years, no refineries were built and for awhile that was fine.  Oil dropped to $10 a barrel (or almost).  But then...holy cow...we realized we had a shortage of oil and gas.   BOOM!!!  Oil explodes upward in price and money is made hand over fist.  But then it goes too far and the Johnny Come to Late(ly) got hammered as oil then fell. 

This process repeats again and again.

Anyway..I'll shut up now. 

[jeffwarne]

Guys...

I actually typed up a long reply to this thread earlier in the day, but deleted it for some reason.

I concur with what Tom said.  I look at it this way...recessions have a way of returning capital to their rightful owners.  At least that is how the saying goes. 

So, if you were pretending to be richer than you really were and were using borrowed money and leveraged yourself too much...you got hammered in this last go round.  BUT if you were really rich and were well advised on how to allocate your assets, you are fine...and in fact you might be richer on a relative basis.

With this in mind, were there is a real opportunity for a quality golf course...one will be built.  However, the get rich quick real estate flip courses won't happen as that model burned a lot of fast money guys.

Money is made and returns are the highest were capital is the scarcest.  If golf course developement dries up, then when one does come on line...it will fill the need that this delayed and pent up demand creates.  Does that make sense?

Think oil and gas...for years and years, no refineries were built and for awhile that was fine.  Oil dropped to $10 a barrel (or almost).  But then...holy cow...we realized we had a shortage of oil and gas.   BOOM!!!  Oil explodes upward in price and money is made hand over fist.  But then it goes too far and the Johnny Come to Late(ly) got hammered as oil then fell. 

This process repeats again and again.

Anyway..I'll shut up now. 

Mac,
There aren't scores of people who grew up thinking about how cool it would be to own a refinery one day.
Owning a refinery can be an attractive as a way to make money particularly during boom times, no other reason.
I know a gentleman who bought a refinery for $41 million , then sold it two years later for $800 million.

There's always someone out there rich enough to develop a golf course that the supply/demand equation doesn't require and will never make money.
There will rarely be "a need" for new golf projects as the desire to own and develop one tends to outpace the economic reality(despite what foolish bankers may've been sold on)
New projects will just survive at the expense of other existing golf projects.

[George Pazin]

Does anyone know what the relative golf course creation rates are for the US versus other countries?

[Melvyn Morrow]

Now George, you should know better, what a question. Thank you.

Are you referring to golf courses i.e. walking or amusement/recreational parks that allow Cartballing or something akin to golf with the aid of carts? 

You cannot just generalise when you mention the great Game of Golf, you know that game has for centuries been played by only walking the course.

It’s the Festive Season, so I thought you might have made an error meaning the amount of courses that allow carts to water down the effect of playing the game of golf.

Oops have I said the wrong thing again, the sooner these carts are removed the sooner we get back to playing the game called GOLF and I do not have to mention carts, cart tracks etc.

Merry Christmas and a Prosperous New Year

Melvyn