[Eric Smith]

One thing modern American golf courses need imo are more rumpled fairways!  There is just not enough of this feature in the courses that I see. 

Of course a great piece of land with natural rumple is to be desired, but even without natural rumple some course architects know how to build it to look natural and that is really an awesome thing to see (and to play!).

My question to you guys that have done it (who do it), how do you build the rumple?  I picture in my mind the sandbox type of how, but I am more interested in the real nuts and bolts, hey its a slow news day  .  Is the material more than fill dirt, do you or could you bury rocks all over the place and then smooth over with fill and topsoil?  Any and all examples and stories are appreciated!

I googled rumpled fairways and this really cool picture came up from Will Smith's blog:



Will, where is this?  The sandless pit  (lots of rumple just beyond) looks totally awesome and is a definite type of feature I would like to see more of.

Thanks!

[Tony Ristola]

One thing modern American golf courses need imo are more rumpled fairways!  There is just not enough of this feature in the courses that I see. 

Of course a great piece of land with natural rumple is to be desired, but even without natural rumple some course architects know how to build it to look natural and that is really an awesome thing to see (and to play!).

My question to you guys that have done it (who do it), how do you build the rumple?  I picture in my mind the sandbox type of how, but I am more interested in the real nuts and bolts, hey its a slow news day  .  Is the material more than fill dirt, do you or could you bury rocks all over the place and then smooth over with fill and topsoil?  Any and all examples and stories are appreciated!

I googled rumpled fairways and this really cool picture came up from Will Smith's blog:



Will, where is this?  The sandless pit  (lots of rumple just beyond) looks totally awesome and is a definite type of feature I would like to see more of.

Thanks!

Less polishing, and using smaller equipment.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Eric,

I couldn't agree more with you.

Flat, boring fairways are one of my pet peeves.

This makes # 14 at NGLA one of my favorite holes.

At my home club in NJ, the 13th hole has a wonderfully uneven fairway.
For 40+ years I've fought attempts to level it.

Not long ago I was playing an OLDE golf course and commented on the magnificent, undulating, uneven fairways.
I commented to my host and others that if this course was built today, the fairways would be pretty flat, depriving the hole and the course of its unique character.

While drainage has to be considered,, and water moved, there's something special about undulating fairways that produce varied lies.

[Bill_McBride]

There are a number of sandless pits like that one at Bandon Dunes, and at the bottom of each is a metal grate.  Also at the bottom are many divots as these pits tend to gather shots that come nearby.  Is this a good thing or a bad thing?

[Sean_A]

I am waiting for the day when archies blow the hell out of a dull, lifeless, treeless piece of property than go in search of what turns up for good golf.  This is probably the only model left that hasn't been tried and I fail to understand why -that is - if archies truly believe that the random landform is the best to create golf from.  Personally, I have my doubts about this idea in that I think many archies think they can out-random nature.  I think most archies want to imprint their footprint in the land regardless of their stated beliefs are concerning what works best for golf.

Ciao

[RJ_Daley]

I think that if the archie doesn't know for certain how to efficiently drain or slope and move the water then the rumple should never be considered, because it will not only look silly, it will play silly from soggy bottom to desicated crests of humps.  The rumpled FWs are fun, and have their place.  But, forcing them is a waste of time, IMHO.  It makes the mowing much harder.  I'd rather see sweeping long graded slopes to speed slots and favored shelves and such on land that don't favor the physical compatibility for rumples. 

[Jon Wiggett]

I think that if the archie doesn't know for certain how to efficiently drain or slope and move the water then the rumple should never be considered, because it will not only look silly, it will play silly from soggy bottom to desicated crests of humps.  The rumpled FWs are fun, and have their place.  But, forcing them is a waste of time, IMHO.  It makes the mowing much harder.  I'd rather see sweeping long graded slopes to speed slots and favored shelves and such on land that don't favor the physical compatibility for rumples. 

Spoken like a true grass sward specialist RJ The question you need to ask yourself is, is greenkeeping primarily about producing the perfect sward (what ever that is) or about presenting the course in way that will be most interesting to play. Sweeping long grades make it easier to produce a perfect sward (and are easier to mow) but usually lead to dull golf courses IMHO.

[Adrian_Stiff]

I agree and I also think great golf course design is a combination of doing what is right to grow grass in a way economical to how the course is going to operate factored by getting the most out of the land for golf.

[Sean_A]

I think that if the archie doesn't know for certain how to efficiently drain or slope and move the water then the rumple should never be considered, because it will not only look silly, it will play silly from soggy bottom to desicated crests of humps.  

RJ

What the heck does this mean?  If the archie isn't sure...  well if he isn't sure he should get the sack.  So far as I am concerned archies are there to make the artistic elements work on a practical level.  If they can't do that they aren't much use.

Ciao   

[Adrian_Stiff]

Sean - I think, or at least how I saw it..it can be expensive to create rumped fairways on some sites that perhaps do not drain so well.
In low budget builds you cant sometimes put some of these nice features in.

[Sean_A]

Sean - I think, or at least how I saw it..it can be expensive to create rumped fairways on some sites that perhaps do not drain so well.
In low budget builds you cant sometimes put some of these nice features in.

Adrian

If we are talking about low budget builds that doesn't often coincide with building rumpled fairways - which is what the thread is about. 

Ciao

[Adrian_Stiff]

Sean it could if your soils were right..a D6 can do wonders for £350 per day.

[Eric Smith]

Less polishing, and using smaller equipment.

Thanks Tony.  I just finished reading your blog about your project in Poland, what incredible looking work you've done there Tony, just incredible!  One photo in particular showed some nice rumple in the fairway and I was delighted to read the following:

"No plans were used to create one of these contours, they simply evolved while sitting on the bulldozer. Every roll and hollow, hump and bump is man made."

You do rumple well (and by the look of it, many other things.)

I look forward to the rest of your thread.

[Sean_A]

Sean it could if your soils were right..a D6 can do wonders for £350 per day.

Adrian

Point me in the direction of the modern low budget course that rocks on the creating rumpled fairways side of things. Not many exist and I have to ask why.

Ciao

[Rick Sides]

Pat,
Where is your home course in NJ?

[Adrian_Stiff]

Sean it could if your soils were right..a D6 can do wonders for £350 per day.

Adrian

Point me in the direction of the modern low budget course that rocks on the creating rumpled fairways side of things. Not many exist and I have to ask why.

Ciao

We just did one where we put a fair bit of rumple into about 6 of the holes. Any site with : Sandy soils, chalky subsoils and landfill sites.

[Mark Pearce]

Sean,

Have you played Alwoodley?  I ask because it (like my home club, The Northumberland) is built on land which was previously given over to rig and furrow agriculture.  Both courses have fairways with even, undulating fairways, almost like neatly tucked curtains.  Both (but particularly Alwoodley) play wonderfully as a result.  It sure as hell isn't, and doesn't look, natural but it's great golf.  These arte built, rumpled fairways.  They look and are completely artificial (as in not natural).  They were not "built" for golf and no-one would contemplate landscaping a golf course in such an obviously artificial manner but both work well.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Wasn't it Tony Ristola who years ago said he took USGS type topo maps, reduced the contour interval, and used that as a grading guide?

Rumples don't occure everywhere in nature....

[cary lichtenstein]

Eric:

The best rumpled fairways I have ever played on are in Cape Breton, HIghland Links, great golf course.

[Patrick_Mucci]

The Country Club of Fairfield, a wonderful old golf course has a few very nice rumpled fairways, some subtle, some less so.
# 10 comes to mind as having a very rumpled fairway, especially in the second shot zone.

Shinnecock has those spectacular ribbon fairways that undulate and turn.
There, the rumpling is very pronounced.
I've often commented, that if built today, those wonderful undulating fairways would probably be flattened to accomodate the "more fair" crowd.

[Eric Smith]

The Country Club of Fairfield, a wonderful old golf course has a few very nice rumpled fairways, some subtle, some less so.
# 10 comes to mind as having a very rumpled fairway, especially in the second shot zone.

Shinnecock has those spectacular ribbon fairways that undulate and turn.
There, the rumpling is very pronounced.
I've often commented, that if built today, those wonderful undulating fairways would probably be flattened to accomodate the "more fair" crowd.

Pat,

A friend commented to me after playing a recently opened course in Scotland that even though there was definitely plenty of rumple built in and around the approaches and greens, the absence of the same rumple in the fairways kind of stood out to him.  Perhaps an example of designing to accomodate the "more fair" crowd?

[Adam Clayman]

Notice the tie ins?

[Kirk Gill]

Geez, Adam. That picture.....which the course apparently presented with pride......is just hideous. I'm sure that those rumpled fairways, echoing as they do the mountains beyond......are considered beautiful by some. I'm sure there's some fun lies to be had out there......and somewhere, somehow, there MUST be someone who considers that waterfall rock thang to be something other than scar tissue upon the land, but........wow. That picture gives rumple a bad name !

[Anthony Gray]

  I love the rumpled fairway. Give me different! Give me spice! Great topic Eric.

  Anthony

[Jim_Kennedy]

Eric,
Not everyone liked rumpled fairways in the good old days: 

http://tinyurl.com/yf7ov4a

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