[Bill_McBride]

I want to be able to find my ball instead of reloading if my first shot of the day is a bad one.

I really loved Black Mesa.  I really hated the first hole.  It has a blind tee shot over water and a hill and a fairway that runs out quickly.  I can say unequivically that my recent buddies trip there got off on the wrong foot because two of us lost our balls on the first shot.  One guy lost two balls and was pissy for the next 8 holes.  Apparently, he missed the sign near the clubhouse.



Picture from Thomas Patterson's thread

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,40087.0/



PIcture from Jason Topp's thread

Sean, did nobody look at the yardage guide?  That's a HUGE fairway and not a long shot , at least from the middle tees.   I don't know how that many balls could be lost that quickly!  

[Ben Sims]

Thoughts on this opening hole? 

Mark,

As an opener.  I like it.  The tee shot isn't crazy demanding, and the fairway looks fairly generous.  The second shot would be much tougher if that green was shifted 40 yards downhill (to the right), so I like the green positioning as well.

But as a golf hole in general, here's what I'd change.  1) Delete the first set of fairway bunkers on the right side. 2) Move the mowing lines 10-20 yards outboard of where they are now to include the bunkers. 

Thoughts?

[Scott Henderson]

I prefer a reasonably short par 4 or 5, as an introduction and a warm-up.  Even after warming up on the range I still take a few holes to get my game (such as it is) into a rhythm - I think I need to get the legs warmed up walking up the fairway and to get the brain into the game, not just the swing.

I haven't played Black Mesa in a while, but as I recall the first hole looked scarier than it played - lost balls there should not be that frequent an event.  But then Kyle and I played it in March and the course was brown and dry.

As for mulligans, I think they should count the same everywhere - 2.

[Colin Sheehan]

I'm less concerned about the length or par, or degree of difficulty or ease. I want the hole to set the tone for the day. It should give you an idea of the course's identity. I want it to express themes that will be emblematic of the day. (You don't get a second chance to make a first impression.) The first hole can give you an big indications of those questions: what type of course is this going to be?; what type of attention to detail went into this?; do the bunkers look artful?; will the greens have some flow? were creative people involved in the creation of it? etc.

I like Yale for that reason. Hole one gives you an idea of what you're in for: big greens, contours, pits, large scale, elevation. So does the first at WF West: it says get ready for battle.

[TEPaul]

What I like for an opening hole is something short and strategically complicated somehow.

Here are a few of my favorites:

NGLA
Philadelphia CC
Torresdale Frankford
Huntingdon Valley
and even Maidstone, a hole I have come to describe as "European Amorphous"

[Scott Warren]

Do US golfers lodge - for handicap - cards from rounds in which they have taken mulligans?

Any chance of an answer to this question?

[Will MacEwen]

Do US golfers lodge - for handicap - cards from rounds in which they have taken mulligans?

Any chance of an answer to this question?

Scott - I think there are more vanity handicaps in North American than there are sandbaggers.  Even some players who post scores religiously take mulligans, rake putts, etc.  I would also say that some guys find reasons to forget to post bad scores.

That being said, most handicaps I encounter seem on the money.

[Dean Stokes]

Do US golfers lodge - for handicap - cards from rounds in which they have taken mulligans?

Any chance of an answer to this question?

Always

[Sean Eidson]

Bill -

I lost my ball because it was an awful shot - it's still up there on the hill somewhere among the native grasses.  I made bogey from my provisional anyway, so I got the way the hole was supposed to be played.  The other guy hit what looked like two decent shots that should have gone ~210 yards.  They were both right of the aiming point, but because he couldn't see where they landed, he couldn't find either in the rough.  He's a real pencil/scorecard guy and had his panties in a bunch because he made a cheating 9 on the hole after dropping in the rough.  He had broken 80 for the first time one round before and seemed determined to let his opening 9 ruin the trip for the rest of us.  So I agree...   

My home course also has a blind opening tee shot, but it's one that I'm quite comfortable with.  I think my frustration (and it was just about my only one) with the BM opening hole is that it's a destination course that you might only play a few times.  I consider myself to be a representative of the "Retail Golfer" and I think BM needs me to be excited about my trip, ready to tell all my friends and schedule a return trip.  The opening hole got us off on the wrong foot and while I'll be returning, and soon, I don't think my buddy will.  Needless to say, he's not invited on my next trip no matter where we go.

[Mark Pritchett]

Thoughts on this opening hole? 

Mark,

As an opener.  I like it.  The tee shot isn't crazy demanding, and the fairway looks fairly generous.  The second shot would be much tougher if that green was shifted 40 yards downhill (to the right), so I like the green positioning as well.

But as a golf hole in general, here's what I'd change.  1) Delete the first set of fairway bunkers on the right side. 2) Move the mowing lines 10-20 yards outboard of where they are now to include the bunkers. 

Thoughts?

Ben,

I think it is a good opening hole, plays about 400 yards from the middle tees.   I like your idea of expanding the mowing lines to include the bunkers.  Luckily, I have not been in the first set of bunkers on the right!

Mark

[Bill_McBride]

Bill -

I lost my ball because it was an awful shot - it's still up there on the hill somewhere among the native grasses.  I made bogey from my provisional anyway, so I got the way the hole was supposed to be played.  The other guy hit what looked like two decent shots that should have gone ~210 yards.  They were both right of the aiming point, but because he couldn't see where they landed, he couldn't find either in the rough.  He's a real pencil/scorecard guy and had his panties in a bunch because he made a cheating 9 on the hole after dropping in the rough.  He had broken 80 for the first time one round before and seemed determined to let his opening 9 ruin the trip for the rest of us.  So I agree...   

My home course also has a blind opening tee shot, but it's one that I'm quite comfortable with.  I think my frustration (and it was just about my only one) with the BM opening hole is that it's a destination course that you might only play a few times.  I consider myself to be a representative of the "Retail Golfer" and I think BM needs me to be excited about my trip, ready to tell all my friends and schedule a return trip.  The opening hole got us off on the wrong foot and while I'll be returning, and soon, I don't think my buddy will.  Needless to say, he's not invited on my next trip no matter where we go.

Interestingly enough, #10 was to be the original starting hole at Black Mesa.  I think it's easier to lose a ball there because it's a longish par 4 and you instinctively try to belt one off the tee, bringing the rocky slopes on both sides of the fairway into play.

[Ben Sims]

Thoughts on this opening hole? 

Mark,

As an opener.  I like it.  The tee shot isn't crazy demanding, and the fairway looks fairly generous.  The second shot would be much tougher if that green was shifted 40 yards downhill (to the right), so I like the green positioning as well.

But as a golf hole in general, here's what I'd change.  1) Delete the first set of fairway bunkers on the right side. 2) Move the mowing lines 10-20 yards outboard of where they are now to include the bunkers. 

Thoughts?

Ben,

I think it is a good opening hole, plays about 400 yards from the middle tees.   I like your idea of expanding the mowing lines to include the bunkers.  Luckily, I have not been in the first set of bunkers on the right!

Mark

Mark,

Thanks for the reply.  Where is this course?  It escapes my encyclopedic memory for golf holes.

Ben

[Mark Pritchett]

Ben,

Sage Valley in Graniteville, SC just outside of Augusta/Aiken. 

Mark

[Kenny Baer]

It looks like a decent golf hole; pretty well manicured,  white jump suits on the caddies, but the mowing lines are pretty bad.  What is the deal with those bunkers on the Right; they are literally 10-20 yds into the rough.

[Mark Pritchett]

It looks like a decent golf hole; pretty well manicured,  white jump suits on the caddies, but the mowing lines are pretty bad.  What is the deal with those bunkers on the Right; they are literally 10-20 yds into the rough.

Kenny,

They are in the rough, the tee actually is aligned with the left side of the fairway and the hole has a generous are to bailout on the right.  I am wondering if those bunkers were placed to "contain" errant tee shots from going down the slope.

Mark

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