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Randy Thompson

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Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« on: November 12, 2009, 03:34:42 PM »
I am currently in Brazil and have heard from a pretty reliable source that the Olympics could be played at Buzio golf course about two hours from Rio de Janiero. The course was designed by P.B. Dye and opened about fifteen years ago. I think he had a lot of troubles with putting together the right formula to produce a quality golfing experience. From what I have heard the owner was the biggest problem and never fully committed the resources to achieve a quality product. I know it changed ownership at least three times maybe four during the last fifteen years. It recently changed hands again and the largest construction company in Brazil now owns it and plans are being made to renovate, finish amenities and develop different forms of residential. PB has been contacted is my understanding and plans on expanding the course from its present 7400 yards to 7800 yards, I am told six million dollars will be allocated to do a front entrance, redo the golf course and clubhouse to bring up the current below par standards. I am told that have everything down on paper to make a presentation to a selection commitee of the olympics that will be making a visit as early as the next month. I have never played the course, went to Buzio on vacation once but the reviews I had heard made me lose interest in visiting the course. I am familar with a course in Savanaha, Goergia that Pete did nine holes and PB did the other nine and there was quite a contrast in the setting on the two nines and also the design styles. The honor´s course is suppose to be pretty good which he did in Tenn. and I know he just finished one or two important projects in the Dominican. My question is what does the site think of his works and courses that some of you may have played. Also there has to be a lot of politics at work and a few brand name Pro/golf architects druelling at the mouth to do a new course for the Olympics. What chance do you think Buzio has....can they entrust this to PB? More importantly.. can he deliver???
« Last Edit: November 12, 2009, 03:53:45 PM by Randy Thompson »

Mike_Young

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2009, 04:07:36 PM »
Randy,
The course you mention in Sav, Ga is probably in richmond hill right??  Ford Plantation..is the name....
P.B. has a lot of talent and is capable of doing whatever is needed.....BUT I would bet the really big boys and the PGA are all over this thing and there will end up being some over the top deal done....Finchem will fight to be in the mix as will the top 5 sigs....IMHO....
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Christoph Meister

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2009, 04:24:38 PM »
Hello Randy,

I find your Rio gossip most interesting and please keep us updated here! All information I can provide about Buzios is a scorecard, probably 2 or 3 years old. At least from looking at the pure length, distribution of par 3, 4 and 5 holes and the course rating from the championship tee the course looks better suited than Gavea..I am not sure though whether the distances on this card are given in metres or yards even though Brazil is certainly a metric country...it seems that most of the sailing events will also take place at Buzios
which is also nick-named "Brazil's St. Tropez".

An un-named expert on the German Golf Federation's Web-Site claims that the grass at Buzios is not suitale for professional tournaments, but I have no idea what sort of grass they have....maybe someone of you out there (Joel Zuckermann?) knows more about the Buzios course and project??



« Last Edit: November 12, 2009, 04:47:45 PM by Christoph Meister »
Golf's Missing Links - Continental Europe
 https://www.golfsmissinglinks.co.uk/index.php/wales-2
EAGHC European Association of
Golf Historians & Collectors
http://www.golfika.com
German Hickory Golf Society e.V.
http://www.german-hickory.com

Michael Blake

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2009, 04:51:39 PM »
What chance do you think Buzio has

Zero chance.
Too many other factors in play:  Politics, PGA Tour, Industry heavyweights, and time.

I think a new course will be built.


Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2009, 06:18:59 PM »
To all;
I beleive all South American countries are on the metric system but the golf is measured in yards. I have only come across one course that was measured in meter and do not remember where that was in South America. I heard today it measured 7400 yards and they could have done some changes since the scorecard was printed or if it is in meters..that would translate to the 7400 yards. Yes the course in Savanha was the old Ford Plantation. I agree the politicing behind the scences is most likely a mad house, I imagine two very strong forces would be the J.N. group and the other to be a potential TPC course which could mean any one of five or six heavyweights brand names (TPC with Tiger could be a strong contender but I would personally hate to see that)). As for the grass, its never in good condition in struggling projects and this course has struggled in the past but that can be over come quickly with a little know how and dollars injected. There is four nineteen Bermuda for fairways and dwarf, 328, tiff-eagle for greens and time to import some of the newer improved bermuda varieties if necessary. I think the comment was more directed to the overall presentation than the actual varieties available. Finially, zero chance is a little on the low side if they are getting the opportunity to present but agreed, the percentage has to be in the low range.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2009, 06:22:07 PM by Randy Thompson »

Ulrich Mayring

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2009, 06:36:40 PM »
I do not think they will allow any possible competitors design the course. That rules out Tiger, Ernie and a few others.

Ulrich
Golf Course Exposé (300+ courses reviewed), Golf CV (how I keep track of 'em)

Tiger_Bernhardt

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2009, 08:22:03 PM »
Mike Young nailed that one. Buzio has zero chance unless it become a very expensive Tour redo. I am surprised Paul has not volunteered to have the events played in the new Brazilian annexed part of Chicago which interesting enough  contains Beverly CC.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2009, 10:47:53 PM by Tiger_Bernhardt »

Mike_Young

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2009, 08:35:29 PM »
This is all so exciting, I am so looking forward to following the status and all the intrigue. My God, something to live for, finally, I hope beyond all hope some how Obama is involved this is just too good to be true...oh my god...

Kelly,
I was told people should not be making comparisons of  comparing ????? to Hitler etc.....Hitler got the olympics to Berlin..... ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: November 12, 2009, 11:01:43 PM by Mike_Young »
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

astavrides

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics New
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2009, 10:16:34 PM »
.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2011, 10:07:51 PM by astavrides »

Tiger_Bernhardt

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2009, 10:50:28 PM »
And all of this without Lou D chiming in. Maybe we should drift back t something we have in common like the women in Brazil or even golf architecture.

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2009, 11:04:17 PM »
Hey Astravides----I don't really do politics so I erased the name.....sorry if my humor offended you....
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Christoph Meister

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2009, 05:11:07 AM »
This is all so exciting, I am so looking forward to following the status and all the intrigue. My God, something to live for, finally, I hope beyond all hope some how Obama is involved this is just too good to be true...oh my god...

Kelly,
I was told people should not be making comparisons of  comparing Obama to Hitler etc.....Hitler got the olympics to Berlin..... ;D ;D ;D

At least he was smart eough not to let some faux golf tournament ruin it. Jessie Owens took care of that detail.

It's penetrating insight and commentary like this (or at least the sentiments that lie behind the commentary) that makes me expect and wish you both will have nothing but success in your golf course design careers. ::)  Of course, given the political leanings of the majority of monied golfers and developers, perhaps this kind of inane banter serves you well.

Hitler was never smart (contrary to Mr Obama) and there actually was a faux Golf tournament played as a post-olympic "Grosser Golfpreis der Nationen" at Baden-Baden just after the Berlin 1936 Olympics, where 7 nations participated; The USA was smart enough to turn down they invitation, German players Hellmers and von Beckerath were leading after the first day, but then England with Bentley and Thirsk won the tournament, Frnace becoming second and Germany on third place.

Pleaase find enclosed a scan of the 1936 annual German Golf Federation medal making reference to the Olympic Year and the so-called "Grosser Golfpreis der Nationen":
« Last Edit: November 13, 2009, 05:13:50 AM by Christoph Meister »
Golf's Missing Links - Continental Europe
 https://www.golfsmissinglinks.co.uk/index.php/wales-2
EAGHC European Association of
Golf Historians & Collectors
http://www.golfika.com
German Hickory Golf Society e.V.
http://www.german-hickory.com

Randy Thompson

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2009, 11:43:54 AM »
Kelly,
In this world there are govermental politics and then there are big buissness and golf politics. I was refering to the big buisiness politics that I am sure are going on. There is so much that goes on behind the scenes and sometimes even the govermental polotics enter but I was never refering to that. Did you know that Bush and Menem were friends and that is how the world cup ended up in Argentina. Also the PGA tour made some major legal errors in this tournament and were being sued by the a local muncipality and the Feds got involved and the muncipality was told to drop the case against the PGA tour. There are millions of dollars involved in what will happen in the first Olympic golf event and the PGA tour and other big buissiness will lobby to benifit. Open your eyes!!

astavrides

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics New
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2009, 12:11:44 PM »
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2011, 10:07:20 PM by astavrides »

Lou_Duran

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2009, 01:05:21 PM »
And all of this without Lou D chiming in. Maybe we should drift back t something we have in common like the women in Brazil or even golf architecture.

John Bernhardt,

Thanks for bringing me into the mix.  I seem to have a great abundance of friends like you, but I can't think of one that's as radically partisan while pretending to be above the fray.

While you and others on this site have tried to make me out to be a right-wing nutjob, to the best of my knowledge, I have never started a single political thread.  My posts delving into politics, philosophy, and economics have always been in response to socialist commentary that begged a correction of the record.  And it should be noted that it is not me who has made quite a good living at least in part through the partisan political process.

As distasteful as connections to Hitler are, it is your illustrious leader, Ms. Pelosi, who got this party started by claiming that the "Tea Baggers" (thank you President Clinton for your derision) were neo-Nazi thugs bearing swatstikas.  Of course, this is demonstrable nonsense, though the dominant media ran with it and continues to prop up this myth.

And it is curious how all of a sudden our sensibilities are so aroused.  Your friends on the left had great fun morphing Bush into Hitler's likeness, writing books and making movies on how to assasinate him, and otherwise transforming him and the office he held into something less respectable than Satan in the flesh.  Those who might have been offended were told to get thicker skin.  My, my how times have changed.

If you got this far, I can just see your head shaking- "there goes Lou D again, taking things out of context to malign my highly principled friends".  Unfortunately, there is a record and thank God (or your government if that's your deity) for modern technology.   Though you may choose to disbelieve your lying eyes, the following is a link forwarded to me by another GCAer which may be of interest.

 http://static.mgnetwork.com/rtd/slideshows/opinion/20091002joke/index.html   

But you know, John, your side's constant attempts to denigrate those of us who have a different view of how the world works is turning a lot of people off and many are fighting back.  It is not lost on some that the take-no-prisoners Chicago style Democrat political approach has considerable precedence in post-Bolshevik revolution Soviet Union.  And while Hitler certainly deserves all infamy he receives until the end of time, let's remember that compared to Stalin he was but a mere amateur (10 million killed vs. 50 million+ for Comrade Joe).

How people come to their beliefs has always fascinated me.  For example, what things in your life can shed some light on how you can seriously believe that George Bush was responsible for a poor shrimp harvest off the LA coast several years ago?  Do you remember that conversation in San Francisco?

An opinion piece in the 11/4/09 Wall Street Journal by John Steele Gordon ("Obama and the Liberal Paradigm") provides some clues.  I don't have a scanner nor would I violate copyright laws, but perhaps someone here might be able to find a link.  The bottom line, John, the American people aren't sheep, capitalists aren't wolves, and your boys sure as hell are no high-minded shepherds.     

As to the crux of this thread, I hope that Brazil finds a suitable venue, though it really doesn't need to be worldclass for golf to succeed in the Olympics.  The competition itself- void of politics- is all that is needed.  I would be more interested in learning how the teams will be picked and the medals contested.

And now I'll crawl back under the rock I came from, brood some more, and keep my rants to myself.  At least for awhile.   ;)

Bill_McBride

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2009, 01:13:28 PM »
And now I'll crawl back under the rock I came from, brood some more, and keep my rants to myself.  At least for awhile.   ;)

An A+ for that effort, Brother Duran! 

I may start reading that thread on the bunkering at National again..........

Lou_Duran

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2009, 01:32:06 PM »
Bill McBride,

Coming from a man whose brief greeting at the 2008 Dixie Cup was immediately followed with "do you know that Sarah Palin believes that man fought dinasours?" (and I initially misunderstood the verb as "f-cked"), I assume that you're endorsing my move (to beneath a rock).  Actually, there is more to "learn" there than here on occasion.  And it is much cooler too.

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2009, 05:54:42 PM »
Bill McBride,

Coming from a man whose brief greeting at the 2008 Dixie Cup was immediately followed with "do you know that Sarah Palin believes that man fought dinasours?" (and I initially misunderstood the verb as "f-cked"), I assume that you're endorsing my move (to beneath a rock).  Actually, there is more to "learn" there than here on occasion.  And it is much cooler too.

Hell, whaddya want, Lou, I gave you A+ for that rant!  No need to start another one!

Mike_Young

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2009, 09:57:20 AM »
Astavrides,

It was me not KBM that mentioned Hitler....and I have no problem mentioning Hitler...I do have a problem with people taking themselves to seriously and not being able to laugh....no where did anyone say they condoned anything re Hitler...I know people whose relatives suffered immensely under this man and I am sure you do also....actions speak much louder than words....
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

astavrides

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics New
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2009, 10:58:09 AM »
.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2011, 10:06:36 PM by astavrides »

astavrides

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2009, 11:54:09 AM »
Thanks Kelly.

Mike_Young

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Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2009, 12:41:19 PM »
Astavrides,
Also sorry if I offend....sometimes I just can't help it.  I live in one of the two most liberal towns in the south....Athens...other being chapel hill....
And I live right in the middle of it....I've got electric cars parked in the garages on both sides of me...a huge birkenstock store down the street..they call their ice cream gellato..they hate hamburgers and ....they eat organic stuff...(show me something you eat that isn't organic and I will show you a guy with a problem)..and they are trying to make our area historic....there hasn't been a republican elected in our area in years and we were the only area that Dukakis carried in the state....so I love sitting at the coffee shops around me and listening to the talks...problem is not many of the dudes get up before 10 am so I have to eat breakfast twice.....
Now you can imagine what they think of a guy that s cutting trees to design golf courses.....BUT WE ACTUALLY GET ALONG ( I gave them the Rodney King Speech ;D)  I just aggravate the hell out of them in a joking way.....they expect my jokes and I tolerate their mistakes...they will be ok one day but for now we just sort of hangout.....I even have a couple of them coming over for dinner and then we will go to the new hookah bar...they really like that....
Cheers....

so here's to looking back I'd drink a bottle of my pride and toast to change
to keep these demons off my back get these demons off my back
cause I want to shimmer I want to shine I want to radiate
I want to live I want to love I want to try and learn how not to hate
try not to hate we're born to shimmer we're born to shine
we're born to radiate we're born to live we're born to love
we're born to never hate...  Sean Mullins
« Last Edit: November 14, 2009, 12:51:19 PM by Mike_Young »
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2009, 12:50:51 PM »
Astavrides,
Also sorry if I offend....sometimes I just can't help it.  I live in one of the two most liberal towns in the south....Athens...other being chapel hill....
And I live right in the middle of it....I've got electric cars parked in the garages on both sides of me...a huge birkenstock store down the street..they call their ice cream gellato..they hate hamburgers and ....they eat organic stuff...(show me something you eat that isn't organic and I will show you a guy with a problem)..and they are trying to make our area historic....there hasn't been a republican elected in our area in years and we were the only area that Dukakis carried in the state....so I love sitting at the coffee shops around me and listening to the talks...problem is not many of the dudes get up before 10 am so I have to eat breakfast twice.....
Now you can imagine what they think of a guy that s cutting trees to design golf courses.....BUT WE ACTUALLY GET ALONG ( I gave them the Rodney King Speech ;D)  I just aggravate the hell out of them in a joking way.....they expect my jokes and I tolerate their mistakes...they will be ok one day but for now we just sort of hangout.....I even have a couple of them coming over for dinner and then we will go to the new hookah bar...they really like that....
Cheers....

That's pretty cool, using both the "sometimes I just can't help it" AND the Rodney King defenses in one post!!   ;D

Are those hookahs from Boston?

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2009, 12:59:13 PM »
Bill,
We have a brand new Hookahs bar about 300 yards from my house....all the intellectuals meet there and discuss literature while they smoke flavored tobacco and watch me eat a DQ blizzard....(they really want it but can't admit it)  I usually play along for awhile then I let them see some of my youtube favorites and they look t me like I am stupid or something....sort of like my wife who is German and constantly reminds me of their superior intellect...of course all I ever say is ...you are correct but WE WON....

heres my little song I play at the Hookah bar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hgGj8kbuRk
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Gossip from Brazil about future golf course for the olympics
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2009, 01:26:06 PM »
Bill,
We have a brand new Hookahs bar about 300 yards from my house....all the intellectuals meet there and discuss literature while they smoke flavored tobacco and watch me eat a DQ blizzard....(they really want it but can't admit it)  I usually play along for awhile then I let them see some of my youtube favorites and they look t me like I am stupid or something....sort of like my wife who is German and constantly reminds me of their superior intellect...of course all I ever say is ...you are correct but WE WON....

heres my little song I play at the Hookah bar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hgGj8kbuRk

LOL  ;D ;D  Here's another version that's fun:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzU9FgNTYrU&feature=related

Did all the rednecks leave Athens?  I think they may have moved to Pensacola!

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