[Kyle Henderson]

  Kyle,

  Your hole by hole threads really deserve more discussion. Thank you for your valued contributions to the site.


  Anthony

Perhaps I have committed some offense of which I am not aware... ? Or perhaps these courses have been discussed to death by those that have played them...  

If only the knowledge that you enjoy my efforts made them worthwhile.

[Sean_A]

The 4th hole is one of NB's unsung heroes.  Its a very good one shotter that gets lost in NB shuffle.

Ciao

[Bill_McBride]

The 4th hole is one of NB's unsung heroes.  Its a very good one shotter that gets lost in NB shuffle.

Ciao

I personally love that hole! 

(Of course the fact that I holed a bunker shot from the right side last time didn't hurt!    )

Don't we always have good thoughts about holes we birdied?

[Kyle Henderson]

The 6th hole (160 yards in length) plays over a deep bunker to large green that falls away on all sides into smaller, shallower bunkers placed at the front and rear corners on both flanks. The general tilt of the green is from back to front. Anyone willing to attack a front pin has some serious stones while rear pin locations may require 3 extra clubs.

[Scott Warren]

That pic doesn't show just how cavernous that bunker is, does it? Or am I remembering it wrong?

[Kyle Henderson]

Scott,

That bunker is indeed much deeper than it appears in my photos. This view is from the front edge of the green looking back to the tee (scroll right) and gives a little better impression of the bunkers "profundity." I actually found the North Berwick West Links particularly difficult to capture in photos, especially the famous Redan.

[Tony_Muldoon]

I am a huge fan of the West Links, BUT 5, 6 7 & ??  are just good filler material.  Its this stretch that allows people to dismiss it as just a quirky favourite.  If these holes were better then it would be both a favourite and a world beater?  I think the course needs more substance before the soufles that are to follow for it to be unasailable.

[Sean_A]

I am a huge fan of the West Links, BUT 5, 6 7 & ??  are just good filler material.  Its this stretch that allows people to dismiss it as just a quirky favourite.  If these holes were better then it would be both a favourite and a world beater?  I think the course needs more substance before the soufles that are to follow for it to be unasailable.

Tony, 5 & 6 are ok, but 7 is quite good.  In truth, I think the weak hole is #8.  It should be what it once was, a long, testing par 4.  Ok, its flat and not terribly inspired, but it flowed well with the short 7th and par 5 9th.  All that said, NB will never be unasailable.  There is just too much funk and #s 1 & 18, but by god there is a load of wonderful golf. 

Ciao

[Kyle Henderson]

Measuring 354 yards in length, the 7th hole is a simple par 4 on mostly flat terrain. A lone bunker sits on the right side of the ample fairway ~210 yards from the tee.


Things grow a bit more interesting around the green, where a burn crosses short of the green and the boundary wall draws in along the left edge of play.


Three bunkers border the right side of the green to snare skittish approaches played away from the wall (you can just make out the first bunker where the bridge meets the far bank). Otherwise, any second shot that clears the burn safely should yield par.

[Bill_McBride]

I am a huge fan of the West Links, BUT 5, 6 7 & ??  are just good filler material.  Its this stretch that allows people to dismiss it as just a quirky favourite.  If these holes were better then it would be both a favourite and a world beater?  I think the course needs more substance before the soufles that are to follow for it to be unasailable.

Tony, 5 & 6 are ok, but 7 is quite good.  In truth, I think the weak hole is #8.  It should be what it once was, a long, testing par 4.  Ok, its flat and not terribly inspired, but it flowed well with the short 7th and par 5 9th.  All that said, NB will never be unasailable.  There is just too much funk and #s 1 & 18, but by god there is a load of wonderful golf. 

Ciao

Sean, when you play the yellow visitor tees, #8 is still a long testing par 4 in the 460 yard range.  From the white medal tee it's a 485 yard par 5 with not many obstacles to a birdie.  I have never understood this dichotomy, which I think is also true of #9 at Muirfield.

[Kyle Henderson]

Bill, according to my sources, the 8th plays as long as 506 yards as a par 5. But, the visitor tees are around the 460-470 mark.

A long drive in the fairway yields this view of the approach from ~180 yards. Past the cross bunkers (running diagonally from 115 yards out on the right to 60 yards out on the left), the green is fairly open to running approaches, with the 6 bunkers near the putting surface all pushed off to the sides.


A look back at the rolling fairway from behind the 8th green. This is as far as one wanders from the sea during the round -- the 9th quickly brings one back to the shoreline.

[John Mayhugh]

That burn short of the green on the 7th wasn't very friendly to me when I played there.  That, with the wall, makes the short approach more intimidating than it should be.

[Sean_A]

Bill, according to my sources, the 8th plays as long as 506 yards as a par 5. But, the visitor tees are around the 460-470 mark.

A long drive in the fairway yields this view of the approach from ~180 yards. Past the cross bunkers (running diagonally from 115 yards out on the right to 60 yards out on the left), the green is fairly open to running approaches, with the 6 bunkers near the putting surface all pushed off to the sides.


A look back at the rolling fairway from behind the 8th green. This is as far as one wanders from the sea during the round -- the 9th quickly brings one back to the shoreline.

Bill

I recall the 8th was a par 4 when I first played it - something like 450 yards.  The last time it was a par 5 of 500ish.  I spose it makes sense to stick tees in just beyond the 7th green, but I liked the flow of a short par 4, long par 4, short par 5, par 3.  Now the there are 3 par 5s in the span of 4 holes.

Ciao

[Bill_McBride]

Bill

I recall the 8th was a par 4 when I first played it - something like 450 yards.  The last time it was a par 5 of 500ish.  I spose it makes sense to stick tees in just beyond the 7th green, but I liked the flow of a short par 4, long par 4, short par 5, par 3.  Now the there are 3 par 5s in the span of 4 holes.

Ciao

And I've never understood why the visitors should play the hole as a brute of a par 4 while the presumably better players have a short par 5 from the medal tees.  Makes no sense.   And you're right, 8, 9, 11 are par 5s in that set up.

Bult it definitely doesn't detract from the joy of a round at North Berwick either way!

[Mark Pearce]

Does it honestly matter what it says on the card?  The hole is what it is.  IMHO, by the way (and it may not be worth much) 7 is the best hole of 5-9.  I don't have the love for 9 that many seem to.

[Sean_A]

Bill

I recall the 8th was a par 4 when I first played it - something like 450 yards.  The last time it was a par 5 of 500ish.  I spose it makes sense to stick tees in just beyond the 7th green, but I liked the flow of a short par 4, long par 4, short par 5, par 3.  Now the there are 3 par 5s in the span of 4 holes.

Ciao

And I've never understood why the visitors should play the hole as a brute of a par 4 while the presumably better players have a short par 5 from the medal tees.  Makes no sense.   And you're right, 8, 9, 11 are par 5s in that set up.

Bult it definitely doesn't detract from the joy of a round at North Berwick either way!

Bill

The back tee is for all who compete in comps.  How good you are doesn't matter. 

Mark, yes it does make a difference in this case because from what was the daily tee it was quite a bit shorter than the white tee of today. 

Ciao

[Mark Pearce]

But it's still 460+ yards, whatever box you play from, and a tough par 4.5.

[Bill_McBride]

But it's still 460+ yards, whatever box you play from, and a tough par 4.5.

I know that, it's a mental thing!  I wouid probably make more 4s playing it as a par 5.

If you know what I mean.   

[Kyle Henderson]

Turning the course back to the sea, the 9th hole crosses a flat inland parcel before climbing at the very end to an elevated green benched into the seaside dunes 520 yards away.


A pair of central fairway bunkers (found 250 and 215 yards short of the green, respectively) force players to choose their line carefully from the tee. Going left will shorten the hole a bit but also brings a boundary line into play. Winds may also influence this choice considerably.


The third and final fairway bunker (scroll right to view) sits at the right edge of the rapidly narrowing fairway 100 yards short of the green, adding interest to layup shots. Three more bunkers are carved into the face of the slope leading up to the green.


Looking back from behind the green, the dogleg aspect of the hole is more obvious. Approach shots that miss the green at or beyond pin depth will leave simple recovery shots.

[Scott Warren]

Awesome golf hole!

Was it Mark P who said he doesn't care for it? Care to elaborate, Mark?

[James Boon]

Kyle,

Though I dont care for the 8th much, thats a good picture of the approach to the green with the bunkers in the lay up area. I never really managed to capture that hole in photos, maybe because the land feels flatter than everything else, even though there is actually quite a bit of subtle undulation?

Though I knew little about the front 9 holes at NB, I really liked most of it, with the exception perhaps of the 5th and 8th? Maybe neither is a really poor hole, but for me they had neither the character (or quirk or funk, call it what you will) of some of the other holes at NB, or any real feeling of being good solid golf holes. However, they dont stop NB being an awesome golfing experience!

Looking forward to the back 9!

Cheers,

James

[Mark Pearce]

Scott,

Sure.  For me it's a three shot hole, always, so there isn't a decision to make on the tee.  Why would anyone who's not going to go for it in two even think of taking the left line?  Particularly since the best place to drive it if playing it as a three shotter is right, to knock it to the left side with your second.  Then it's just an uphill pitch.  It's not a bad hole by any means, indeed it's quite a good one.  But it doesn't feel terribly linksy to me, it doesn't call for any great heroics or difficult strategic decisions (at least not for me) and it doesn't feel like as great a challenge as many of the holes that follow it.  Nor does it exude charm or quirk the way other holes at NB do.  I guess it sums up the way I feel about North Berwick.  It's a lovely course but I don't see it as the world beater so many others do.  For me it sits with a bunch of other shorter, older Scottish courses with bags of quirk and charm and a handful of really interesting holes.  I guess the question is, would 9 be called a great hole if it were on a different course.  My view is that the answer is a resounding no.  Others, of course, will differ.

I always find myself looking forward to holes to come, rather than enjoying the 9th.  It feels like a hole to get out of the way.

Mark

[Mark Alexander]

I shot North Berwick earlier this year starting at about 5am. The course looked magnificent. The undulations and shaping in the fairways were like nothing I'd seen before. I really need to get back there for sunset, which is supposed to be amazing.
Here's a link to some of my shots. Let me know what you think.

www.markalexanderphotography.co.uk/NorthBerwick

[Bill_McBride]

What Kyle's photos of #9 don't show is just how tight the left side driving area is, between the bunkers and the woods and the wall and rough over there.  Given any kind of wind, you have to be very brave to attempt a tee shot down that side.  Driving out to the right has its own challenges, as the hay is deep and a drive down that side brings all the lay up bunkers into play.

One really fun thing I learned last time came when I pushed a wedge approach far to the right side of the green -- there's enough slope there to bring the ball down into the center of the green!  Given the trouble off to the left, broken ground and rough below the green's fall off, this is a very nice safe play that pretty much assures a par and possible birdie.

I really like that hole, like the way it "T's" off the course, taking us to the excellent par 3 #10 and heading toward home.

[Stan Dodd]

I think it is a really good hole.  I think the tee shot provides challenge to shorter hitter as well as the long knocker.  I have been in the bunkers, near the wall, as well as the deep hay on the right.  The green is a real challenge particularly with a front pin.  I think it is  a great kick off to that great run for home.  Reminds me a bit of #5 at Cypress Point a fun par 5 that serves as an equalizer for the short hitter vs the long.

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