Walking in the UK versus Walking in South Carolina

[Michael Whitaker]

I returned recently from two weeks in England (Sept 12-27) where I played a LOT of golf, including the Buda Cup. I played 12 rounds of over eight days, carrying my bag every step of the way. There were five rounds on inland courses and seven on links courses.

I'm in fairly good condition for a 58 year old man and never had one problem walking and carrying my bag in the UK:  never broke a sweat... never too tired to continue... never lost my breath. The weather was exceptionally warm (for England) most of the days I played with temperatures of 75-80F (or higher!) most days.

This past Monday (October 12) I played the course at May River Golf Club near Bluffton, SC (just north of Hilton Head Island). I walked, but a caddy carried my bag. The course is easily walkable with virtually no hills to climb. The temperature was 80-85F with humidity of 85-90%. I thought I was going to die!!!

I post this only to say that sometimes it is better to ride than to walk. It was a struggle for me to finish at May River. Every three or four holes I had to rest in the shade or douse my head with water.

Those that say golf should never be played from a cart have never experienced a day like the one I experienced at May River.

I'll take a cart over walking in similar conditions every time from now on.

[Ulrich Mayring]

Those that say golf should never be played from a cart have never experienced a day like the one I experienced at May River.

I believe the argument is that golf should not be played at all in such conditions. And golf courses should not be built in places, where conditions will be like that most of the time.

If you have neither a hill, nor snow, then you shouldn't ski. You especially shouldn't build a big indoor ramp and attack it with a snow cannon ;-)

Ulrich

[Scott Warren]

Are you serious, Ulrich, or are you taking the piss out of Melvyn? I've read it both ways, and they both seem plausable...

[Dan Herrmann]

Calling Melvyn!

Michael is correct, or course.  Heat and humidity is not to ignored, especially once you're over 45 (ish) years old.

To me, the key factor is dewpoint.  Dewpoints over 70F are almost unwalkable (and even more of a factor if it's sunny or hilly).

[Ulrich Mayring]

There is no need for golf courses in uninhabitable areas, such as on the moon or in Florida

Well, maybe it would be ok to build cart ball courses and play cart ball there

Ulrich

[C. Squier]

There is no need for golf courses in uninhabitable areas, such as on the moon or in Florida

Well, maybe it would be ok to build cart ball courses and play cart ball there

Ulrich

I may very well me missing a giant dose of sarcasm....but if not, it looks like not one of the courses you've visited on your google map is as far south as South Carolina.  Are you proposing that most of the US not have golf?

[Mike_Young]

Michael H,
There is no need to discuss this subject with anyone that has not walked in such conditions....and in most cases they would cry uncle before us rednecks

[Bob Jenkins]

Mike,

I agree with your point, ie. there are some places and days when carrying is only for the young and most fit. I have carried my bag for many years but over the last few, my back does not appreciate the bag on my shoulders and it has become a problem, hence the trolley has come into use and the Sun Mountain speed cart has become my friend at home.

You referenced your day in humidity in South Carolina. We had a day like that this spring at the KP, ie. the day at Rustic Canyon. It was about 100 degrees and for much of the round, the wind was blowing down the canyon, which turned out to be more of a climb than it appeared to be at first blush. After 9 or 10 holes, I was dragging my butt, and that was with the speed cart. Tom Yost, who lives in Phoenix, was running to the ice water on some tees, filling his hat and then dumping it over his head. David Oden lives in the Los Angeles area and also was feeling the heat. Only the amazing and very fit Kyle Henderson seemed to be standing tall at the end of the day.

My only point is yes, even for someone like you who continues to carry, some days it is too much and there is nothing wrong with hopping a ride or pushing cart and still remain faithful to the principle of walking. If you are significantly overheated and tired, golf is no fun.

Hope ypu continue to be well.

Bob J

[Dan King]

Clint Squier writes:
I may very well me missing a giant dose of sarcasm....but if not, it looks like not one of the courses you've visited on your google map is as far south as South Carolina.  Are you proposing that most of the US not have golf?

Do you really need the golf course? Why not just play virtual golf? If you are going to ride around in carts, desire perfect conditions, tell distances via global positioning systems and keep stats down to the silliest little minutiae, do you really need the pain-in-the-ass of nature? Why not leave the whole nature thing to those of us that like the natural aspect of golf and just play indoors?

Cheers,
Dan King

No matter how skillfully one may lay out the holes and diversify them, nevertheless one must get the thrill of nature. . . The puny strivings of the architect do not quench our thirst for the ultimate.
 --George Thomas (Golf Architecture on America, 1927)

[Ulrich Mayring]

Clint, I have played golf in humid conditions once, on a course in Italy called Golf dei Laghi. Humidity may not have been at 100%, but it is a rather hilly course (there are some pics on my map), so I believe the challenge would be similar to playing a flat course in Florida. It was a three day tournament and on the first day I did really well until hole 12 or 13, then suddenly it hit me and my game went south. It stayed there on the following two days and I decided to not play golf again in such conditions. But I didn't take a cart

So my personal preference would be to not live in an area of high humidity, even if I weren't a golfer. Obviously, this personal preference of mine may be remarkably irrelevant for others.

It's not that I hate carts, I do occasionally take one in certain circumstances. But the real enjoyment in golf to me comes from walking.

I am not trying to convince anyone of anything, just re-iterating some of the arguments that I hear from hardcore traditional golfers.

Ulrich

[C. Squier]

Clint Squier writes:
I may very well me missing a giant dose of sarcasm....but if not, it looks like not one of the courses you've visited on your google map is as far south as South Carolina.  Are you proposing that most of the US not have golf?

Do you really need the golf course? Why not just play virtual golf? If you are going to ride around in carts, desire perfect conditions, tell distances via global positioning systems and keep stats down to the silliest little minutiae, do you really need the pain-in-the-ass of nature? Why not leave the whole nature thing to those of us that like the natural aspect of golf and just play indoors?

Cheers,
Dan King

No matter how skillfully one may lay out the holes and diversify them, nevertheless one must get the thrill of nature. . . The puny strivings of the architect do not quench our thirst for the ultimate.
 --George Thomas (Golf Architecture on America, 1927)

Lol....always love it when you take it to the absolute extremes when posed a simple question.  Thank god people don't listen to your drivel and quit the game when they can't physically walk a course any longer due to silly little things like getting older, extreme weather or other completely unavoidable factors.  How incredibly vain to tell someone who can't do what you can that they are somehow sacrilegious.

I sincerely hope your health allows you to walk and play until your last days.  

[C. Squier]

Clint, I have played golf in humid conditions once, on a course in Italy called Golf dei Laghi. Humidity may not have been at 100%, but it is a rather hilly course (there are some pics on my map), so I believe the challenge would be similar to playing a flat course in Florida. It was a three day tournament and on the first day I did really well until hole 12 or 13, then suddenly it hit me and my game went south. It stayed there on the following two days and I decided to not play golf again in such conditions. But I didn't take a cart

So my personal preference would be to not live in an area of high humidity, even if I weren't a golfer. Obviously, this personal preference of mine may be remarkably irrelevant for others.

It's not that I hate carts, I do occasionally take one in certain circumstances. But the real enjoyment in golf to me comes from walking.

I am not trying to convince anyone of anything, just re-iterating some of the arguments that I hear from hardcore traditional golfers.

Ulrich

Angera, Italy is on the latitude as the absolute most northern states in the US.  Only the states that border Canada are on the same latitude. 

With all due respect, you haven't come close to playing a course in Florida in hot, humid conditions.  Florida runs on the same line as Egypt, Saudi Arabia and India.  All slightly warmer than Italy.

[Dan King]

Clint Squier writes:
I sincerely hope your health allows you to walk and play until your last days.

Thank you.

How incredibly vain to tell someone who can't do what you can that they are somehow sacrilegious.

I don't even think sacrilegious is in my vocabulary.

So what is it you get out of nature? Especially if it is too humid to golf. Is there any specific reason you prefer playing outdoors rather than indoors? If nature is such a pain-in-the-ass, why put up with it?

Cheers,
Dan King

Golf courses are beautiful. Many people think mature men have no appreciation for beauty except in immature women. This isn't true, and anyway, we'd rather be playing golf. A golf course is a perfect example of Republican male aesthetics -- no fuzzy little flowers, no stupid ornamental shrubs, no exorbitant demands for alimony, just acre upon acre of lush green grass that somebody else has to mow.
 --P.J. O'Rourke (Men's Journal, 1992)

[Will MacEwen]

Anyone else thinking that GCA is soon going to stand for Golf Cart Arguing?

[C. Squier]

Clint Squier writes:
I sincerely hope your health allows you to walk and play until your last days.

Thank you.

How incredibly vain to tell someone who can't do what you can that they are somehow sacrilegious.

I don't even think sacrilegious is in my vocabulary.

So what is it you get out of nature? Especially if it is too humid to golf. Is there any specific reason you prefer playing outdoors rather than indoors? If nature is such a pain-in-the-ass, why put up with it?

Cheers,
Dan King

Golf courses are beautiful. Many people think mature men have no appreciation for beauty except in immature women. This isn't true, and anyway, we'd rather be playing golf. A golf course is a perfect example of Republican male aesthetics -- no fuzzy little flowers, no stupid ornamental shrubs, no exorbitant demands for alimony, just acre upon acre of lush green grass that somebody else has to mow.
 --P.J. O'Rourke (Men's Journal, 1992)

See, that's where you're jumping in at the wrong place.  I never said it was too humid for ME to play golf.  I'm young, reasonably fit and walk at every opportunity I get.  It takes a rare circumstance for me to not walk.  But at some point, the factors of age/weather/other converge where it just isn't safe to always walk.  "Enjoying" nature doesn't mean putting someone's health at risk.  That is where you hard-liners are dead wrong.  If the only way you can physically play is to take a cart, why not?  I'd let you carry me around the course before I give the game up.  

[Melvyn Morrow]

We humans get old. During that process, our bodies no longer perform as they once did, nor can it respond to our young minds, which can be a shock for some, well certainly their wives. 

Some resort to Viagra, some to push carts/trolleys, others give up and start using a cart, some decide to go cart balling in the mountains, I expect in search of the dreams from their lost youth.

Carting is not the answer, they help speed up the aging process by minimising the stress burning and fitness levels gained from walking. Suddenly your body is in decline, your youthful mind starts to slow and there you are, just another cart user glorifying in flashes of memories, which are becoming hard to recall every passing week.

But then the day is hot & humid and those carts look so much like easy work.
However, I hope you remember that CARTING CAN SERIOUSLY SHORTEN YOUR LIFE.

As for me, I see it as being so very simple, you use a cart, you step off the course in the process, so you are no longer playing golf. When refreshed you feel that you should be allowed to step back on to the course and take a shot, before again stepping off the course. By stepping off the course, you IMHO disqualified yourself from the game and therefore are not playing a game of Golf. Cart Ball it may well be but not Golf.

To all I hope you live long and with the aid of Viagra (for the over 40’s) I hope you prosper

Melvyn

PS My Clinic for Erectile Dysfunction (Kalen & Craig that has nothing to do with Florida crocodiles) is three times a week on Monday, Wednesday & Friday. Please ring for an appointment – only the best cases will be published on GCA.com (in support for my campaign to ban carts from the golf courses of the world).

[C. Squier]

Ok, so Melvyn.....you walk your entire life.  Every single round, you've never used the crutch of a cart and your body is maximized in it's use of golf making it stronger.  One day, your body just can't do it any longer.  You can't physically walk the golf course, it's impossible due to health.  But you could play if you used a cart.

What do you do?  There have to be other things you enjoy besides the act of walking while playing golf.  Hitting the shots, smelling the air, enjoying an afternoon with peers.  Surely putting one foot in front of the other isn't the only thing you enjoy.  Do you give it all up because you can't have 100% of "golf"? 

I ask this in all sincerity.  Very few people will ever not have to answer this question, most will watch their health fail at some degree.

[Steve Lang]

Anyone else thinking that GCA is soon going to stand for Golf Cart Arguing?

perfect Will!

another piss off tangent on carts versus walk-ball..  SE TX golf.. like SC or other southern USA climates can be like living in a dog's mouth.. but this weekend it was 75°F, 45% humidity after a cold front came through.. walking was a stroll in the park compared to july..

my bottom line: golf is shot making, everything in between just foreplay..

[Rob Rigg]

Guys - To each his own right?

It is a choice, everyone should make the choice that is right for them.

Some people will walk no matter what the weather or the terrain or the course (although sometimes the green to tee transfers are impossible to overcome).

Some people will take a cart no matter the weather or the terrain or the course.

While I am a very passionate walker, I would have to agree that these threads are starting to overwhelm the site.

Discussing the legitimacy of walking or riding depending on the weather, etc. can only lead us on another dark tangent.

Is it easier to walk in "ideal" conditions - yes. Is it impossible to walk if conditions are not ideal - no. Is it crazy to walk if conditions are not ideal - depends on the golfer so this thread is at a stalemate - hopefully.

[John_Conley]

I find it pretty funny that the answer for some to the walking in heat question is, "don't play."

It is hot (92, 3, or 4 for the High) and very humid (temp can't go any higher than that because of all the moisture in the air) for all of May, June, July, August, and September in Florida.  Texas, Arizona, Nevada, and the inland parts of California have a similar story to tell.

Great idea.

[Jon Heise]

Thread about walking vs carts make me want to throw up

[Mark Pearce]

I find it pretty funny that the answer for some to the walking in heat question is, "don't play."

It is hot (92, 3, or 4 for the High) and very humid (temp can't go any higher than that because of all the moisture in the air) for all of May, June, July, August, and September in Florida.  Texas, Arizona, Nevada, and the inland parts of California have a similar story to tell.

Great idea.

I don't have a dog in this fight.  However, I would point out that there are plenty of other regions where there is a 5 month closed season for golf.  Why is it stupid to suggest that those in such aggressively hot and humid climates play in the autumn, winter and spring?

[Ulrich Mayring]

Clint,

you cannot just compare latitudes and infer the climate from that. Let me assure you that the climate in Italy and Canada are very different. The area in Northern Italy, where my humid experience was, is (according to Wikipedia) classified as humid subtropical. Here is a world map that shows all regions classified humid subtropical:



Since you mentioned Egypt and Saudi Arabia - it can be mighty hot there, but it is rarely humid - in fact, these are some of the driest regions on earth. So playing golf there without a cart (but with heavy sun protection) is realistic.

So, I have to agree with Mark on the principle that from a green point of view it should not be expected to be able to play golf in every region at every time of the year.

Ulrich

[Bill_McBride]

Michael H,
There is no need to discuss this subject with anyone that has not walked in such conditions....and in most cases they would cry uncle before us rednecks

Especially us fat ass rednecks! 

Somehow I suspect neither Melvyn nor Ulrich has played in the conditions the Mikes are discussing.

[Joel Zuckerman]

Somehow I suspect neither Melvyn nor Ulrich has played in the conditions the Mikes are discussing.

I live in Savannah, Georgia, and play lots of golf in the area, and also in and around Hilton Head and Beaufort, SC.  Most of the time (85--90%) I'm walking--either with a caddie, with my bag on the back of a cart-using a buddy's golf cart, using a Sun Mtn. pull cart, or, probably half the time, carrying my own bag.  Thankfully, I have never felt light-headed, weak, or like I was "losing it" from a physical standpoint.  I will turn 49 in less than 2 weeks.

I think the answer is to get yourself in excellent shape--whether it's running, biking, tennis, lifting, whatever you enjoy.  Drop weight, increase your aerobic capacity, and you will be impervious to heat, hills, humidity, etc.  Just two weeks ago I played 45 holes--the first 18 mostly walking, with the occasional cart-ride, the last 27 with my bag on my back.  I was tired by the end of the day, but had never approached the "red zone!"

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