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Jamie Barber

Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #25 on: September 18, 2009, 09:26:25 AM »
Regardless of whether you consider it a restoration, a rebuild or something else I'm very impressed and congratulate you on getting the course up and running again. I hope it proves a success

Bruce Leland

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #26 on: September 18, 2009, 09:28:30 AM »
Wonderful stuff Ralph.  Adam, a very moving post and so well written that I felt like I climbed that dune with you.  Best wishes Gentlemen for the future of Askernish.
"The mystique of Muirfield lingers on. So does the memory of Carnoustie's foreboding. So does the scenic wonder of Turnberry and the haunting incredibility of Prestwick, and the pleasant deception of Troon. But put them altogether and St. Andrew's can play their low ball for atmosphere." Dan Jenkins

Andrew Mitchell

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #27 on: September 18, 2009, 09:50:29 AM »
Ralph

Welcome aboard.  That's an impressive slideslow.  Congratulations on all you've achieved, I hope to visit Askernish one day.
2014 to date: not actually played anywhere yet!
Still to come: Hollins Hall; Ripon City; Shipley; Perranporth; St Enodoc

Chris Flamion

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #28 on: September 18, 2009, 09:19:48 PM »
Ralph

Congrats on a beautiful piece of art out by the sea.  Askernish has been on my list since I first read about it.  Keep up the good work.

Niall C

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #29 on: September 19, 2009, 05:25:37 AM »
Ralph

Many congratulations on seeing the project through to some sort of fuition. I'm sure over time it will get even better.

Quick question and apologies if you have already answered this above, but what four greens due you think were original and are they on the slide show ?

Niall

Tom MacWood

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #30 on: September 19, 2009, 09:20:36 AM »
Ralph
I didn't see any mention of Hutchinson in those articles. Is there another source for his visit with Old Tom?

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #31 on: September 19, 2009, 09:44:15 AM »
Tom

The answer may be yes or is it that someone is making it all up to promote Old Tom? I do not understand why you want to know, perhaps you are looking to credit Horace for the original design. However, you are always trying to discredit someone else opinions or finds.  I fear that I cannot help you as I have said I will not post any more info for you.

Perhaps Ralph will assist you being the real Gentleman he is, because you will get zero from me.   

Melvyn


Jim_Kennedy

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #32 on: September 19, 2009, 06:50:48 PM »
Ralph,
Thanks for posting the info but for some reason I cannot access it. Is there another way to see it?


Thanks
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Tom MacWood

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #33 on: September 20, 2009, 09:24:25 AM »
Melvyn
No problem, but my question was addressed to Ralph not you. By the way, I have no doubt Askernish was a OTM course.

Ralph Thompson

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #34 on: September 21, 2009, 08:33:44 AM »
Hi Tom

The photos of Old Tom and Horace on the historical link came from Stornoway Golf Club where they visited after Askernish.

I spoke to the son of a gillie who was around in 1891 and his father had told him about Old Toms visit. Horace had spent nearly all the time fishing - we have the best brown trout fishing in Europe here( so I am told) and sea trout , salmon etc etc. I am still trawling through old estate records to try and find out as much as possible. I will post any further info that arises.

Link to historical files. It has been done using the latest pwerpoint ( 2007 ) so download an update and it should work.

Bunkers on the eighth.

Alan our head greenkeeper isnt happy about the way I described the bunkers. ( quite rightly) The two swales were simply stripped of turf leaving the exposed sand below. No sand was imported.

Tom MacWood

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #35 on: September 21, 2009, 10:15:51 AM »
Ralph
I cut and pasted this from their site:

Stornoway Golf Club History 1890 - 1933
We have these 2 pictures (below) hanging in the Clubhouse. Splendid oak and brass framed companion photographs of "Old" Tom Morris and Horace Hutchison. Relics from the Old Clubhouse no doubt and we can only speculate on the reason for their presence in Stornoway. But we know that Morris laid out the delightful nine hole course at Askernish in South Uist around 1890, and we like the idea of these two gentlemen, respectfully the most eminent professional and amateur golfers of their day, making a missionary journey to the Western Isles, laying out courses and trying to convert the natives of these shores to the game of golf.

 
It is as good a theory as any for the origin of Stornoway Golf Club, and cannot be disproved since the minute books of the Club go back only as far as the AGM of 1933. This in itself is a sizable chunk of golfing history, but we would dearly love to locate the records of the missing years from 1890 when, in July of that year, according to the infallible authority of the Royal and Ancient, Stornoway Golf Club was instituted. So if there is any old SY out there in the Yukon or Patagonia or wherever, who knows the whereabouts of the lost minutes, let us know, and instant Honorary Life Membership can be yours.

It is likely that the precise date of the Club's institution was July 17, 1890 since that is the date inscribed on our oldest piece of silverware - the Jackson Medal (below) - presented to the Club by Major Randle Jackson of Swordale.


The description of Stornoway Golf Club in the Golfing Annual of 1890-91, sandwiched between Stonehaven and Stowe-on-the-Wold, states that the course consists of nine holes - five out and four in - situated on the Melbost links within three miles of the Burgh of Stornoway and runs parallel to the shores of Broad Bay stretching out for fully a mile and a half.

Recent enquiries into the origins of the Club from the Scottish Land Court produced the interesting information that 192 acres had been resumed from the townships of Melbost and Steinish, the purpose of which was "that the free exercise of that game might continue in future without interference on the part of the crofters of Melbost and Steinish". A fond hope, but not one that was to be borne out in the ensuing years.

Newspaper reports concerning the Club in The Highland News and subsequently The Stornoway Gazette were infrequent. Nevertheless, we have acquired various items of memorabilia relating to the formative years of the club. Although we have no indication of when the course was extended to 18 holes, we have a very full account in The Highland News of the bazaar, held over a period of two days - June 3 and 4, 1913 - in Stornoway Town Hall for the express purpose of raising enough money to build a Clubhouse. And it did. Over the two days a grand total of £502-9/- was realised and the Club was then able to erect, free of debt, a purpose built Clubhouse at the Steinish end of the course.


Melvyn Morrow

Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #36 on: September 21, 2009, 10:47:44 AM »

Tom

You may find that the information regards the photos and the Askernish site connection is relative new to their site. It may even have come from my original contact to obtain copies of said photos explaining the links and the source of some of our information. However, you would have to ask the club Secretary for confirmation. I also tried to assist Stornoway have the ban lifted on Sunday golf by writing to the Factor. 

The Stornoway Club just provided us with photos of the photos (still behind their protective glass). The information about OTM visit did not come from them. Having said that I would like to thank Stornoway for all the help in providing copies as we requested.

Thanks for your info. I had previously contacted Stornoway but I believe Ralph may also have been in touch with the club. The only addition is that while in The Outer Hebrides, it apparently seemed logical for the two of them to go north and check out the new course apparently ‘recently opened’, but alas, I have no other info on the actual history for the early Stornoway course.

Melvyn


Adrian_Stiff

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #37 on: September 21, 2009, 12:09:42 PM »
I had a look at my Golf Annuals, (I dont have many pre 1940) but Askernish is always listed as South Uist Golf Club and there was also a North Uist Golf Club and a Benbucula golf club.
You probably could trace when Stornaway went to 18 holes via sequenceing the Golfing Annuals and just see where it gets upgraded, however I think they were always a bit behind the times I know of some course listed in 1948 that were shut in the war, so you cant fully trust the written info.
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Tom MacWood

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #38 on: September 22, 2009, 06:20:15 AM »
Ralph
It doesn't appear the Stornoway info is based on any thing very solid, and the dates of the two courses don't match, which makes me wonder. I do find it interesting that the Club has had portraits of the two men hanging in their clubhouse for some time, but they really don't know why. Its a mystery. You are right about Hutchinson being a dedicated angler. The idea that he frequented the areas because of the fishing makes sense to me.

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #39 on: September 22, 2009, 06:45:21 AM »
Tom

I again note you have addressed your post to Ralph, but with all due respect, you forgot to use the immortal words

’In My Humble Opinion’  it doesn't appear the Stornoway info is based on any thing very solid, and the dates of the two courses don't match, which makes me wonder. I do find it interesting that the Club has had portraits of the two men hanging in their clubhouse for some time, but they really don't know why. Its a mystery. You are right about Hutchinson being a dedicated angler. The idea that he frequented the areas because of the fishing makes sense to me.

I believe I may have mentioned something about the club not knowing much about the visit. Nevertheless, In my humble opinion you will make up your own mind whatever you are presented with, so I will not be wasting my time by mentioning the sources of the reports.

Thank you for trying to assist in confirming the original source materials that was most considerate of you.

Melvyn

PS Why do the dates need to match, I thought that they went up to see the recently opened course, not open it, so its of no importance apart from trying to discredit the information. I was trying to be sincere in my comments but you are just up to your old tricks again.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2009, 10:32:19 AM by Melvyn Hunter Morrow »

Mike Hendren

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Re: Askernish - the whole truth and nothing but the truth
« Reply #40 on: September 22, 2009, 08:15:50 PM »
Where are the bunker close-ups?  I have purchased a rabbit and tethered him in the backyard and I want to see what my bunker might look like one day.

Mike
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

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