[Jim Franklin]

As many of you know, Baltimore CC has hosted the Senior Players championship the past two years and will do so again the next two. Our club is now maintaining the course just to make sure it looks good the first week of October. I played this weekend and the course was SOAKED and we have not had any rain in over a week. Every tee marker was 1/2 step off the back of each box. The rough is ridiculously long, but will be cut down by the time the Seniors get there. Absolutely ZERO roll in the fairways made the course play painfully long. Our club championship is this weekend and I am sure we will not have full use of any tee box because they do not want any marks on them. 2011 cannot come soon enough.

[Anthony Gray]

  Jim,

  I'm glad they don't make you play off mats in the fairway. How much financially does your club benefit from hosting?

  Thanks......Anthony

[Anthony_Nysse]

Jim,
  When I was at Colonial, there were a good sized group of members who felt the same way, even to the point that they felt everything that we did was in preparation for the tournament. What a lot of members forget is that many courses that host events, are giving a tournament budget, where there usually yearly operating budget is increased because of tournament preparations. This may mean that thin areas are freshly sodded, trees are removed around greens for viewing purposes, possibly an extra topdressing of the fairways, more double cutting and rolling, dryjecting the greens, etc...many of those "EXTRA" things wouldn't be able to get done at many courses without the extra money. Members benefit from this the other 51 weeks out of the year.

Tony Nysse
Pine Tree GC
Boynton Beach, FL

[Jim_Kennedy]

.........and to add insult to injury, I have to eat out of the dumpster tonight!  

I'd have to go along with Anthony here and ask if this doesn't benefit the club for the long haul?

[Jim Franklin]

The club received new bunkers which was needed, but I have no idea what the financial number is. I can tell you I have not seen any double cutting or rolling of the greens for us and I KNOW they won't do it for them either as the "pros" don't want to be embarrassed on our greens so they will slow them down. The first defense of our course is the greens and these guys should be able to handle that for crying out loud. So whatever we are getting is not worth it at all. They are making a wonderful members course a long, brutal slog. Off with their heads.....

[Rob Rigg]

Jim,

Agree - It is a massive pain in the butt, especially if the tournament is later in the season.

At Ghost this year, the greens had been kept long to protect the grass (totally understandable, especially with the hot summer) but they were not rolling well until after the Safeway.

We also had numerous tee boxes fenced off so they were pristine for the tournament (totally understandable but annoying).

We have also been hitting off the mats much more often than usual because they needed to protect the grass on the range - this gets me more than anything because hitting off a grass range is SO much better than off the stupid mats.

While some improvements were made to the course - I secretly (not much of a secret anymore) hope they move the Safeway back to Columbia Edgewater (where I think the club could really use the money - not that Pumpkin can't).

The inconvenience of not being able to play for a week is definitely the least of the "pains" a member must deal with.

[Jim Franklin]

Not playing the 2 weeks the course is closed to the tournament is the only good thing. It forces me to travel . This year I am going to see my old pro at Crooked Stick and also head up to Sycamore Hills which I hear is nice too.

We have not closed tees, just moved the markers all the way to the back of the bos so you have one foot in teh rough when you tee off. Hate it, hate it, hate it....

[John Mayhugh]

Seems that this is only a good thing if the club isn't the main place you play. 

[Ron Csigo]

As many of you know, Baltimore CC has hosted the Senior Players championship the past two years and will do so again the next two. Our club is now maintaining the course just to make sure it looks good the first week of October. I played this weekend and the course was SOAKED and we have not had any rain in over a week. Every tee marker was 1/2 step off the back of each box. The rough is ridiculously long, but will be cut down by the time the Seniors get there. Absolutely ZERO roll in the fairways made the course play painfully long. Our club championship is this weekend and I am sure we will not have full use of any tee box because they do not want any marks on them. I feel like bunting my drive on the first hole about 10 feet and then taking a wedge to the middle of the box to take out a two foot divot. 2011 cannot come soon enough.

.
Jim,

I will be joining one of the members at BCC and playing there during the week.  Sounds like I'm going to get slapped around out there given the long rough and not getting any roll in the fairways.  Are they soaking the greens as well?

[Bill_McBride]

Jim,

Agree - It is a massive pain in the butt, especially if the tournament is later in the season.

At Ghost this year, the greens had been kept long to protect the grass (totally understandable, especially with the hot summer) but they were not rolling well until after the Safeway.

We also had numerous tee boxes fenced off so they were pristine for the tournament (totally understandable but annoying).

We have also been hitting off the mats much more often than usual because they needed to protect the grass on the range - this gets me more than anything because hitting off a grass range is SO much better than off the stupid mats.

While some improvements were made to the course - I secretly (not much of a secret anymore) hope they move the Safeway back to Columbia Edgewater (where I think the club could really use the money - not that Pumpkin can't).

The inconvenience of not being able to play for a week is definitely the least of the "pains" a member must deal with.

If I correctly recall that the net benefit to Columbia Edgewater was $300,000 a year, I'm sure it isn't up to them that the event was moved to Pumpkin Ridge.  That kind of net will solve a lot of a club's financial shortfalls.

[Rob Rigg]

Bill,

It was clearly not up to CECC who had put on a solid event for something like 25 years and really could have used the dough.

The "desire" of the event to "grow" sent them out to PR where there were two courses for the Pro-Am, more space, etc. etc.

I think CECC got Bevens'd or whatever her name was.

There was "record attendance" this year at Ghost, which surprised me as CECC is much more centrally located.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Jim, as you undoubtedly know CC Woodmore has a Nationwide event.  It has been a pretty good experience for us.  We don't get the crowds you or Congo get so our course doesn't get beat very much.  This year it was televised and we did get some damage from trucks etc but was cleaned up almost immediately.  The plus side is that the money we get for hosting the event goes right into the course. 

[Steve Lang]

  If you play from the pro tips all the time, then why not move up one tee box??   Can't you get BCC to offer some reciprocal play like at Caves Valley or somewhere else?

At WCC it used to be a real pain with overseeding the bermuda for the spring PGA tourney and the 2x/yr transitioning..  can't discount the PGA agronomist coming to visit, advising on conditioning, and ramping things up for the big week..  Now we keep things just as bermuda and beyond the divots and a lost week, the access to the pros is always a treat, especially now with the Champions Tour guys..

..and our other courses are more open..

[Matt_Cohn]

What's WCC?

[Carl Johnson]

Seems to me it's economics, pure and simple.   Do you need this event to keep the club running as the membership likes it?  If not, screw it.  The Champions Tour is a business deal from the players' side.  It should be from the course's side, too.  I wouldn't want a tour event of any kind, at any level, at my club, but if it was the only way I could keep my club/course going, I'd be for it.  Having said that, if (hypothetically) my club could host a lower-level USGA tournament, e.g., men's or women's junior, at no net out-of-pocket cost to the club, and no disruption other than competition days, then I'd be willing to give up the member playing days, infrequently, "for the good of the game."

[Steve Lang]

  Carl,

Do you mean you wouldn't like to see a pro's hands shake a bit? Watch them hit from odd places, and favored ones and watch the personalities at their place of work?


Matt.. WCC = The Woodlands Country Club, north side of Houston, past home of Houston Open at original CC and for 17 yrs at the TPC course, now known as the Tournament Course, current home of Administaff Champions Tour event

[Lou_Duran]

Jim,
  When I was at Colonial, there were a good sized group of members who felt the same way, even to the point that they felt everything that we did was in preparation for the tournament. What a lot of members forget is that many courses that host events, are giving a tournament budget, where there usually yearly operating budget is increased because of tournament preparations. This may mean that thin areas are freshly sodded, trees are removed around greens for viewing purposes, possibly an extra topdressing of the fairways, more double cutting and rolling, dryjecting the greens, etc...many of those "EXTRA" things wouldn't be able to get done at many courses without the extra money. Members benefit from this the other 51 weeks out of the year.

Tony Nysse
Pine Tree GC
Boynton Beach, FL

Tony,

I've known a number of members at Colonial over the years and they always said the same thing- that there is a broad preference for not having the tournament EXCEPT for the deference and respect owed to Mr. Leonard (club founder).  Ditto for converting to a better green grass.  The tournament does allow for a huge maintenance budget (rumored to be among the highest in the country for 18 holes) and very modest montly dues.  And though being a superintendent at a Tour venue must be good for the resume, I am sure that it is like a sword with a second edge to it.  I hope things are going well at Pine Tree.

[Doug Sobieski]

When I was working at Bay Hill, we'd close the course at noon on the Saturday prior to tournament week (essentially 1.5 days prior). I think the biggest hardship for the members was having the rough/fairways closed to cart traffic for the month leading up to it, and a lot of front middle hole locations. Overall, the membership didn't complain too much about the inconvenience.

[Anthony_Nysse]

When I was working at Bay Hill, we'd close the course at noon on the Saturday prior to tournament week (essentially 1.5 days prior). I think the biggest hardship for the members was having the rough/fairways closed to cart traffic for the month leading up to it, and a lot of front middle hole locations. Overall, the membership didn't complain too much about the inconvenience.

  Doug,
  That was probably the biggest complaint from the members-Carts had to remain outside the ropes 3 weeks prior. Unfortunately, flagged carts were allowed inside the ropes and it was amazing how many people all of a sudden needed handicap flags!

Tony Nysse
Pine Tree GC
Boynton Beach, FL

[Scott_Burroughs]

My club (Nationwide host) sounds like Bay Hill.  Shotgun the members on Saturday morning prior to tournament week 1.5 days later, and open it up the Tuesday after (with Sunday pins & greens at tournament speeds) for Tough Day, teeing off from the tips.

They originally were to have cartpath-only for the 3 weeks prior, but got it down to 1 or 2...I don't remember for sure, since it doesn't affect me any.

[Carl Johnson]

Carl,

Do you mean you wouldn't like to see a pro's hands shake a bit? Watch them hit from odd places, and favored ones and watch the personalities at their place of work?

Steve, to tell you the truth, not really, not at my club.  On the other hand, I do enjoy watching pro tournaments in person from time to time on other courses.  Now, if I could see the pros play at our club one day, and that's it, with no downtime for members except that day, that would be fun.  But that's not going to happen.  Recently our club hosted one round of our county amateur championship tournament, which included several former professionals (none having played as regulars on the PGA Tour), and it was fun to see how our course challenged these guys.  I think it was great for us to offer the course that day to the larger local community, but that's all it was, one day.

[David Lott]

From the Champions Tour web site:

"Since the inception of the Senior Players Championship in 1983, almost $7 million has been generated for charity. The former Constellation Energy Classic, also in the Greater Baltimore area, generated in excess of $2 million for charity from 1998-2006. The combined total from the two events is nearly $8.5 million."

This year 100% of ticket sale proceeds are going to charity.

Golf has a wonderful record of charitable support. It's one of the earmarks of the game.

Keep this in mind when the inconvenience of tournament preparation (and recovery) gets you down.

[Bob_Huntley]

Jim,
  When I was at Colonial, there were a good sized group of members who felt the same way, even to the point that they felt everything that we did was in preparation for the tournament. What a lot of members forget is that many courses that host events, are giving a tournament budget, where there usually yearly operating budget is increased because of tournament preparations. This may mean that thin areas are freshly sodded, trees are removed around greens for viewing purposes, possibly an extra topdressing of the fairways, more double cutting and rolling, dryjecting the greens, etc...many of those "EXTRA" things wouldn't be able to get done at many courses without the extra money. Members benefit from this the other 51 weeks out of the year.

Tony Nysse
Pine Tree GC
Boynton Beach, FL


Tony,

We are hosting a section of the A.T. &T. National Pro-Am next year. We are receiving no remuneration for this except for an indemnification for any damgages caused to our properties. A quite amazing decision in my opinion. Quite frankly, I am astounded that members of private clubs aquiesce to the siren song of the PGA for the use of their facilities.The PGA quote the millions of dollars they raise for charity, generally an inflated figure, but no mention is made of how much the PGA actually donates to these causes. I doubt that no PGA Tournament could exist in its present form without the help of many hundreds of volunteers that receive no pay for their efforts.

Looking at the salaries and perks of the senior PGA Staff, one wonders what ranking they would have to achieve if placed side by side with the players in the money won column.


Bob

[Jim Franklin]

If you play from the pro tips all the time, then why not move up one tee box??   Can't you get BCC to offer some reciprocal play like at Caves Valley or somewhere else?

At WCC it used to be a real pain with overseeding the bermuda for the spring PGA tourney and the 2x/yr transitioning..  can't discount the PGA agronomist coming to visit, advising on conditioning, and ramping things up for the big week..  Now we keep things just as bermuda and beyond the divots and a lost week, the access to the pros is always a treat, especially now with the Champions Tour guys..

..and our other courses are more open..

When our club championship is this weekend, I would like to practice from the tees I will be playing. Make sense? I think it stinks that for OUR club championship, we have to set the course up so the Seniors won't complain. Can't have any marks on the middle of a tee box I guess.

[astavrides]

Jim,

How did BCC get the tourney?  Did the members vote a simple majority or was their no such vote?  If there was not a vote, do you think most of the members are for it or against it?

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()