The goal of great GCA

[Dan Herrmann]

Flynn wrote, "The principal consideration of the architect is to design his course in such a way as to hold the interest of the player from the first tee to the last green and to present the problems of the various holes in such a way that they register in the player’s mind as he stands on the tee or on the fairway for the shot to the green."

I don't know about you, but to me this sums up great GCA perfectly.  What do you think?

[TEPaul]

"........and to present the problems of the various holes in such a way that they register in the player’s mind as he stands on the tee or on the fairway for the shot to the green."

I don't know about you, but to me this sums up great GCA perfectly.  What do you think?




Dan:

We've been considering that particular remark from Flynn (from a late 1920s USGA Green Section Bulletin article) for some years now (we being me and Wayne). Frankly, I have always felt that particular remark raises more questions about what he meant in detail (if indeed he was even thinking about architectural detail when he wrote that) than answers it provides about architecture generally or otherwise.

I'd be glad to elaborate if you'd like because we sure have discussed that remark and what Flynn really meant to say an awful lot over the years. Flynn's remarks, as you can see, leave a lot to the reader's interpretation, which actually it seems to me was something he did and did best with what he created on his golf courses.

[Dan Herrmann]

Tom,
Wouldn't it be just like Flynn to raise more questions after reading a quote than to just come out and say something bluntly?  To me, it's the beauty of Flynn, both in hs writings and, more luckily for us, in his golf course designs.

Making a person think, and think hard, is one of the signs of greatness in almost any field, whether it be music, literature, science, or GCA.

[Peter Pallotta]

Tom, Dan - I'd like to hear more if you please.

As it stands now, I find the bit about 'presenting the problems' most interesting.

I take it that the 'problems' are the strategic choices and shot making tests that confront the golfer and that he must decide on and execute before and during every swing.

And I'm starting to think that the number of such problems is finite, and actually not all that high.

Its the variety in which the problems are presented that makes the difference, and it's the architect's capacity to envision and then create this variety (hole by hole and course by course and site by site) by which we measure his talents.

The problems/principals behind, say, a Cape hole or a Long Hole are pretty simple to understand. The hard part is figuring out how to present those problems engagingly and naturally - as evidenced by the preponderance of bland cape and long holes.

Peter

 

[JESII]

Peter,

Wouldn't each shot have one problem?

[Peter Pallotta]

Jim -

On one level, I was using the word 'problem' as a synonym for 'golf hole"(and suggesting that Flynn was doing so as well). In that sense, the underlying principles, strategies and shot-making demands of that golf hole-problem engenders a whole bunch of 'secondary' problems (plural) both mental and physical that the golfer must face shot after shot.
I'm guessing that Flynn is talking about the importance of finding fresh and innovative ways to present the few basic principles that underlie a good  hole-problem, and that (just from seeing pictures of Flynn's work) he finds that variety in the ground itself, ie he let's the land dictate how the 'problem is presented'.

I don't think that answers your question, but hopefully makes clearer what I think Flynn mightve meant.

Peter

[Dan Herrmann]

Peter,
Maybe the problems are like those often presented to chess players, such as:

White to mate in 1 move:



To me, great GCA presents similar 'problems', and like Chess, their resolution requires mental precision and results in a real feeling of having overcome.

[Bill Brightly]

OK, Tom, I'll bite....

What is so complex about this statement? Flynn is talking about an entire 18 hole course, so "problems of the holes" refers to all the holes and all the problems. He then says that each hole should clearly present each problem on the tee (could be more than one per hole) to the golfer. So he wants the golfer to recognize the problem, deal with it, and the entire round should be memorable and enjoyable.

Nice cga thoughts, but what is the mystery?

[Kyle Harris]

OK, Tom, I'll bite....

What is so complex about this statement? Flynn is talking about an entire 18 hole course, so "problems of the holes" refers to all the holes and all the problems. He then says that each hole should clearly present each problem on the tee (could be more than one per hole) to the golfer. So he wants the golfer to recognize the problem, deal with it, and the entire round should be memorable and enjoyable.

Nice cga thoughts, but what is the mystery?

Flynn has built a good number of blind holes, for starters.

[Bill Brightly]

Peter,
Maybe the problems are like those often presented to chess players, such as:

White to mate in 1 move:



To me, great GCA presents similar 'problems', and like Chess, their resolution requires mental precision and results in a real feeling of having overcome.

QB pawn to QN 6, En passant ?
Peter,
Maybe the problems are like those often presented to chess players, such as:

White to mate in 1 move:



To me, great GCA presents similar 'problems', and like Chess, their resolution requires mental precision and results in a real feeling of having overcome.

[Jason McNamara]

QB pawn to QN 6, En passant ?

A simple e4-e5 opens up the attack from f6.  (Btw, en passant can only capture a pawn that has just moved its initial two spaces.) 

Also, for the purpose of this illustration, either the knight or the king's bishop (d8) is unnecessary.  A bit of overkill, like putting a tree over a fairway bunker.

[David Stamm]

Peter,
Maybe the problems are like those often presented to chess players, such as:

White to mate in 1 move:
 

My wife wishes I would take MORE than one move.....

[Bill Brightly]

QB pawn to QN 6, En passant ?

A simple e4-e5 opens up the attack from f6.  (Btw, en passant can only capture a pawn that has just moved its initial two spaces.)  

Also, for the purpose of this illustration, either the knight or the king's bishop (d8) is unnecessary.  A bit of overkill, like putting a tree over a fairway bunker.

Jason, can't Black simply blocy the bishop's attack with a pawn?

I had to assume the previous move was a pawn's two-space move for my en passant to be the answer

[Dan Herrmann]

FYI - The correct answer is b3 (P x P e.p.). Black's previous move could only have been b7-b5.

(Source, http://alangullette.com/lit/dunsany/chess/problems.htm)

[Jason McNamara]

My bad guys, total brain cramp on my part.