Padraig Harrington

[Tim Liddy]

Pete Dye and I had an interesting talk yesterday with Padrick Harrington yesterday about tournament golf. His most revealing comment concerned distance. He felt that 7500 was just about a minimum tournament distance. He said as the week progresses, the golf becomes course drier and with adrenalin every day (even Thursday) makes the golf course shorter. In practice rounds on Tuesday and Wednesday he normally has long clubs into long par 4 (500 yards) but by the weekend he is hitting middle to short irons to the greens. His feeling was that golf courses couldn’t be too long for tournament golf anymore (of course he is a long hitter).  He also mentioned he hits the ball longer in the afternoon than in the morning – course drier and more flex in his muscles.

The groove change will be big for him, but foresees where tournament hole locations will be moved more towards the middle of greens and not at the edges to compensate. He felt that ANGC has gotten tournament golf about right with longer distance, but with better hole locations. In the past when the course played shorter some of the hole locations were a bit unfair (small) to offset hitting short irons into them. A player could hit a good shot and not get the proper results. Now with the longer yardage, hole locations better reflect a good or poor shot hit into them.

We all mentioned Merion and what a great golf course it is but worry it will be too short for the elite player and they will probably have to revert to some hole locations to very small areas - allowing some luck to be more of an issue.

It was an interesting talk and really appreciated his willingness to talk architecture with us.

[Michael Whitaker]

Any discussion of his Irish course-to-be The Marlbrook, in county Tipperary?

[JSlonis]

Is Padrick Harrington "Padraig's" older brother?

[JESII]

Thanks Tim...interesting stuff.

Is it your opinion that luck is when a an approach or chip shot is a 3 or 4 feet on the low side of a hole catches a slope and rolls to 20 or more feet away from the hole? Typically this same hole location has a good bit more room on the high side but will result in a tougher putt either down or across the slope but I see that as a reasonable defense in this age of distance...is that type of hole location considered "tricky" or requiring "luck" to succeed on? This is not a setup question, I'm serious and curious. Thanks.

[Jamie Barber]

Isn't it a complete joke? Courses only need to be 7500 yds because of the ball.

[PThomas]

VERY interesting Tim...i wonder if he could be interviewed for GCA

[Tim Liddy]

Michael,
He mentioned he had three golf courses (one in Ireland) in the planning stages but nothing that was moving forward at this point.

JSlonis,
Thanks, I made the correction.

Jim,
I think contours can be a great defense for hole locations. Especially, as you mention, if they support a specific shot approached from the left or right. Our general discussion revolved around the appropriate size and depth of the locations in relationship to the iron shot hit into them-and how that size increases as the hole locations are moved toward the center of the green vs. at the very edge. He also mentioned he thought one par 3 on every golf course should require a hybrid or metal wood.

[JESII]

Thanks Tim.

Interesting, his thoughts about hole locations at the edges.

[JSlonis]

Tim,

No problem.  Just teasing a bit.

It would seem like Padraig would be a good interview.  He always seems to have insightful and well thought out responses when I see him on TV.

Outside of the ball, the firmness of PGA Tour fairways contributes a lot to the needed extra length.  I don't recall ever playing a course here in the States that has fairways as firm as you see for the tour stops.  If the event doesn't get rain, I'm always surprised to watch how much the ball bounces and rolls on the fairways.  There are some events where the ball bounces 10 feet in the air and rolls out 30-40 yards.

[Kris Spence]

Tim, interesting comments from Padraig.  At this years Wyndham Championship played at Sedgefield CC, the tour never approached playing it from the back markers.  The max yardage to the middle of the greens is 7,180 par 70.  Favoring the back halves of the greens it will play out to @ 7,300 or so.

On Sunday the course was set up at 6,880 with the easiest hole locations possible. 14 hole locations in the front 1/4 of the green and many of the tees up or on the member tees.  The 12th hole which Ross designed at 238 was played from the front section of the senior tee at 164 on sunday and never over 211 during the week?

go figure.

[Adam Clayman]

There seems to be an underlying fundamental flaw within the subtext of this 7500 yard argument. That is score.

If this holier than thou 70-73 for par was thrown under the bus, any distance for a tournament would and could be acceptable because the golfer who scores the lowest s still crowned the winner.

 

[JESII]

And if the Queen had balls...

[PThomas]

Tim, next time Paddy is anywhere near Chicago lets you, me him and Pete frequesnt a bunch of the Irish bars on Western Ave to discuss GCA! ...my wife is Irish too so maybe that'll help too

[Doug Wright]

Tim thanks much for this information. Information like this really adds value to this website.

[PThomas]

Ogilivy would be another GCA interview if Ran could pull it off....even better if possible would be a panel discussion of several pros on the topic

[Lawrence Largent]

Jamie really has something with the firmness of the fairways.  Most days when I play my home course 260 to 270 is a really good drive.  I've played with a friend who is a member of the PGA tour and I hit it about the same distance he does.  I asked how the guys on tour hit it so far and he said the fairways were so much harder for the added roll.  I recently played Valhalla from the Ryder Cup tees.  The first hole I made just a good controled swing and when the ball hit it bounced about 20 feet in the air.  When I reached my ball, I was 315 from the tee and said wow I could get used to this.  I also overheard a member of Quail Hollow at the Jess Sweester Memorial this spring.  A firend of his asked him if he had ever played the back tees that the tour players played.  He said no because they keep the course so wet all the time except for tournament week when the fairways are rock hard.

Lawrence

[Jack_Marr]

I grew up playing in the same golf club as Padraig, although I can't say I knew him, just to say hello to. His father was in the Gardai with my father and they were friends.

Anyway, it was Stackstown Golf Club, where he's still a member. He redesigned a number of holes there. I think it was his first design work, but couldn't be sure. His father was part of a group who established the club. I wonder if his father had a hand in the design.

[Jack_Marr]

PS, here's a little more on Padraig and architecture - http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,29524.msg571122/