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Mike Sweeney

Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« on: August 10, 2009, 07:39:23 AM »
A friend of mine sent these pics of what I believe is another below the radar Stiles and Van Kleek course. His description:



Rutland is the longest 6,100 yards I’ve never played.  And deceptively so.    Starts with an attractive but presentable par 4.  Nothing missing from view, straight and slightly uphill.  The second is a wonderful par 4 back towards the clubhouse (more on that disappointment later) over a creek and a blind downhill second shot to a highly contoured green.  Wonderful little hole.  Then the third, a beauty of sorts at par 3.  over a hill guarding and hiding the left side of the green.  Neat little hole.  Four is an uphill par 5, with more great movement in the land.  One interesting point, up till now, the land was mostly benign, but now it started to bounce around and rise and fall tremendously.  After 4, we head to the 5th tee and look across the river.  A beautiful hole, augmented by the fisherman in our foreground on the river.  Another green with good movement to it too.  6 is a bouncy ride, one of my favorites on the course, while 7 is truly great, crossing back over the river and uphill to a green with tons of movement in it.  8, a downhill 4 is ok, and nine a neat little short 4 that plays with my head.  Lunch, at their Caddy Shack is good, and has a nice server wench.  10 is really great, a short hole played with ground uprising and falling everywhere, confusing my little head into not knowing where or how far to hit it.  I loved it.  Then we entered the long slog uphill from 11 to 14.  Yet, I liked it all.  11 is a 90 degree dogleg left; a so-so hole.  12, a wonderful risk/reward 3, I got the risk outcome down in the sand well below the hole.  13, a beautiful and challenging par 5uphill to a tough green.  14, so much movement in the fairways, and a green perched on top of a plateau on top of the hill.  Just special.  15, a short steep downhill par 3; I have to ay it is nothing special; but for my shot that hit the stick before careening off to the right into the rough.  I loved 16.  Uphill,movement everywhere in the fairways, and another tough green to hold.  Being above holes on 13, 14, and 16 were asking for big trouble, and I found it on 2 of the 3.  17, back down the mountain, was a fun short par 4.  and 18 is a hard uphill par 4 back to the ugly and out of place clubhouse.

Overall impressions:

Favorite holes were 3, 5, 6, 7, 13, 14, 16.  2 is in my thoughts, but it needed to be later in the round to acquire favored status.  3 is 10 at Friars Head.  Go look at pictures.  Come to think of it, I liked 8 a lot too.  
No range, just a net to hit into
Great movement in the greens
Tons of fairway movement in all the holes after 5, little before (except 2 which should have told me what was coming)
Interesting use of hillside green locations, forcing lots of downhill lie chips (at least for me) that were killers down onto severely sloped greens away from those hillsides
Interesting movement in the greens.
Loved crossing the river 4 or 5 times.

Clubhouse?  Somebody explain to me how such an old and historic place ends up with an ugly utilitarian facility.  Where’d the old early 1900’s building go to be replaced by a hideous 1950’s building?  Yuck!

Well, I loved Taconic even more, thoughts on that place if you want them, but Rutland was a pleasure, and a great day on a clearly loved spot.  The views of Killington and Pico from the 14th tee weren’t too bad either.

He thought this was the inspiration for Friars Head #10!














http://www.rutlandcountryclub.com/
« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 06:30:59 AM by Mike Sweeney »

Bill_McBride

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Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2009, 09:57:51 AM »
Mike, is there a photo of #3 in that set?  I see nothing there that resembles the huge mound in front of #10 at Friars Head!

John Foley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2009, 11:03:59 AM »
Mike,

I have heard glowing reports of Rutland from a few others also.

How about reports from our Middlebury College contingents??

Integrity in the moment of choice

Brad Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2009, 12:25:24 PM »
I can deliver on that count.

We always made a point to make a pilgrimmage or two down to RCC during our days at Midd.  After school, one of my teammates was an assistant pro there, so I have made several trips since.

Rutland is a GREAT place, I would call it Taconic-Lite.  The course is only par 70 and 6100 yards, but uneven stances abound, the greens are small (and fast, perhaps the fastest in VT, which may almost justify the $100 fee).  Every hole is infused with something special for the architecture aficionado.  Briefly:

1.  What seems to be a warm-up hole is actually harder than it looks.  The table green is not easy to hit, and surrounded by bunkers.
2.  Blind second does come out of the blue on the flat part of the course, but it is relatively forgiving.
3.  GREAT par 3 set into a 20-foot tall rocky bump.  The green speed of the course is dictated on what the slope of this green can handle.  A missed shot here (175 that feels like it plays to the hood of a car) makes for some VERY tough short game issues.
4.  Not-quite reachable par 5, very similar to 10 at Taconic, but with a fairer green.  Semi-blind tee shot into a valley makes the player uncomfy from the tee.
5.  The first time I saw this hole, I figured it was a par 4...although it's a par 3 of 235, it's a par four.  The green is elevated and crowned.  Easily in the top three challenging par threes in VT, perhaps New England.
6.  A twisting par four with several fun bumps of rough where the shield rock almost makes it to the surface.  Awkward second to a small green.  Can you get the faded mid-iron correct?
7.  Wonderful mid-length par four diagonally back over the river.  I believe the fairway bunkers on the right are new, which makes you think much more off the tee.  The green is blind and slopes hard back to front.
8.  Not an exciting 370-yard hole, until the narrow green.  Benched into a tiny rocky ridge, this hole squeezes every last ounce out of the property and makes a great hole.  Almost a reverse of Taconic's #13.
9.  Bland hole with a wide flat green, but the tee shot is awkward around a bank of trees.  It's only 320 yards, but surrounded by sand.
10.  Cute 310-yard hole with fairway bunkers, almost multiple fairways, and a saddle green.  A front pin here has you salivating from the fairway (or tee), but that side of the green is hard by some THICK woods and the river.
11.  Weird tee shot to a banked turning fairway, but a GREAT green.  Long and narrow, you must have the right angle from the fairway to make it work.  The green is probably 40 yards front to back, and only 15 yards side to side!
12.  Tough 210 par three with a wild green.  Rutland CC bites back after 5 short par 4s in a row.
13.  Great par five that seems reachable, but the tee shot lands into a hill, and from there it is 250 from a (righty) baseball stance!  The green is elevated and slopes hard down the mountain from right to left.
14.  Fun/wacky par four with several bumps and rock outcroppings bordering the right side.  The green is elevated, and elusive.
15.  A bit blah drop shot par 3, only 120 yards.  Be precise, as missing this green with a wedge will make you feel stupid when you write down your 4.
16.  Sort of a strange hole that goes uphill right to left.  You almost have to snap-hook your tee shot to be in position A.  All tee shots end up down the right, where there is a tree in the fairway!  The green is very elevated, so add a club or two.
17.  From here, this drop shot par 4 is a bit anti-climatic, but you can see skiers swishing down Killington's Superstar trail until 6/15 or later.  Be very careful with your SW here, as the stance is hard downhill, and there is a creek in front.
18.  The home hole is a bit anti-climactic too with the semi-blind approach, and the clubhouse only steps behind, but it is a still challenge to finish (only 410 though).  The best tee shots here require a fade.

Rutland CC is a great track, and I would put the course in the top three in the state, even considering the new Mountain layouts and the several decent tracks up in Burlington.  I'm glad Mike's friend was able to check it out and send him some pics!

Also, hidden gem seekers should try out Neshobe GC in Brandon, about 20-25 mins north of RCC.  A quintessential VT experience, Neshobe combines 6 holes of 75-year old quirk involving a river with 12 new holes that traverse a huge rocky ridge.  The new holes (Steve Durkee-designed) add some mountain golf and some VT farmland golf with the river holes to create a VERY fun 18.  All for about 40 bucks and the greens are as fast as Rutland's  Say hello to pro Rodney Bicknell in the shop and tell him I sent you...
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Brad Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2009, 10:06:00 PM »
One bump for the effort?

 :-\ (sigh)
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Joe Hancock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2009, 10:08:53 PM »
One bump for the effort?

 :-\ (sigh)

Fear not...we're looking!

 ;D
" What the hell is the point of architecture and excellence in design if a "clever" set up trumps it all?" Peter Pallotta, June 21, 2016

"People aren't picking a side of the fairway off a tee because of a randomly internally contoured green ."  jeffwarne, February 24, 2017

Mike Sweeney

Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2010, 10:52:04 PM »
I played the course this week and really enjoyed the course. It sits in a little oasis just off of Rutland, after driving through the New Jerseyish strip mall area of Vermont. Fantastic greens and conditioning.

I added my pictures in Brad's comment below. Definitely has some Yaleish qualities.

 
I can deliver on that count.

We always made a point to make a pilgrimmage or two down to RCC during our days at Midd.  After school, one of my teammates was an assistant pro there, so I have made several trips since.

Rutland is a GREAT place, I would call it Taconic-Lite.  The course is only par 70 and 6100 yards, but uneven stances abound, the greens are small (and fast, perhaps the fastest in VT, which may almost justify the $100 fee).  Every hole is infused with something special for the architecture aficionado.  Briefly:

1.  What seems to be a warm-up hole is actually harder than it looks.  The table green is not easy to hit, and surrounded by bunkers.
2.  Blind second does come out of the blue on the flat part of the course, but it is relatively forgiving.

3.  GREAT par 3 set into a 20-foot tall rocky bump.  The green speed of the course is dictated on what the slope of this green can handle.  A missed shot here (175 that feels like it plays to the hood of a car) makes for some VERY tough short game issues.

4.  Not-quite reachable par 5, very similar to 10 at Taconic, but with a fairer green.  Semi-blind tee shot into a valley makes the player uncomfy from the tee.
5.  The first time I saw this hole, I figured it was a par 4...although it's a par 3 of 235, it's a par four.  The green is elevated and crowned.  Easily in the top three challenging par threes in VT, perhaps New England.
6.  A twisting par four with several fun bumps of rough where the shield rock almost makes it to the surface.  Awkward second to a small green.  Can you get the faded mid-iron correct?
7.  Wonderful mid-length par four diagonally back over the river.  I believe the fairway bunkers on the right are new, which makes you think much more off the tee.  The green is blind and slopes hard back to front.


8.  Not an exciting 370-yard hole, until the narrow green.  Benched into a tiny rocky ridge, this hole squeezes every last ounce out of the property and makes a great hole.  Almost a reverse of Taconic's #13.
9.  Bland hole with a wide flat green, but the tee shot is awkward around a bank of trees.  It's only 320 yards, but surrounded by sand.
10.  Cute 310-yard hole with fairway bunkers, almost multiple fairways, and a saddle green.  A front pin here has you salivating from the fairway (or tee), but that side of the green is hard by some THICK woods and the river.


11.  Weird tee shot to a banked turning fairway, but a GREAT green.  Long and narrow, you must have the right angle from the fairway to make it work.  The green is probably 40 yards front to back, and only 15 yards side to side!



12.  Tough 210 par three with a wild green.  Rutland CC bites back after 5 short par 4s in a row.

13.  Great par five that seems reachable, but the tee shot lands into a hill, and from there it is 250 from a (righty) baseball stance!  The green is elevated and slopes hard down the mountain from right to left.
14.  Fun/wacky par four with several bumps and rock outcroppings bordering the right side.  The green is elevated, and elusive.





15.  A bit blah drop shot par 3, only 120 yards.  Be precise, as missing this green with a wedge will make you feel stupid when you write down your 4.

16.  Sort of a strange hole that goes uphill right to left.  You almost have to snap-hook your tee shot to be in position A.  All tee shots end up down the right, where there is a tree in the fairway!  The green is very elevated, so add a club or two.




17.  From here, this drop shot par 4 is a bit anti-climatic, but you can see skiers swishing down Killington's Superstar trail until 6/15 or later.  Be very careful with your SW here, as the stance is hard downhill, and there is a creek in front.


18.  The home hole is a bit anti-climactic too with the semi-blind approach, and the clubhouse only steps behind, but it is a still challenge to finish (only 410 though).  The best tee shots here require a fade.



Rutland CC is a great track, and I would put the course in the top three in the state, even considering the new Mountain layouts and the several decent tracks up in Burlington.  I'm glad Mike's friend was able to check it out and send him some pics!

Also, hidden gem seekers should try out Neshobe GC in Brandon, about 20-25 mins north of RCC.  A quintessential VT experience, Neshobe combines 6 holes of 75-year old quirk involving a river with 12 new holes that traverse a huge rocky ridge.  The new holes (Steve Durkee-designed) add some mountain golf and some VT farmland golf with the river holes to create a VERY fun 18.  All for about 40 bucks and the greens are as fast as Rutland's  Say hello to pro Rodney Bicknell in the shop and tell him I sent you...

Doug Braunsdorf

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2010, 10:58:02 PM »
Mike, this looks really fun.  Did you find the ball reacted much different than down here?  I realize we're not up that much in elevation, but VT is typically 10-15 deg cooler than down here in summer, and a lot drier.

My family has a house in Chester.  I haven't played any golf up there yet, would like to see this, maybe Equinox, Ekwanok.
"Never approach a bull from the front, a horse from the rear, or a fool from any direction."

Anthony Fowler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2010, 12:01:33 AM »
Mike, I'm glad you enjoyed Rutland.  I played the course 3 years ago and really enjoyed it as well. 

The 17th stands out in my mind the most.  It's only a 3 wood + pitch but the second shot is played from a tricky downhill/sidehill lie and the green has a ton of back-to-front slope.  You really have to take the spin off your approach or plan to land it 20 feet past.

The 10th is also a cool semi-drivable par 4 on which the smart player will just lay up.

I also remember graduated rough which was done very well.  Slight misses were slightly punished and bad misses or stupid shots were heavily punished.  I don't see that in the pictures, and I wonder if that has changed a bit.

Jason McNamara

Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2010, 01:37:15 AM »
Mike and Brad, nice combination of music and lyrics.  :-)  Thanks.

Brad, if Rutland is top 3 and Ekwanok is another, what's the third?  Equinox?

Mike Sweeney

Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2010, 06:30:16 AM »
Mike and Brad, nice combination of music and lyrics.  :-)  Thanks.

Brad, if Rutland is top 3 and Ekwanok is another, what's the third?  Equinox?

Jason,

I did not make the cut at Ekwanok  ;) but here is Equinox. Clearly all/most of the Travis greens are gone. I played with a member who has been there for 35 years or so and he said it use to have a number of steams that added intrigue to the course. Clearly it has been "resorted" out as my best two rounds of the year were at Equinox but that does not take away from a great routing and varied terrain. Very fun course to play:























Back 9

It was hot!














































« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 06:33:24 AM by Mike Sweeney »

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2010, 06:33:45 AM »
The Ralph is # 1, always and forever...sigh
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Brad Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2010, 10:17:08 AM »
The Ralph is # 1, always and forever...sigh

Well, I can confirm that isn't true...even though it is better than when I was a student 7 years ago...

I would say my VT rankings go something like:

1.  Ekwanok (by a big margin)
2.  Rutland CC
3.  St. Johnsbury
4.  VT National
5.  CC of VT
6.  Burlington CC
7.  Equinox
8.  Green Mountain National
9.  Okemo
10.  Neshobe

I have not played Dorset, Manchester CC, Newport, or the new Jay Peak course, a couple of which might make the back half of the above list.  My only snub might be Woodstock, which is a decent course with lots of history, but VERY short at 6000 yds., and annoyingly high-priced for VT at about $100.
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

John Mayhugh

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Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2010, 12:24:08 PM »
Rutland seems like a must-see. 
Any chance they have Subaru golf carts?

Chris_Blakely

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Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2010, 12:46:09 PM »
Played Rutland CC with my brother on a golf trip a couple of years ago.  It was our favorite course of the trip.  One of my favorite courses of all time.  It one wants to make a trip of it, you could easily play Rutland CC, the CC of Barre, St. Johnsbury, all very good Vermont courses.

Chris

John Blain

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Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2010, 01:18:57 PM »
The Ralph is # 1, always and forever...sigh

Well, I can confirm that isn't true...even though it is better than when I was a student 7 years ago...

I would say my VT rankings go something like:

1.  Ekwanok (by a big margin)
2.  Rutland CC
3.  St. Johnsbury
4.  VT National
5.  CC of VT
6.  Burlington CC
7.  Equinox
8.  Green Mountain National
9.  Okemo
10.  Neshobe

I have not played Dorset, Manchester CC, Newport, or the new Jay Peak course, a couple of which might make the back half of the above list.  My only snub might be Woodstock, which is a decent course with lots of history, but VERY short at 6000 yds., and annoyingly high-priced for VT at about $100.

Dorset Field Club is better than any of the aforementioned including Ekwanok, which I really like. DFC is really good with a great variety of holes and they did a great job with the new nine. As much as I like Ekwanok I honestly think it would get boring playing there every day while I can't ever see getting tired of Dorset. If you get the chance, don't take a pass, you will love it.

-John

Mike Sweeney

Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2010, 01:39:48 PM »


Dorset Field Club is better than any of the aforementioned including Ekwanok, which I really like. DFC is really good with a great variety of holes and they did a great job with the new nine. As much as I like Ekwanok I honestly think it would get boring playing there every day while I can't ever see getting tired of Dorset. If you get the chance, don't take a pass, you will love it.

-John

John,

We went biking over there and could see a good piece of the course and I did not get that feeling - again from the road. Who did the second 9 at DFC? I think it was posted as being done in 1999. It looked a little squeezed, but an outsider could say the same thing about Merion from Ardmore Avenue.

The village and setting of DFC was uniquely New England.

Brad Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2010, 01:52:08 PM »
JP...yeah, DFC has been on the list for a while...luckily they just hired a new head pro that I know!

Steve Durkee is the architect that did the back 9 for Dorset....he also reworked Neshobe with 12 new holes in the mid-90s, the back 9 for Brattleboro, and the entire new course at Okemo.  He has also drawn plans for the "to-be-built-someday" new course at Middlebury.
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Billsteele

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Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2010, 03:20:11 PM »
A couple of years ago, on a trip to New England, I drove up to Rutland from Manchester. Unfortunately, a junior tournament had been pushed back a day by weather and I did not have the chance to play the course.  However, from the parts of the course that I could see it looked very cool. Did Stiles and Van Kleek ever do anything bad? The courses that I have seen of theirs (Taconic, Woods Hole, Norwood Hills) are all very good.

I did play the Equinox and ,while the course has been Reese-ified, the routing is very good and it is an enjoyable setting for golf. For quirkiness, it doesn't get much better than the one par five that plays over a Manchester Street.

Mike Sweeney

Re: Rutland CC (Vermont) PICS + Equinox GC ADDED
« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2010, 04:13:17 PM »
For quirkiness, it doesn't get much better than the one par five that plays over a Manchester Street.

Bill,

I am not sure if Starwood owned the resort when you were there, but the lawyers and insurance guys have taken over the architecture there now. There is a weird, mound/drop zone/don't hit it here zone around both sides of the road now. I was able to hit 3 wood and hybrid over both times but the older guys had to go with a wedge and stay way short now on their second shot effectively making it a Par 6 for them.

The good news is we stayed for free on Starwood points while the kids were away at camp!!

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