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JSPayne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Got Sand?
« on: June 30, 2009, 08:27:20 AM »
I couldn't resisit.......just randomly came across this picture and had to share it here. Never played the course.

Can anyone name the course and architect? Thoughts on the hole?

I just love how they drive carts through the bunker..........


"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing it's best, night and day, to make you everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight; and never stop fighting." -E.E. Cummings

Keith Williams

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2009, 08:33:15 AM »
Jack Nicklaus, Long Bay Club in Myrtle Beach.  I am particularly drawn to the mowing patter of the dip and pimple on the right side of the photo near the green.  Needless to say, there is a lot that can be discussed in this photo.

Cristian

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2009, 08:35:24 AM »
I like the lay-up moles.  8)

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2009, 09:36:16 AM »

I see a postmodernism art design, which does nothing for me. In fact, I would go as far as to say that it seems to encompass most of the things I dislike.

The major part relates to the sandy beach or is it a bunker, actually neither because the cart tracks are clearly seen so its part Cart path, hazard and bunker. However, it is totally compromised trying to be three things yet failing on what appears all counts, the main being a hazard. Why, well just look at the cart tracks showing a solid foundation, if the ball finds any part of the sand there is a good chance the ball will keep moving and not tuck under a lip – so much for a bunker let alone sand trap or any real hazard for that matter.

The hole may look nice to some but I feel it shouts ‘What am I ‘neither one thing nor another. But I bet you it cost a lot to build, sorry this is what I consider totally lacking any real imagination on behalf of the designer or did he not oversee the construction. In fact, I would go one step further and say how can you modify that hole without again spending a great deal of money.

The question is this golf design or art because IMHO it is not the art of golf design. 

Melvyn


Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2009, 10:07:23 AM »
I just love how they drive carts through the bunker..........

That's the best part of the hole. Using a waste area as a cart path is a good idea, and economical. It actually is more in keeping with the oldest rules of golf, which made no distinction between sand and earth.
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Eric Smith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2009, 10:27:50 AM »
I just love how they drive carts through the bunker..........

That's the best part of the hole. Using a waste area as a cart path is a good idea, and economical. It actually is more in keeping with the oldest rules of golf, which made no distinction between sand and earth.

Dye does this at Heron Point on Hilton Head Island.  



That huge cross bunker/waste area before the fairway also serves as the cart path.

Also at Harbour Town on several holes.  TPC as well (I think?).
« Last Edit: June 30, 2009, 02:59:55 PM by Eric Smith »

Nicholas Coppolo

Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2009, 10:45:29 AM »
That first picture makes me nauseous.

JSPayne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2009, 01:03:45 PM »
I just love how they drive carts through the bunker..........

That's the best part of the hole. Using a waste area as a cart path is a good idea, and economical. It actually is more in keeping with the oldest rules of golf, which made no distinction between sand and earth.

I hope you're joking. I'm pretty sure the "oldest rules in golf" never anticipated the use of golf carts, let alone them being used in a bunker.
"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing it's best, night and day, to make you everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight; and never stop fighting." -E.E. Cummings

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2009, 01:55:43 PM »
I'd be curious what folks thought of this hole...for those who recogonize it, hold-off a bit on identifying which course its from.




Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #9 on: June 30, 2009, 01:55:55 PM »
I kind of like it. It has a kind of Mandelbrot nature to it.

Besides, if you are going corrupt golf, why not go all the way. Bunkers become cart-ball playgounds, fairway edges become symmetrical anti-nature mounds, greens do not lay with the land, but become virtual gigantic three leaf clover stools, etc. (note multiple meanings of stool)

Next stop would be to get rid of the extreme manicured nature, and make ATV fun ride carnival golf. The "fairway" would be all kinds of ATV jumps and drift driving areas. The off "fairway" would be mud play holes. You take your lies as you get them and call it the rub of the ATV. Might even make going back to sand greens a plus instead of a minus.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

John Moore II

Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2009, 02:18:10 PM »
You know, while obviously fake, the bunker in the first picture is not that much different than the huge 'natural' areas you see at places like Tobacco Road, yet those are praised. Yes it looks odd, but why is it so terrible? It saves time and money in maintenance and also allows for more playing options than some oval shaped, deep fairway bunker. And for what its worth, its near impossible to have a natural course be decent in Myrtle Beach. Other than some place like Dunes Club which has good property right on the ocean, most of the land used today is pan flat with poor drainage. So unnnatural shaping and stuff must take place in order to have a course that is not just flat with no character.

Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2009, 02:45:39 PM »
. . . So unnnatural shaping and stuff must take place in order to have a course that is not just flat with no character.

    Botox does not add character.  Perhaps it's even a lack of character that causes its use.

Shaping does not have to come up short of natural formations.  Art is pursuit.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2009, 03:10:52 PM by Slag Bandoon »
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2009, 02:50:49 PM »
I'd be curious what folks thought of this hole...for those who recogonize it, hold-off a bit on identifying which course its from.





Wow Kalen! ATV fun ride carnival golf. Where are the tracks in the sand?
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

John Moore II

Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2009, 03:00:50 PM »
. . . So unnnatural shaping and stuff must take place in order to have a course that is not just flat with no character.

    Botox does not add character.  Perhaps it's even a lack of character than causes its use.

Shaping does not have to come up short of natural formations.  Art is pursuit.

Well, I really meant just a large amount of shaping in general.

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2009, 03:06:11 PM »
I'd be curious what folks thought of this hole...for those who recogonize it, hold-off a bit on identifying which course its from.





Wow Kalen! ATV fun ride carnival golf. Where are the tracks in the sand?


From ground level, its a pretty cool looking hole...

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #15 on: June 30, 2009, 03:11:37 PM »
JSP,

Those first rules never made any distinction between sand and soil. Waste areas are more in keeping with them than the 'modernized' rules which make the distinction between sand and soil.
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #16 on: June 30, 2009, 03:14:16 PM »


[/quote]

From ground level, its a pretty cool looking hole...
[/quote]

Do you have that photo to present?   Is it a Hell's Half Acre for a par 3?
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2009, 03:23:16 PM »
Definitely looks different.
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2009, 03:40:29 PM »
Is that a golfer impaled upon the flagstick? !
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2009, 03:46:28 PM »
That's just the "cheater line" on his ball
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Randy Thompson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2009, 03:55:13 PM »
Looks like the architectural fad in the mid 80´s...thank god it didn´t stand the test of time and were into cooler fads now....some architects are still producing similar stuff today and calling it art...oh well I got stuck in the music of the 80´s and still like it!

JSPayne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2009, 03:57:54 PM »
JSP,

Those first rules never made any distinction between sand and soil. Waste areas are more in keeping with them than the 'modernized' rules which make the distinction between sand and soil.

Maybe it's just the superintendent in me, but I'd venture to say 90% of those playing or viewing the original photo will call that area a very large BUNKER.

Now, if they do actually claim it be a "waste area," I don't mind it near as much (though still obviously very contrived) as it should require a lot less maintenance and blur the lines between "sand and soil." However......

....besides the cart tracks, the bunker looks like it gets raked fairly often, if not daily. The islands of grass definetely look handmowed, as opposed to allowing them be billowly tufts of "natural vegetation" as would be present in a waste area. And the edge of the area look distinctly defined, as with edging or constant weedeating, unlike a waste area which should blur the line between in play turf and hazardous ground.

For all intents and purposes, the area photographed looks to be a very large, maintained bunker. In which case..........serious overkill.

Try avoiding the golfer complaints from that area......"I got a fried egg lie, can't you guys compact it better?" "There was hardly any sand in that thing...how am I supposed to hit a "sand shot?" "My ball came to rest in a cart track......do I get relief from the "cart path?"...and if not, can't you guys rake that thing more often so I can get a decent lie?"  I love golfer complaints about the condition of HAZARDS. I'm just waiting for someone to ask me to keep the lake levels a little lower so they can play their ball from just off the shore should it happen to "just barely bounce in."
"To be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing it's best, night and day, to make you everybody else means to fight the hardest battle any human being can fight; and never stop fighting." -E.E. Cummings

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2009, 04:13:38 PM »



From ground level, its a pretty cool looking hole...
[/quote]

Do you have that photo to present?   Is it a Hell's Half Acre for a par 3?
[/quote]

Slag,

As a self- admitted bunker slut, you would find this hole out of this world!!   ;D

Here's how it looks from the tee:




« Last Edit: June 30, 2009, 04:27:47 PM by Kalen Braley »

Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2009, 04:16:05 PM »
Densely plant pine trees in the hazard on either side of the fairway and all around the green, quit raking and dirty up the sand, sow some fescue, serve snapper soup in the clubhouse and - voila!  Pine Valley.   ;)

Bogey
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Tim Leahy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Got Sand?
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2009, 04:39:10 PM »
I'd be curious what folks thought of this hole...for those who recogonize it, hold-off a bit on identifying which course its from.





Can I give a hint? It was designed by a relative of a former favorite poster here! :o
I love golf, the fightin irish, and beautiful women depending on the season and availability.

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