Machrihanish Dunes Golf Club

[Niall Hay]

What are people hearing about the course? Opens in May obviously, but has anyone heard anything about how it is progressing? Conditions? Layout? Architecture? Has anyone played? Where will it fit in the Scottish golfing landscape and will it compliment Old Mach? Is Kidd pleased? How will it compare to his other courses? Any pictures? If you can't tell I am more than a bit curious. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

[Tom_Doak]

We just got a press release this week to the effect that it had been purchased by one of the minority partners, who is investing substantially more money to have it ready for its opening.  Good news ... I'd heard they were struggling last fall.  I look forward to seeing the finished product and seeing how David will handle having Machrihanish as a next-door neighbor.

[Jason McNamara]

Times article here:
http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/leisure/article6094497.ece

Local eco approval and opening dates here:  http://tinyurl.com/d66b3c

[Niall C]

Jason,

Thanks for the link to the Times article which I missed. The article refers to Southworths "more grandiose £500m development on the other coast of Scotland". Is Southworth a Donald Trump company or is their some other development on the east coast that I don't know about ?

Niall

[Jason McNamara]

Niall, that question had me stumped as well.  Searches for Southworth + Fife/Lothian/Aberdeen/Inverness came up blank for golf stuff.  They list nothing in Scotland on their web site except for Mach Dunes & two nearby hotels.

It looks like if anything they have Reebok money behind them, not Trump, but someone else here probably knows better than I.

[Niall Hay]

We just got a press release this week to the effect that it had been purchased by one of the minority partners, who is investing substantially more money to have it ready for its opening.  Good news ... I'd heard they were struggling last fall.  I look forward to seeing the finished product and seeing how David will handle having Machrihanish as a next-door neighbor.

Thanks Tom, have you ever had the chance to visit the site? Any visits while under construction or before? Have you heard anything about the course thus far?

[Joel_Stewart]

I spoke with someone who walked the course last last year with David Kidd.

Returning the the states he confided that he thought it would be difficult for the course to be successful and even survive.  It's so rugged that he felt there was not a big enough market for people to travel and play it.  I'm told there is no irrigation or drainage in the fairways and Kidd was not allowed to move any dirt in those areas.


http://www.machrihanishdunes.com/course/

[Tom_Doak]

Niall:

I walked the land next door to David's, but not his routing.  There is some beautiful property there and I am curious to see what he was able to do with a true minimalist mandate.  (Bandon Dunes is not as minimalist as some think.)

Joel:

Your friend is apparently missing the whole point of golf in Scotland.  I think another golf course over there, built on a very modest budget, could do terrific.  Putting a bunch of money into 5-star condos and hotels as the developer plans is a different story ...

[Niall Hay]

Thanks Tom, do you foresee yourself going to check out the finished product in the near future? Are their certain projects or architects work that you make an effort to go see their work? Do certain sites, whether the designer himself or the actual land itself or even a historical background of the sites/proximity to other great courses, cause you to take additional interest in certain projects? If so, I would thanks Mach Dune fits all 3 of those requirements.

[Joel_Stewart]

Tom:

I don't think so.  He's a member of the R&A and understands what he is looking at.  The economy doesn't help the situation either but it looks like they have deep enough pockets to survive the short term.

[Niall Hay]

Any insights on the course itself? How does it compare to Bandon or the Castle course?

[Aidan Bradley]

[Tom_Doak]

Aidan:

When were those pictures taken?  Are they natural or, erm, enhanced?

What did you think of the course?

Niall:

No telling when I'll get there.  I'm going to be in Scotland this summer for The Renaissance Cup but I already have about seven things I'm supposed to do there, and if my family is going with me, it's unlikely they will want to make the side-trip to Machrihanish.

[Niall Hay]

These pictures are awesome, where did you get them? When were they taken?

[Niall Hay]

Niall:

No telling when I'll get there.  I'm going to be in Scotland this summer for The Renaissance Cup but I already have about seven things I'm supposed to do there, and if my family is going with me, it's unlikely they will want to make the side-trip to Machrihanish.

Understandable Tom, if you do get there I would be most interested in hearing your thoughts. We hope to play in May.

Do you have any really good pictures of the Renaissance Club? Have they been posted here?

[Niall Hay]

http://www.louguzzi.com/beta/images/Scotland/LinksGolfWow.jpg

[Ross Tuddenham]

Tom


“Joel:

Your friend is apparently missing the whole point of golf in Scotland.”

As I alluded to on another article to you not feel that your Renaissance golf club course has totally missed the point of golf in Scotland?

I feel the machrihanish dunes looks to have hit the nail on the head and will prove to be extremely popular.

You have one course in Scotland that no one can play and therefore how will people in Scotland discover you as an architect and have the chance to experience your great work.  Surely there’s no way you can leave it at that for courses built in the home of golf?  After all is the pleasure in building a course not derived from the number of people that can enjoy a great day’s golf?

Which Machrihanish dunes will surely do.

[Niall C]

I saw the course from the air last summer when I flew in to play Machrihanish on a corporate jolly. Unfortunately I didn't get the chance to go and visit. The most noticeable thing from the air is a couple of large waste/natural bunkers (not really !) similiar to what they have round the greens at Castle Stuart. Whats really striking about them is that from the air it is clear that they have been created as there are no other areas like it on the old course or any of the land round about it. Clearly they got some leeway from the environmentalists. The other thing I seem to recall is the shape of the greens were less regular than the old course which I think is par for the course with DMK.

I wouldn't worry too much about lack of irrigation, it is on the west course of Scotland after all ! I assume that if the worst scenario happened they could at least water the greens the old fashioned way.

It would be interesting to see what business model the new owners are working on. I strongly suspect that it will get similiar visitor numbers as the existing course, after all if you're going that far to visit Machrihanish your going to play both courses. Indeed I would suggest that visitor numbers might go up based on the fact that more people might be inclined to go there for a stop over now theres two quality courses.

On the grow in side I heard they had some issues with sand being blown onto one of the greens but I could be wrong about that.

Niall

[Mark Pearce]

Tom,

The routing map on the website suggests that the green to tee walks might be longer than most links.  Did you get that impression when you walked the course?

Mark

[Niall Hay]

I saw the course from the air last summer when I flew in to play Machrihanish on a corporate jolly. Unfortunately I didn't get the chance to go and visit. The most noticeable thing from the air is a couple of large waste/natural bunkers (not really !) similiar to what they have round the greens at Castle Stuart. Whats really striking about them is that from the air it is clear that they have been created as there are no other areas like it on the old course or any of the land round about it. Clearly they got some leeway from the environmentalists. The other thing I seem to recall is the shape of the greens were less regular than the old course which I think is par for the course with DMK.

I wouldn't worry too much about lack of irrigation, it is on the west course of Scotland after all ! I assume that if the worst scenario happened they could at least water the greens the old fashioned way.

On the grow in side I heard they had some issues with sand being blown onto one of the greens but I could be wrong about that.

Niall

Great insight Niall. Between Mach Dune and Castle Stuart there really are some interesting new projects this year in Scotland.

As for the grow in, we are sure hoping all will be complete by May...

[Aidan Bradley]

The images were created last September right after I shot Askernish. The flags were added later. I think it will be a wonderful addition to the golfing experience in the area and in a short time will establish it self as a must play. I am not sure if they have changed any of the greens but carrying an 11 handicap I thought a few of the greens were quite challenging. Will only add to the lore of the area. Beautiful drive down from Glasgow.

[Tom_Doak]

Mark:

I didn't walk David's property so I don't know about the green-to-tee transitions.  Wouldn't surprise me if they are somewhat long if they were really not allowed to move ANY dirt except at the greens.

Ross:

I don't know what side of the business you're in, but I'm an architect, not a developer.  I'm sorry you can't get on The Renaissance Club but that's my clients' business.  We would love to build more courses in Scotland but unfortunately there are other guys over there taking all the jobs right now ... maybe someday another course developer will see the light so you can play one of our courses.

[Niall Hay]

The images were created last September right after I shot Askernish. The flags were added later. I think it will be a wonderful addition to the golfing experience in the area and in a short time will establish it self as a must play. I am not sure if they have changed any of the greens but carrying an 11 handicap I thought a few of the greens were quite challenging. Will only add to the lore of the area. Beautiful drive down from Glasgow.

How long did the drive take from Glasgow? Are the roads good out there?

[Aidan Bradley]

A very enjoyable three hours. Of course the roads are fine........

[Niall Hay]

A very enjoyable three hours. Of course the roads are fine........

Meaning beautiful, but quaint roads or "dual carriageways" and high average speed?

Anything worthwhile stopping at on the way or keep moving until you get to Mach?

Also, do you recommend anywhere to stay near Mach Old and Mach Dunes?