[JLahrman]

Also in Columbus, don't forget about Brookside CC just north of town.  Also Granville is 40 minutes east.  I would agree on the number of great courses on a per capita basis.  Unfortunately, for the most part Columbus's public courses don't measure up.  There are some decent CCFADs that have sprung up within about 45 minutes of the city, but overall the public golf scene in Columbus leaves much to be desired.  Champions is good, not a whole lot else to write home about within the 270 belt.

[Niall Hay]

Agreed, I have also heard really good things about Pinnacle (new Lanny Wadkins) in Grove City. Was told its a poor man's Muirfield this evening. There are also Kinsale, Heritage, New Albany, Worthington Hills, The Lakes......even you stretch the limits even farther there is also Longaberger which has gotten rave reviews.

[Carl Nichols]

What about Carmel/Monterey?
CPC
Pebble
Spyglass
MPCC Dunes
MPCC Shore
The Preserve
Spanish Bay
Tehama
Pacific Grove

[Gene Greco]

 Niall:
        

                                     Does it have to be a city?

I lived in Columbus, Ohio.

You take Columbus, Ohio and I'll take either one of two small towns:

Southampton, New York
Carmel, California

In either of these two towns one could almost play 72  holes of world class golf continuously without getting in a car.


                              Gene










        

[Niall Hay]

What about Carmel/Monterey?
CPC
Pebble
Spyglass
MPCC Dunes
MPCC Shore
The Preserve
Spanish Bay
Tehama
Pacific Grove

Certainly I could spend every day the rest of my life playing Cypress Point, and the Pebble Beach courses are wonderful but there is no "city" within 90 minutes. Also, the majority of these courses are from the Golden Period or Era and although there is nothing wrong with them (my personal favorite era) and Cypress Point is beyond comparison both physically and design, but Columbus is the 15th largest city in the US AND it has the variety that is more than unique even within this board. The fact that there are so many different types of courses and designs makes it at the very least a more interesting grouping.The setting of Monterey is in a class of its own, but the courses are not as varied as a classic Old-School Ross, a brutally difficult MacKenzie (in fact is it the hardest course by the Good Doctor in existence?),  a cutting edge and wonderfully designed Dye and Jack's Augusta?

[Niall Hay]

Gene, the point was that it was to be a city. My argument against Southampton is the same as Monterey (see above), Columbus is a major city. Although there is an incredible collection of courses on Long Island... simply amazing.

[Tim_Weiman]

Niall,

I'd go with an Ohio city as the best golf city in the United States, but not Columbus. It would have to be Cleveland. The city has more places you never heard of and aren't worth mentioning by name, but are decent and you can play for about $30.

[Niall Hay]

Cleveland also has some masterpieces with Canterbury and The Country Club (Pepper Pike). Strong and Flynn respectively....

[Dave_Miller]

How could I forget Gulph Mills and its unique architectural history?

Tommy Paul may never speak to you again.
Best
Dave

[Niall Hay]

What is this Gulph Mills unique architectural history that I am missing? Very intrigued now....

[David Stamm]

What about Carmel/Monterey?
CPC
Pebble
Spyglass
MPCC Dunes
MPCC Shore
The Preserve
Spanish Bay
Tehama
Pacific Grove

Certainly I could spend every day the rest of my life playing Cypress Point, and the Pebble Beach courses are wonderful but there is no "city" within 90 minutes. Also, the majority of these courses are from the Golden Period or Era and although there is nothing wrong with them (my personal favorite era) and Cypress Point is beyond comparison both physically and design, but Columbus is the 15th largest city in the US AND it has the variety that is more than unique even within this board. The fact that there are so many different types of courses and designs makes it at the very least a more interesting grouping.The setting of Monterey is in a class of its own, but the courses are not as varied as a classic Old-School Ross, a brutally difficult MacKenzie (in fact is it the hardest course by the Good Doctor in existence?),  a cutting edge and wonderfully designed Dye and Jack's Augusta?

Niall, the courses listed contain quite a bit of non golden age courses. Spyglass is considered a modern, The Preserve is a Fazio, MPCC Shore is a completely redone Strantz, the Dunes a redone Rees Jones, Spanish Bay is RTJ, Jr and Tehama is a Moorish. This would constitute the list being comprised mostly of moderns. I may be mistaken, but was there a size limit to the city? Also, can we still call the OSU course a MacK? Or a MacK that has been heavily redone by JN that could be bordering on a complete redo?

[Niall Hay]

I'll certainly concede that there are some variety as you are absolutely right with Spyglass and some of the renovations as well as Links at Spanish Bay. I think that Double Eagle holds its own with Tehama and The Golf Club is superior to the others mentioned. Cypress is obviously in its own class.

Renovations to MPCC are tricky as what are they to be considered after the design? At what level of redesign do we no longer consider the course to be that of the original architect?  Scarlet especially is unusual as so many had a hand in its design and redesign, but then again the same can be said for Augusta. Tom MacWood wrote an absolutely spendid piece on Scarlet on this very site under the My Home Course section.

The term "city" was used to that SF couldnt claim Monterey and NY area couldn't claim Long Island as they are realistically close, but not close enough to play all (or the 2 farthest) in one day. Not overly strict rules but obviously within reason. Same applies for Philly and potentially Chicago...

Again the post was meant to stir the pot as no one in their right mind (even the most rabid Buckeye fan) would pick Columbus to live over Southampton or Monterey.

[Niall Hay]

Again the post was meant to stir the pot as no one in their right mind (even the most rabid Buckeye fan) would pick Columbus to live over Southampton or Monterey.

That was meant as no slight to Columbus as I love the place dearly....as the premise of the post should indicate. That said both Southampton and Monterey are special places.

[Kalen Braley]

Niall,

While Colombus is a varied lineup, I find the San Francisco area very tought to beat..and yes while a few of these aren't in the city limits, they are only a few miles away.

1) SFGC - Tillinghast
2) Olympic Club - Lake - Willie Watson and RTJ
3) Olympic Club - Ocean - Tom Weiskopf 
4) Olympic Club - Cliffs - Morrish and Tom Weiskopf
5) California Club - Mackenzie, Macon, and Kyle Philips.
6) Lake Merced - MacKenzie, Robert Muir Graves, Rees Jones
7) Harding Park - Willie Watson

Bonus - Lincoln Park

[Niall Hay]

Kalen,

SF is definitely one of the strongest competitors to Columbus as far as quality within close proximity (I'm giving you Daly City as well). It is a bit top heavy as I personally think SFGC is better than anything in Cbus, but the depth and variety of the city compares pretty favorably. SF is stronger with Tilly and Mac (although also very modified forms), Cbus for Ross. Again what makes Cbus unique is having strong representative examples of each era, not just the Golden Age.

1)   Scioto – Ross
2)   Columbus – Ross
3)   The Golf Club – Dye
4)   Muirfield Village – Nicklaus (Muirhead)
5)   Double Eagle - Weiskopf &  Morrish
6)   Scarlet – MacKenzie, Maxwell, Nicklaus
7)   Wedgewood – RTJ II
   Granville – Ross

Bonus – Tartan Fields, Pinnacle, Heritage

San Fran really is wonderful however.....and the culinary scene unmatched.

[Gary Slatter]

1. Met NY
2. Chicago
3. Philly

[Niall Hay]

Gary, can you break down the strengths and variety?

[JLahrman]

San Fran really is wonderful however.....and the culinary scene unmatched.

I would like to state (as an 8-year Cowlumbus resident now living in the Bay Area), that SF obviously has a great food scene, but Columbus's food scene is much better than you would expect for a city of its size in the Midwest.

[Niall Hay]

Any recommendations as we are going to be there in a couple of weeks? Hyde Park and Lindey's (German Village) have been great in past.

[JLahrman]

Lindey's was one of my favorites.  It's been eight years since I lived there, but here are some places I liked:

Trattoria Roma (Grandview) - very good Northern Italian
Bexley Monk (Bexley)
Moretti's (near Dublin) - underrated Italian, never seemed to draw a big crowd, I hope it's still around.
Martini's (one right between downtown and the Short North, I believe there is another one near Polaris)
Barcelona (German Village) - maybe not the best place for a group, but very nice.
Thurman's (German Village) - HUGE burgers

The Short North always has good restaurants - I liked Snappers for seafood, Haiku for sushi, Rigsby's was good as well.  Not sure where you're staying/playing but based on the courses you're playing you might be nearer to the Polaris area which I'm not as well informed about (it has really exploded since I left - for instance, I was not aware that Lindey's apparently now has a Polaris location).

[Niall Hay]

Great stuff, thanks!

[Dan Herrmann]

I'd put up Rochester, NY against any similar-sized (just over 950,000K population) city. 

Shoot - Id put it up against against any city outside the top 15 largest in the USA.

[archie_struthers]

 


I'm a little prejudiced as a Philadelphile , but

From the top of Billy Penn's hat you can get to

Merion
Pine Valley
Philly CC
Aronomink
Philadelphia Cricket Club
Whitemarsh
Manufacturers
Rolling Green
Torresdale Frankford
Gulph Mills
Huntingdon Valley

etc etc


in less than 30 minutes...pretty tough to beat

[Niall Hay]

I'd put up Rochester, NY against any similar-sized (just over 950,000K population) city. 

Shoot - Id put it up against against any city outside the top 15 largest in the USA.

For those of us who are not as familiar with Rochester beyond the Ross Masterpiece, Oak Hill, what are the other offerings in the immeadiate area?

[Niall Hay]

I'm a little prejudiced as a Philadelphile , but

From the top of Billy Penn's hat you can get to

Merion
Pine Valley
Philly CC
Aronomink
Philadelphia Cricket Club
Whitemarsh
Manufacturers
Rolling Green
Torresdale Frankford
Gulph Mills
Huntingdon Valley

etc etc


in less than 30 minutes...pretty tough to beat

No doubt that is a great collection of golf courses, but are there many "modern" golf courses in the area? Philly is certainly eligible (along with NY, SF and Chicago) for the prize of having the most great golf courses in any one large metro area, but this definition of "best" was also to show the architectural variety both by style and era.

These courses are all awesome and certainly they are a great treasure for a local, but the definition of this argument being strictly based on architecture and variety as key ingredients Cbus still has it. One with an interest in golf architecture could not go wrong with any of the aforementioned cities, but you would be hard pressed to get more different examples than in Central Ohio.

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