City of Los Angeles golf courses for sale?

[Lou_Duran]

This was forwarded to me earlier today.

http://www.allenmatkins.com/emails/LE-CityofLA032309/email.html

Any locals with more detailed information?

Is this good or bad for SoCal public golf?

Ironic that nationalization of important segments of the economy is being driven by the "progressives" in federal government at the same time that their kin in one of the most liberal cities in the country are looking for things to privatize.  It is said that CA is a trend setter.  Anything to be gleaned from this? 

[Lynn_Shackelford]

Lou, I hope I can help you sleep better at night by telling you little or none of this will happen.  The elected officials care less about deficits than they do about getting reelected.  Selling a golf course would have some people screaming.  Deficits in SF and LA don't make headlines and folks don't scream, they just keep electing the officials who create the deficits.
Years ago, there was an activist who's mission in life was to keep from privatizing the golf courses.  Richard Riordan told me not to be concerned about him, they didn't pay him any attention.  Will I can tell you that today the city courses are operated in a structure that went away 30 years ago and when that guy died they name a junior golf facility after him.
Los Angeles is not serious about real solutions to real problems.

[Ian Larson]

The city of LA selling off some of these munis would be the best thing ever for some of these courses. I know some of the supers looking over a handful of them and they are nothing but groundskeepers. They are no more of a superintendent than the guy looking over a park  or cemetery.
My point being is that they could care less about golf, which is vital to being a golf course superintendent.

Selling these facilities off to a private management company may open the door to getting better management in. The LA munis are run down and are sub par even compared to the san diego or san fran munis. They need guys in there that care and dont come to work wearing jeans and a T-shirt.

[Tim Nugent]

Probably the best thing that could ever happen.  When I lived in LA for a short in the late 80's I played a couple of public courses but never went back to any.  They were in horrid condition, seemed like forever to play, 5-somes were the norm.
Here in Chicago, both the Park District courses and the Cook County courses are managed by private management companies (Kemper Sports has the City courses and Billy Casper Golf has the county ones).  5 yrs ago when BC took over the county coourses, I was in the middle of renovating 2 of the courses.  Believe it or not, the main "renovation" was to remove asphalt pad with astro turf that they installed as tees yrs ago in a "cost-saving" program.  New irrigation was also included.  The funny thing (remember Chicago is a big  patronage place) is that BC Golf turned a multi-million dollar loss into a multi-million dollar gain in just one yr.  They spent probably about 200k per course on things like new carpet funiture in the clubhouses, stocking the pro shops, new pull carts, and sprucing up the landscaping.  On the courses, just mowing and proper fertilzation did wonders.

Since golf does not sell "inventory" it is easy for graft.  Starters pocketing a "tip" for getting someone on, etc.  Also, when the employees are governmental, they are just punching the clock and treated golfers like the nuscience they believed them to be. 

[Tony Petersen]

Ironic that the nationalization of important segments of the economy is a policy that was aggressively pushed forward by the "fiscally conservative" Republican administration of George W. over the last 8 years...
 

Fixed

I have yet to make it to LA for any muni golf... However, $20 to walk the Los Lagos course at Costa Mesa CC has to be THE bargain in So Cal

[Lou_Duran]

Re: graft and cash control, I was in the pro shop at a well-known Dallas muni years ago waiting for the weather to clear.  In the half an hour or so I stood not too far from the cash register, I observed three or four people move cash out of the drawer without ringing a sale or leaving a receipt for reconciliation later.  Either they were all Eagle Scouts with excellent memory or the course had a very liberal compensation plan.  I talked to an acquaintance who is in the business about reporting it and was advised that unless I had pictures and strong protection that it would be for naught.  I suspect that point-of-sale equipment today probably makes pilfering more difficult.

Regarding management companies, I've heard a few good stories about the Casper and Palmer organizations.  Both seem to make a point to differentiate themselves from American Golf and Golf Corp., to a lesser extent.

Tony P.,

I should sue you for falsely quoting me!  But if Los Lagos is where you are playing these days, that's punishment enough.  BTW, Costa Mesa CC is run by a private, for profit group.  They share the superintendent with Strawberry Farms, and the greens are very good for the amount of play it gets.  My only round there took six hours starting at 10:00 on a week day.  That type of golf ain't worth it at any price.   

[Tony Petersen]

Tony P.,

I should sue you for falsely quoting me!  But if Los Lagos is where you are playing these days, that's punishment enough.  BTW, Costa Mesa CC is run by a private, for profit group.  They share the superintendent with Strawberry Farms, and the greens are very good for the amount of play it gets.  My only round there took six hours starting at 10:00 on a week day.  That type of golf ain't worth it at any price. 
  

Lou... We played 18 on Monday at Costa Mesa walking & it took a little over 3 1/2 hours. Tee'd it up around 3:30 and finished a little before 7. Plus, the greens are in GREAT shape, an easy walk, some interesting holes and the lounge rules. Weekends, you're looking at 5 to 6 though... Still, 10 minutes from my place on the Peninsula and there really isn't anything GREAT in the OC that I can find... Fortunately, I have sum buddies at Lakeside, Riviera & LACC from my Desert Mountain days, so the weekends are for the privates and the weekdays for the muni's...

As far as the quote, I'm just trying to fight the good fight down here in the Orange Curtain and remind everyone that the bailouts are based on a policy carried-over from the George W days. We ALL know that, but it seems to be getting lost in the muddle as of late. That said I have my MA in Economics and I have NO IDEA how one would predict ANYTHING in the current international markets... Nothing really makes any kind of sense according to the theories that I'm familiar with

Rant done. Can't wait to see one & all in a couple of weeks. I've got my swing back and promise to be on my best behavior

[Mark Smolens]

Tim N., the Park District and the Forest Preserve District didn't sell the golf courses.  They hired Kemper and Billy Casper to run them -- something neither governmental entity was (as you correctly point out) capable of doing.  But selling off an asset like a golf course, or a toll road -- as our dear Mayor Daley has done -- is a shortsighted attempt to rectify the errors made by politicians who should not be in charge of anything, let alone the public fisc!

[Tim Nugent]

Tony, since you have a MA in Econ.  chew on this.  When Reagan took office the US had a net worth of 10 trillion.  By 2007 it had grown to 60 trillion.  Lately we have lost 16 trillion.  So, net/net we are up 36 trillion over a period of time when we had both Rep & Dems in the White House.  (I'm a socially moderate, fiscal conservative so I don't have a party affiliation).

Mark, they didn't have to sell the courses to see a return on their assets.  Selling Toll roads and parking meters is short sighted.  You can only sell a steak once but you can sell the milk for years.  By keep the courses they could dictate terms like rate increases etc.  Remember, golfers vote.  Plus, see whats happened to the parking meters, vandelism.

[Don_Mahaffey]

...policy carried-over from the George W...NO IDEA how one would predict ANYTHING in the current international markets...

No worries Tony,
you've got all the lines down pat, you don't know jack about anything, but you know it's all W's fault...you'll do OK with that for a while...

[Tim_Cronin]

FYI, Billy Casper Golf now runs the Chicago Park District courses, as well as the county.

[Lou_Duran]

 
"Fortunately, I have sum buddies at Lakeside, Riviera & LACC from my Desert Mountain days, so the weekends are for the privates and the weekdays for the muni's..." Tony P.

Tony,

You limousine liberals nauseate me.      

BTW, where did you do your graduate work?  Haavad's extension program at the University of Havana?   Did I tell you that I studied under Hank Haney's watchful eye?  I am sure you saw the resemblance in my swing to O'Meara's and Tiger's.

Re: Costa Mesa's Los Lagos, I too liked the course, though it is hardly anything to write home about.  I did notice in my last two or three months in the land of the smart and beautiful that I could generally get a parking spot real close to the front putting green.  Typically, in the late afternoon when I went out to practice, I had to park by the north fence.  It seems that the rapidly deteriorating SoCal economy even affected this extremely affordable public facility.  Unless it was raining or the wind was blowing more than 10 mph, 3.5 hours to play Los Lagos in the afternoon has to be a record.

Oh, let's hope you get a better partner at the KP.  Just when I thought I was making progress, I went out and shot an 88 last week with some pretty solid putting.  This week I played in a charity scramble and shanked a nine iron.  Very ugly.