Pushing for a US Open at Cog Hill? (Article)

[PCCraig]

The following is an article by golf writer Ed Sherman in Crains Chicago Business;

The temperature is in the mid-30s, and as I write this there are snowflakes blowing around. Let's play golf.

It might be a few months before we wimps get out on the course, but for some hearty souls, the season is in full bloom. Last week Cog Hill had more than 60 golfers come out to play in a single day on the Nos. 1 and 3 courses.

Of course, once the weather gets warmer, Cog Hill will be jammed with golfers who will want to play the remodeled No. 4 layout. The new "Dubsdread" is expected to open in mid-May.

I had a sneak preview last fall, and I thought the changes done by architect Rees Jones were terrific. Jones is bullish that Cog Hill now is in position to be a serious contender to host a U.S. Open.

Cog Hill officials already are working on getting the word out. Owner Frank Jemsek recently attended the annual U.S. Golf Assn. meeting in California.

"We were there to be seen," Mr. Jemsek said. "We were able to say hello to some key people and invite them to come out and see the course."

Mr. Jemsek knows that landing the coveted Open will be a long process. Realistically, it wouldn't happen until late in the next decade at the earliest.

Until then, Mr. Jemsek will continue to make his presence known with the USGA.

"It's like wanting to date that one girl in high school," Mr. Jemsek said. "You figure if you're around that girl long enough, the chances are more likely that she might say yes."

Cog Hill's neighbor in Wisconsin, Erin Hill, also is courting the USGA. Owner Bob Lang attended the meeting.

At this point, Mr. Lang's course, located outside of Milwaukee, is well-positioned. Erin Hills already is set to stage the 2011 U.S. Amateur. It is said to be on the short list for the 2017 U.S. Open.





Does anyone think they really have a chance? Even down the road? It seems they may even be trying TOO hard to woo the USGA.

[Mark Arata]

I would think there is always a chance.....

Major Market
Multiple courses for VIP Tents, parking, etc
A somewhat respectable course.......
Open to the Public
History of tournament play at the site with Western Am....

They have a pretty darn good chance I would guess....

[Tim_Cronin]

Plus, Mike Davis liked what he saw, and with the Western/BMW occasionally out of town, the old USGA argument that it didn't want to get in the WGA's way is moot. With Medinah tied up with the PGA, and Olympia Fields less interested in an Open than an Amateur, is the USGA wants the Open in Chicago, Cog Hill is it.

Until Butler National goes co-ed, that is.

[John Blain]

For whatever reason the USGA is infatuated with Erin Hills and they are trying like hell to justify taking the US Open there. If the 2011 US Amateur is a success then they will likely get the Open.

With all that Mr. Jemsek has done for golf Cog Hill should be a no-brainer, assuming that the renovation by Rees Jones is as good as advertised.

But you have to remember this is the USGA that we are talking about. Common sense rarely prevails.

John

[PCCraig]

I haven't been to Erin Hills but I can't imagine the USGA getting more Corporate Tents (or Companies) in rural WI. Esp. since they can't support a PGA Tour Event there in Milwaukee!

Should be interesting considering R. Jones' work down at Bellerive is probably going to get a PGA Championship.

[Tim_Cronin]

Both David Fay and Kerry Haigh were at Bellerive during the Western / BMW, and both were said to be very impressed.

[PCCraig]

Both David Fay and Kerry Haigh were at Bellerive during the Western / BMW, and both were said to be very impressed.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but considering the huge commitment to the USGA St. Louis has shown the last 5 years or so would you say that it is almost owed to them?

[Phil McDade]

I haven't been to Erin Hills but I can't imagine the USGA getting more Corporate Tents (or Companies) in rural WI. Esp. since they can't support a PGA Tour Event there in Milwaukee!

Should be interesting considering R. Jones' work down at Bellerive is probably going to get a PGA Championship.

Pat:

Silly reasoning on your part. The PGA Tour stop in Milwaukee is about to die, for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the PGA's constant tinkering with its place on the schedule (post-PGA, the last major, when interest falls off; now directly opposite the British Open).

The last major to be held in WI, the PGA at Whistling Straits won by Singh, was by all accounts an overwhelming success from the standpoint of fan participation, volunteer numbers, and the PGA's take. There's a fair amount of corporate money in Wisconsin and esp. greater Milwaukee that would gear up for a major. The financial dynamics of a major are so different than a regular tour stop, it's really an apples-to-oranges argument. (And there is a ton of room at Erin Hills for corporate tents).

[Adam Clayman]

I'd be interested in any details on the "terrific" Rj changes.

The Open should be held at Cog Hill for one reason and one reason only.

Joe Jemsek

[PCCraig]

I haven't been to Erin Hills but I can't imagine the USGA getting more Corporate Tents (or Companies) in rural WI. Esp. since they can't support a PGA Tour Event there in Milwaukee!

Should be interesting considering R. Jones' work down at Bellerive is probably going to get a PGA Championship.

Pat:

Silly reasoning on your part. The PGA Tour stop in Milwaukee is about to die, for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the PGA's constant tinkering with its place on the schedule (post-PGA, the last major, when interest falls off; now directly opposite the British Open).

The last major to be held in WI, the PGA at Whistling Straits won by Singh, was by all accounts an overwhelming success from the standpoint of fan participation, volunteer numbers, and the PGA's take. There's a fair amount of corporate money in Wisconsin and esp. greater Milwaukee that would gear up for a major. The financial dynamics of a major are so different than a regular tour stop, it's really an apples-to-oranges argument. (And there is a ton of room at Erin Hills for corporate tents).

Sorry Phil - perhaps I came off strong. For the record, I love Wisconsin! I'm actually going on my honeymoon to Kohler in October, so I'm all for the state north of me.

I think it would be interesting to see the difference between the majors held at Kohler vs. Erin Hills. I would assume that the Kohler Major is held up considerably by the Kohler Company? How many of those corporate tents at Whistling Straits are for Kohler Co. and other WI/Midwest Companies? This is just a thought.

[PThomas]

i bet Cog gets the Open

[PCCraig]

i bet Cog gets the Open

Paul-

Are you betting for within the next decade or longer?

[Phil McDade]

I haven't been to Erin Hills but I can't imagine the USGA getting more Corporate Tents (or Companies) in rural WI. Esp. since they can't support a PGA Tour Event there in Milwaukee!

Should be interesting considering R. Jones' work down at Bellerive is probably going to get a PGA Championship.

Pat:

Silly reasoning on your part. The PGA Tour stop in Milwaukee is about to die, for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the PGA's constant tinkering with its place on the schedule (post-PGA, the last major, when interest falls off; now directly opposite the British Open).

The last major to be held in WI, the PGA at Whistling Straits won by Singh, was by all accounts an overwhelming success from the standpoint of fan participation, volunteer numbers, and the PGA's take. There's a fair amount of corporate money in Wisconsin and esp. greater Milwaukee that would gear up for a major. The financial dynamics of a major are so different than a regular tour stop, it's really an apples-to-oranges argument. (And there is a ton of room at Erin Hills for corporate tents).

Sorry Phil - perhaps I came off strong. For the record, I love Wisconsin! I'm actually going on my honeymoon to Kohler in October, so I'm all for the state north of me.

I think it would be interesting to see the difference between the majors held at Kohler vs. Erin Hills. I would assume that the Kohler Major is held up considerably by the Kohler Company? How many of those corporate tents at Whistling Straits are for Kohler Co. and other WI/Midwest Companies? This is just a thought.

Pat:

The Kohler courses are part of the Kohler enterprise, which also includes the American Club. At Whistling Straits, home to the big tourneys, the whole set-up is designed to host big tourneys, as flat, level areas away from the golf course host the corporate tent areas and PGA merchandise tents. You have to walk a ways toward the lake to get to the course.

Kohler probably has a tent at these things, but there are several other major corporations -- Harley-Davidson, Northwestern Mutual, Miller Brewing to name a few -- with strong ID as Wisconsin companies that would throw their money around at a major.

Folks in Wisconsin got really excited about the PGA, as it was the first major in the state in more than half-a-century. They really turned out, as did the corporate dollars. I expect similar excitement if Erin Hills lands the Open. WStraits already has two more PGAs and a Ryder Cup on the docket in the next decade or so, and I actually think that might actually hurt Erin Hills' chances, as that would be a lot of big tourneys here in a relatively short time.

I plan to watch some of the US Am at Erin Hills (I missed the junior USGA tourney there last year) to see what it's like. I have yet to play it, but others on the board have. It is closed until well into June of this year for a major re-work, presumably at the USGA's request re. the 2011 US Am.

[PCCraig]

I haven't been to Erin Hills but I can't imagine the USGA getting more Corporate Tents (or Companies) in rural WI. Esp. since they can't support a PGA Tour Event there in Milwaukee!

Should be interesting considering R. Jones' work down at Bellerive is probably going to get a PGA Championship.

Pat:

Silly reasoning on your part. The PGA Tour stop in Milwaukee is about to die, for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the PGA's constant tinkering with its place on the schedule (post-PGA, the last major, when interest falls off; now directly opposite the British Open).

The last major to be held in WI, the PGA at Whistling Straits won by Singh, was by all accounts an overwhelming success from the standpoint of fan participation, volunteer numbers, and the PGA's take. There's a fair amount of corporate money in Wisconsin and esp. greater Milwaukee that would gear up for a major. The financial dynamics of a major are so different than a regular tour stop, it's really an apples-to-oranges argument. (And there is a ton of room at Erin Hills for corporate tents).

Sorry Phil - perhaps I came off strong. For the record, I love Wisconsin! I'm actually going on my honeymoon to Kohler in October, so I'm all for the state north of me.

I think it would be interesting to see the difference between the majors held at Kohler vs. Erin Hills. I would assume that the Kohler Major is held up considerably by the Kohler Company? How many of those corporate tents at Whistling Straits are for Kohler Co. and other WI/Midwest Companies? This is just a thought.

Pat:

The Kohler courses are part of the Kohler enterprise, which also includes the American Club. At Whistling Straits, home to the big tourneys, the whole set-up is designed to host big tourneys, as flat, level areas away from the golf course host the corporate tent areas and PGA merchandise tents. You have to walk a ways toward the lake to get to the course.

Kohler probably has a tent at these things, but there are several other major corporations -- Harley-Davidson, Northwestern Mutual, Miller Brewing to name a few -- with strong ID as Wisconsin companies that would throw their money around at a major.

Folks in Wisconsin got really excited about the PGA, as it was the first major in the state in more than half-a-century. They really turned out, as did the corporate dollars. I expect similar excitement if Erin Hills lands the Open. WStraits already has two more PGAs and a Ryder Cup on the docket in the next decade or so, and I actually think that might actually hurt Erin Hills' chances, as that would be a lot of big tourneys here in a relatively short time.

I plan to watch some of the US Am at Erin Hills (I missed the junior USGA tourney there last year) to see what it's like. I have yet to play it, but others on the board have. It is closed until well into June of this year for a major re-work, presumably at the USGA's request re. the 2011 US Am.

I understand Phil, I was just curious if there was a much stronger pressence of Kohler Co. at the PGA vs. a Miller, Harley, and the rest of the Milwaukee Corporations. I think my point was that compared to Erin Hills the American Club and the Kohler Courses have a (seemingly) much better corporate backing and the willingness to really roll out the read carpet for the USGA / PGA.

Question- Where did everyone watching the PGA stay? Milwaukee? Where most people who visited there for one day or were people buying and using weekly passes?

I have not played Erin Hills either, but considering its about 2 hours north of Chicago it is probably worth a trip to see, even at $150-$175. Considering if they ever actually hold the Open that fee will go up to $500!

[PThomas]

i bet Cog gets the Open

Paul-

Are you betting for within the next decade or longer?

don't know Pat, and i don't know how far out they have the Open booked....i just think it will go to Cog know that the Open doctor has worked his magic there

[Matthew Rose]

I'd be interested in any details on the "terrific" Rj changes.

525 yard par-4s, perhaps?

[PCCraig]

I think the major (no pun intended) issue the USGA had with the place was that it never drained well. At the US Am in 1997 the course and greens were soaked and played poorly, which I thought was a big reason the Open went to OFCC.

So much of the improvements RJ made probably had to do with the infrastructure of the place first, then actually redesigning the holes second. Of course I think he added a pond on one of the holes on the front nine (4 or 5)

[Mark Smolens]

Although the pond between 3 and 4 may be bigger, the pond which was added is on the corner of the dogleg on #7, replacing the bunker and willow tree.  It's now a 285+ carry over the pond from the middle of the "blue" tee box (not the one which is on the right side of the cart path, which is even further back and was used by the big kids in the last tournament held there).  The fwy bunker on the left, indeed most if not all of the fwy bunkers on the course, has been enlarged and deepened.  Unless you're a real bomber, willing to take a huge chance, you may now be forced to lay up to 165-75 yards, short and left of the pond.  And that fwy now looks very narrow from the tee.

On #4, the tee has been pushed back, way back.  The tee on #5, which had been a par-5 but had already been moved (pre-RJ) making it a par 4 -- but the fwy bunkers have been moved out into a relevant position for the big kids.

As Pat notes, the real change will be the fancy sub-air system on all of the greens, which should obviate any concerns about sogginess due to a June thunderstorm or two.  Last fall, a couple of days before the "preview" rounds on the back nine, we had a huge downpour, but the greens were alleged to have been firm and dry.

As for EH, Phil wouldn't you agree that it is much more remote than the Kohler complex?  There's certainly tons of room for tents out there, but we're talking some long bus rides on County Road O for spectators -- I can't seem them allowing people to drive into the EH complex, unless they're going to drastically limit the crowds, which doesn't seem likely.  I assume they had to do something like that at Bethpage on LI, and there was remote parking at Olympia (tho taking the train from downtown was a pleasure).  None of that's an issue at Cog.  Frank J has purchased tons of land around the courses that he uses for the free parking.  Corporate tents go up along the 1st hole on the #2 course, which parallels the 10th at Dubs, and I'm sure the Jemseks would shut down the other two courses as well for a U.S. Open (after all, they closed Dubs for an entire season for the renovation).

Tho I'm clearly and unabashedly prejudiced in favor of the Jemsek family for all they've done for us trunk slammers in Chicago, the pluses for bringing the Open back to Chicago, albeit Lemont, far outweigh any potential minuses.

[Chris Kaebisch]

Cog Hill has NO shot!

[tlavin]

I would put their chances at less than 50% given the USGA's oft-expressed affection with Erin Hills.  That affection doesn't make much sense with me for a US Open.  Maybe a Senior Open, but I think it's too remote a location for a US Open.

Cog Hill has logistical problems of its own, of course, and it will suffer because of its use as a Tour Stop.  The golf course if good if not great, but like Torrey Pines, it could probably do just fine as a host.

[Chris Kaebisch]

The USGA does not like the Chicago area.  Erin Hills offers plenty of room for the corporate tents, concessions, parking, and grand stands.  If anyone is worried about hotels, Milwaukee is only 25-30 mins away.  There also other surrounding cities that would benefit from the US Open coming to EH.

[Jud_T]

Terry,

I agree.  From what I have read, they really want to come back to the Chicago metro area, but were put off by what little accomodation they got from the city at O. Fields last time....

[PThomas]

but with more changes to the course and a new owner, is Erin Hills a good idea??

[tlavin]

but with more changes to the course and a new owner, is Erin Hills a good idea??

I'm guessing they don't change the paper towels in the halfway house bathroom without talking to Far Hills.

[Chris Kaebisch]

its on the right path with the new owner at EH