Fixing the curse of poor conditions in collection areas...

[Jeff Doerr]

How do we do it?

I once again hit an almost perfect shot to a front pin on #16 at Pacific Dunes. My ball hesitated for a moment and then slowly picked up speed as it descended into the abyss. My ball came to rest in an unfilled divot. The only lies available at the bottom of the abyss were filled or unfilled divots. Worse and worser...

How do you design collection areas that are not maintenance and play nightmares?

[Joe Hancock]

One solution would be to make collection areas that don't resemble a cereal bowl. It is possible to make things drain without them looking like smooth landforms.

Joe

[Adrian_Stiff]

Its always going to be a product of bumpy fairways, the collection areas often equate to ten times normal play, flatten/reduce the whole thing will cure but it kinda ruins the principle.

[Jeff Doerr]

Its always going to be a product of bumpy fairways, the collection areas often equate to ten times normal play, flatten/reduce the whole thing will cure but it kinda ruins the principle.

I understand some fairway challenges, but I would consider it a design flaw if too many drives ended up in the same spot. On a fairway you have tee shots targeting a wide and usually very long target.

On greenside collections I see the design intent and don't tend to consider it a flaw, but maybe it is a flaw if almost all misses in a large area funnel to a very small area with impossible turf conditions.

[Tom_Doak]

Jeff:

The "collection area" on 16 at Pacific Dunes is an entirely natural hollow, which wasn't re-shaped at all.

We have looked at filling it up somewhat so the area of the bottom would be a bit bigger ... but with as much play as that area gets, the superintendents believe it would probably still be a divoted mess.  They are going to try first to get the grass growing a bit more thickly on the bank up to the green, in the hopes that more balls stop on the bank before they get to the bottom.

But they need some growing weather first!

[Tom_Doak]

P.S.  As to your "almost perfect shot," I don't think so. 

You have to treat that hollow like a water hazard.  You have to be 100% SURE you get past it with your second shot, even if you go through the back of the green.  Sorry, dude.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Tom,

Sounds like if they stop trying to fix divots in this hole, it could turn into a bunker over time... the old-fashion way?!

[Don_Mahaffey]

Jeff,
"Almost perfect" is the key phrase here. You missed the shot, whether by a little or a lot, you missed pulling it off. Now chip out of a divot and get your 5 or sink a long one for 4. That's golf as it should be, some pins are harder to get to then others and when you miss you pay.

[Keith Buntrock]

P.S.  As to your "almost perfect shot," I don't think so. 

You have to treat that hollow like a water hazard.  You have to be 100% SURE you get past it with your second shot, even if you go through the back of the green.  Sorry, dude.

Spoken like a true architect. ha

[Jeff Doerr]

I do humbly agree with the almost perfect coments...

Growing out the grass does seem like a way to spread out the final resting place.

[Jed Peters]

Last year's trip to bandon was rife with questions like this--especially at Pac.

Is it more a case that the grass doesn't grow as fast in the winter to fill in divots?

[Tom_Doak]

Jed:

All the winter play in Bandon certainly makes the problem worse.  But, some of those little pockets would be divot issues even if the play was in the growing season only.

[Jim_Kennedy]

Can they just add some sand and turn it into a bunker?

[Jed Peters]

Jed:

All the winter play in Bandon certainly makes the problem worse.  But, some of those little pockets would be divot issues even if the play was in the growing season only.

I'll see more of this phenomenon next week.

By the way, check your email.

Jed

[Tom_Doak]

Jim:

If the bottom of the hollow on 16 at Pacific Dunes was a bunker, they would have to put up lights on the last two holes so people could finish their rounds.

[Jeff Doerr]

Jim:

If the bottom of the hollow on 16 at Pacific Dunes was a bunker, they would have to put up lights on the last two holes so people could finish their rounds.

Agreed!

I like the idea of growing the grass out and making it a more natural looking rustic hollow.

I guess in the end it is the visual for me on a greenside collection area that really is a hazard. A collection of divots just does not look quite right.

On a fairway, a collection begins to look like a hazard where one should find reward.

[Sean_A]

How the heck does turning a divot ridden area into a bunker make it better?  Presumably folks are upset because shots from divots are difficult, but at least one still has more options than from sand.  I am now beginning to see why archies just throw sand down to "solve" problems. 

Ciao