DO HIGH HANDICAPERS HAVE MORE FUN?

[Anthony Gray]

 

  I truly enjoy watching great golf first hand. I find that when I play with scratch golfers I become a spectator and play better. BUT I have less fun.

  I love playing with hackers!!! I include myself in this catagory. I am always the D player in the weekend low-ball. It seems we enjoy the game more.

  Around 10 years ago our club champion asked me to be his partner in the member-member. I said I had to play with Earl. Earl was in his mid 70's and a 18 handicapper but as far as partners go a national treasure. Always a blast. (Due to health problems he does not play now).



  So do we have more fun playing poor golf than the low-scratch guys have at playing poor golf?


  Anthony

  By the way. Garland is my partner at the KP. I called it first!!!!

[ed_getka]

Anthony,
   That depends on what you define as a high handicap. I think high handicappers, anyone who has a higher handicap than me , may have more fun because they don't get upset by mediocre shots as much as low handicappers do. On the other hand, I think most of us get upset when we don't hit a shot as well as we know we are capable of.
    The greatest determining factor of whether I am having fun is pace of play. When a course isn't crowded and the pace is glacially slow it almost wouldn't matter if I shot my best round ever, I would likely still be unhappy.

[Jim_Kennedy]

Anthony,
I don't think you'd say that you don't enjoy playing well, nor do I think you would say that you don't have fun playing your usual game, but I think your quotient for fun would suffer if you went out and played like a dog.

It's the same, no matter the skill.

[PCCraig]

Anthony-

In the 1000+ rounds I watched as a caddy growing up, I saw a big range in ability. However I will say this, if my handicap was above a 25...I wouldn't play the game. It looks miserable when people are topping it off the tee, missing greens, slicing it out of bounds. Why would anyone want to do that to themselves?

To top it all off, "hackers" do not have more fun, when they play bad they can be just as miserable as anyone on or off the course.

[Anthony Gray]

Anthony-

In the 1000+ rounds I watched as a caddy growing up, I saw a big range in ability. However I will say this, if my handicap was above a 25...I wouldn't play the game. It looks miserable when people are topping it off the tee, missing greens, slicing it out of bounds. Why would anyone want to do that to themselves?

To top it all off, "hackers" do not have more fun, when they play bad they can be just as miserable as anyone on or off the course.

  Pat,

  The game itself offers the fun. If I shoot 100,90,80. It's all fun.

  Anthony

[PCCraig]

Anthony-

No it's not! You have to be mentally nuts to spend 5 hours shooting 130. If you are that bad I would put your iron covers back on and go home!

[Carl Nichols]

There may be some contexts in which I'd rather be a 13 than a 7, but golf isn't one of them.

[ed_getka]

Anthony-

No it's not! You have to be mentally nuts to spend 5 hours shooting 130. If you are that bad I would put your iron covers back on and go home!

Pat,
  Just out of curiosity what is your handicap and how old are you?

[Peter Pallotta]

Anthony -

Fwiw, I think my experience is a relatively rare one here at gca.com -- I didn't play any golf as a youngster, only a very few rounds in my teens, and probably none at all in my 20s.  I took up golf in my mid thirties, and haven't played all that many rounds since then. Which is to say, I think most around here (who started golf as youngsters) have forgotten what the learning curve is like in golf, and even if they can remember it I'd suggest that a learning curve in your teens is experienced a lot differently than it is in your 30s. I've had to learn to 'accept' playing badly (and to enjoy the game) while at the same time still trying to get better at it, every shot, every round.  For me, it's a fine line -- too much of an easy going nature and I feel like an idiot just wasting his time; too many unrealistic expecations and I end up being a miserable, tensed-up snot.  Do I enjoy not playing well? No. But let's say that I've had to learn to enjoy the challenge of it.  Here's an example: before I took a 2 year lay-off around the birth of our son, I had gotten down to scoring in the mid 80s quite often. In the 8 rounds or so since the lay-off, I have broken 90 exactly once.  On the one hand, that sucks; but on the other hand, around the time of those 8 rounds, I've had the pleasure of attempting to totally revamp my swing three times, patterning it after a different great player each time, i.e. I went from trying to emulate a young Jack Nicklaus to emulating a mature Ben Hogan and now (and I think this one will stick) to emulating Greg Norman in his prime --- although, unfortunately, when I'm actually swinging the club I think I look more like Chris DiMarco or Rocco Mediate than I do Norman. So yes,  I do enjoy it - and much more so than the baskeball, soccer and volleyball I played competitively (and well) as a younger fellow. 

Peter   

[C. Squier]

A scratch player shooting 80 is probably the same as a 90's shooter putting up a 110 in terms of "I played bad today."  As a lower handicapper, I don't love playing super bad.  However, there is nothing worse than a marginal/poor player struggle and roll the ball around all day.  Who hasn't seen a poor player walk into the clubhouse on a hot summer day looking like they just fought 30 feral cats in the parking lot.  It's a sad scene.  If both players decide mid round to instantly lower their expectations because today just isn't their day, a good/decent player can at least bunt the ball around.  It's hard to stop rolling it or blasting 40 yard slices into the next fairway.  Typically golfers overcompensate incorrectly (aiming further left to try to help the slice find terra firma) and that makes it worse.  

When I was a freshman in HS, there was one exceptional player on the team who was a senior.  We worked at the GC together all summer and we played probably 100 rounds together.  I could never understand why he would get so upset when he hit "not bad" shots in my opinion.  3 years later when I was that senior, I understood.  Simply a result of relatively fast improvement in my game and a matter of perspective.  I don't believe I became a different person mentally, but physical ability narrowed my expectations.  As a younger buck, I wasn't good enough to know those expectations and couldn't understand the reasoning behind the narrowed expectations.  

In the end, its all about who is swinging the club.  But don't forget that golfers have different reasons to play.  Some want to shoot a personal best every time they tee it up, some just want a little fresh air and exercise.  Then there are at least 1500 knuckleheads who just love seeing a new course for the first time.  No reason is any better or worse than the other.  

[Anthony Gray]

Anthony -

Fwiw, I think my experience is a relatively rare one here at gca.com -- I didn't play any golf as a youngster, only a very few rounds in my teens, and probably none at all in my 20s.  I took up golf in my mid thirties, and haven't played all that many rounds since then. Which is to say, I think most around here (who started golf as youngsters) have forgotten what the learning curve is like in golf, and even if they can remember it I'd suggest that a learning curve in your teens is experienced a lot differently than it is in your 30s. I've had to learn to 'accept' playing badly (and to enjoy the game) while at the same time still trying to get better at it, every shot, every round.  For me, it's a fine line -- too much of an easy going nature and I feel like an idiot just wasting his time; too many unrealistic expecations and I end up being a miserable, tensed-up snot.  Do I enjoy not playing well? No. But let's say that I've had to learn to enjoy the challenge of it.  Here's an example: before I took a 2 year lay-off around the birth of our son, I had gotten down to scoring in the mid 80s quite often. In the 8 rounds or so since the lay-off, I have broken 90 exactly once.  On the one hand, that sucks; but on the other hand, around the time of those 8 rounds, I've had the pleasure of attempting to totally revamp my swing three times, patterning it after a different great player each time, i.e. I went from trying to emulate a young Jack Nicklaus to emulating a mature Ben Hogan and now (and I think this one will stick) to emulating Greg Norman in his prime --- although, unfortunately, when I'm actually swinging the club I think I look more like Chris DiMarco or Rocco Mediate than I do Norman. So yes,  I do enjoy it - and much more so than the baskeball, soccer and volleyball I played competitively (and well) as a younger fellow. 

Peter   

   Peter,

  Congrats on your fatherhood and more powr to you. Enjoy the game and fatherhood. Great moments at home and on the course with your friends cannot be matched. So enjoy the doubles and the birdies equally.

  Anthony

[Anthony Gray]

Anthony,
   That depends on what you define as a high handicap. I think high handicappers, anyone who has a higher handicap than me , may have more fun because they don't get upset by mediocre shots as much as low handicappers do. On the other hand, I think most of us get upset when we don't hit a shot as well as we know we are capable of.
    The greatest determining factor of whether I am having fun is pace of play. When a course isn't crowded and the pace is glacially slow it almost wouldn't matter if I shot my best round ever, I would likely still be unhappy.

  Ed,
  Good comments. All the hackers know who we are. We do not need to be told by others. Golf is a wonderful game that can be fun even when playing badly. Thanks for your insight.

  Anthony

[Chris Cupit]

Hmmmm.  I do think that playing with higher handicappers has been for me a more enjoyable, more social experience.  I either play competetive golf or social golf and when I think about it, I pretty much avoid playing a non-competitive round with other scratch golfers.  I guess I do think higher handicappers are more fun to play with in most cases.

My wife and I enjoy golf together or with another couple and she's terrible  She has fun but not always because of her game and I know she wishes she were better.  She has fun in spite of her game.  The fun comes from hanging out together on the course not necessarily the game itself.

However I am not sure who has more fun playing the game.  I'm not sure I  buy the "it's all relative stuff" mindset although I'll keep reading and maybe change my mind.

[Anthony Gray]

Anthony,
I don't think you'd say that you don't enjoy playing well, nor do I think you would say that you don't have fun playing your usual game, but I think your quotient for fun would suffer if you went out and played like a dog.

It's the same, no matter the skill.

  Jim,


  If we are playing like dogs and we have all had that experience at least we're still playing.

  Anthony

[Anthony Gray]

  From experience.

  Who laughs the most from the horrible shot?

   Who rejoices the most from the great shot?

   A scratch golfer or a hacker?

  Anthony

[Anthony Gray]

Anthony, the answer to your questions is yes.

Higher handicappers have lower expectations of their games.  They also have higher beta/disparities in quality in terms of the shots they hit.  They don't have the expectation of consistency that lower handicappers have, and as a result, when they're not on, they shrug it off better -- because it happens more often.

There also nearly as many scorecard-and-pencil types among the higher handicappers as there are among the low handicap set.  And they don't play tournaments where a few shots here and there are the difference.  I can't tell you how many guys I've known over the years who simply can't have a good time at the 19th when they've shot 78, whereas when they shoot 71, they're the life of the party!

There's a culture among low handicap players that almost prevents them from having fun when they're playing bad.  For the most part, when they're playing bad, they're trained to slow down and grind.  That's probably the least  condusive thing I can think of for having fun.

  Shivas,

  Well said, If I was golfing with you and JK I could care less what I shot. The fun is in the fellowship.

   Anthony

 

[Tim Bert]

  From experience.

  Who laughs the most from the horrible shot?

Shivas

   Who rejoices the most from the great shot?

Tiger Woods

   A scratch golfer or a hacker?

Both are a lot closer to scratch than they are to a high handicapper.

[ed_getka]

Anthony,
   Now we are using hacker, which to me is different from a high handicapper. A hacker isn't really a golfer and will rarely even hit a mediocre shot, it is someone who belongs at a driving range figuring out how to swing a golf club. A high handicapper is someone who may be a beginner, or someone who just doesn't have much athletic ability but will at least hit enough good shots to want to keep coming back,....thinking as we all do that one day we will hit all our shots good for that one magical round..... or at least that is the dream that keeps me going.

[Sean_A]

I have seen plenty of high cappers (say 18-25) with a card in their hand not enjoy themselves.  I have also seen many low cappers get uptight when things aren't going well.  I think its easier to get down on low cappers for this boorish behaviour because we all know none of it really means much, yet low cappers somehow delude themselves into thinking it does whereas high cappers don't often have these delusions.  From my experience, I would say nearly everybody enjoys a decent betterball match regardless of the outcome.  Its much, much harder to enjoy Stableford, Foursomes, Singles or Medal when you are hitting bad shots.  Many is the time I have switched off with a card in my hand.  All it takes is a bad shot or two and the game is over so far as the comp. is concerned.  Stick to friendlies and one can't go far wrong.

Ciao

[C. Squier]

However I am not sure who has more fun playing the game.  I'm not sure I  buy the "it's all relative stuff" mindset although I'll keep reading and maybe change my mind.

60 yard shot:

Scratch hits it to 20 feet

25 handicapper hits it to 20 feet

Vastly different reactions to the shot they each hit.  One wants a mulligan, the other wants to hurry up and try to make their birdie.  The higher handicapper has no idea why the scratch is upset because they've never been as good as a scratch with higher expectations.  No different than why a scratch golfer can't understand why Camilo flipped his putter at his bag after shooting a 67 yesterday at Kapalua.  

[Jim_Kennedy]

Anthony,
From experience: Enjoyment, frustration, laughing at the bad, loving the good, is not the exclusive territory of either of those groups (low or high), and that includes those players who fall somewhere in between.



 

[PCCraig]

Anthony-

No it's not! You have to be mentally nuts to spend 5 hours shooting 130. If you are that bad I would put your iron covers back on and go home!

Pat,
  Just out of curiosity what is your handicap and how old are you?

Ed-

I'm 25 and a 2.6

[Joe Hancock]

Ed,

I remember you not having fun on #16 at The Downs....your handicap was irrelevant.

 

[David Botimer]

Having caddied for all skill levels, my answer is a resounding NO.

For some, it's due to the irrational expectation of playing better than their skill.  For others it's simply the reality of hitting bad shots repeatedly.

Regardless of the reason, I find good golfers on average a happier bunch than bad golfers.

[Cliff Hamm]

I do think that higher, not high handiicappers, tend to enjoy the game more.  I'll define that as perhaps 10-20.  The higher handicapper has a better chance of beating his handicap by 5 shots, for example, than the lower handicapper.  Higher handicappers enjoy the beauty of the course, being outdoors, the company, etc. more then the lower handicapper.  To the higher handicapper it is a sport and a walk in the park.  To the lower handicapper it is a competition.  These of course are generalizations. 

I might add that older golfers also enjoy the game significantly more than the under 40 or so crowd.  One comes to terms with their own limitations as they age and learna to enjoy the game for what it is - a game and a walk in the park that should not be spoiled by what the score might be.