[Carl Nichols]

I go on an annual golf trip with 20 guys, and we're MUCH more likely to go to Kohler than Bandon because it's way easier to get to, because some of the guys prefer to ride, and because it seems like there's more to do at night (I haven't been to Kohler, but that's the sense I have).  So even if the golf might not be as good, it has all those other things going for it. 

[Grant Davey]

[quote
I really don't care what the maintenance costs are with that kind of top line.  Hell, the profit from beer sales pay for those...don't forget -- it's Wisconsin. 
[/quote]

I usually reframe from commenting on anything Kohler, being that I have worked for them for the past thirteen years. But I just wanted to thank Shivas for the what possibly could be a compliment and to point out that you pay more for water.

Mr. Kohler and the family know how to plan, build and market a product. Think of the village itself, most guests do not concern themselves with the fact that there is a Foundry across the road from the resort. Thanks in part to the Landscaping, layout and foresight which can be traced back to Olmstead, they see a unique and quaint village. They may stroll into the Design center and see some of the other products offered by Kohler or venture to Woodlake and find more offerings, the latest is our line of fine chocolates.

Mr. Kohler was thinking of a walking course when walking wasn't popular, he restored a factory housing facility to a five diamond resort, he has created a brand associated with fine living. In short the guy has  the vision and determination to fully pursue any endeavor to a standard that meets his expectations. When it's done, it will operate like any other bussiness and meet the same ideals.     

[Mark Smolens]

On each of my 8 trips to Kohler it's been on my dime (tho three were in October when rates had fallen somewhat).

And Mr. Shackelford, the hotel is not closed during the winter so they do need year-round employees. . .

[Phil Benedict]

These responses seem to suggest that the fact that only one architect is represented at Kohler is basically a neutral factor which is overwhelmed by everything else the resort has in its favor (if anybody cares about the absence of architectural diversity).

Bandon is probably a different situation since it is such a remote location and started with a low-profile architect.  

[PThomas]

whats amazing is that Mr. Kohler converted the American Club to a hotel BEFORE any golf courses were built there....why he figured people would want to come to Kohler for a vacation at that time puzzles me, but they did, surpassing their inital occupancy estimates...THEN he built the first golf course, then more, then the spa much later on

a fine line between a genius and madness i think!

reminds me of Mr. Keisers decision to use a then little if at all known architect to build his first golf course...logic tells me that I would have picked a more known name to build my FIRST course - i'm not saying it had to be a Nicklaus or a Fazio...but Tom Doak for example was certainly more known than DMK at the time....

but Mike certainly made the right call didn't he!

[PCCraig]

whats amazing is that Mr. Kohler converted the American Club to a hotel BEFORE any golf courses were built there....why he figured people would want to come to Kohler for a vacation at that time puzzles me, but they did, surpassing their inital occupancy estimates...THEN he built the first golf course, then more, then the spa much later on

My father started going up there specifically for the hunting/fishing in the 1980's way before the course opened up. I think a lot of their early business came from Chicago folks driving up for a quick weekend.

[RJ_Daley]

I might well be mistaken, but I seem to remember that the early days of the American Club were some sort of a competition with John Johanesses operation at Sentry World and Insurance, where Johanness had a world class restaurant with world famous chef.  Wasn't there a bit of a freindly rivalry between Kohler and Johanness that was more focused on the gastronomical side of the equation, and didn't Kohler sort of raid Sentry of that famous chef to oversee the American Club?  Sentry got golf with RTJjr, then Kohler brought it on, maybe in something of a rivalry.  It was a while ago, and I may have that totally discombobulated... 

BTW, Johanness was an amazing gentleman himself, being totally dyslexic and going to law school and doing extremely well with the reading because his friend that was the bartender at the old Park Hotel would read the cases to him.  Or is that another urban legend?   

[PCCraig]

What is everyone's favorite course in Kohler and why?

Is the easy answer the Straights course? Is the hard answer the Meadows course?

I have always said that perhaps the best nine in Kohler is the back nine on the Meadows from #11 on.

[RJ_Daley]

Pat, while I'd say overall that it is more of an overall experience plus interesting design at WS, I can definitely see your liking for last 8 at Meadows.  I think Adam might be in accord as well.

[Phil McDade]

Well, this is probably unconventional, but a very good friend of mine (single-digit handicap) who has played all of the courses raves about the Irish Course. Likes it better than the Straits, and argues it in some ways is more difficult.

[PCCraig]

Phil-

I would agree that the Irish is more difficult...by about 3 shots from the tips. While I don't think its a bad course, the experience of WS (playing along Lake Michigan may not sound cool to someone used to an Ocean, but for a kid from Chicago that is pretty neat) makes it one of a kind.

[Jeff Tang]

Pat,

My favorite course at Kohler is the River.  I'd say the nine hole stretch from #5 through #13 is one of my favorite nine hole stretches anywhere.  That section of the property there through the trees and with the river coming into play on a lot of the holes make it seem really natural.  However, I think the trees on #13 have gotten a bit much where the hole is not as playable as it used to be.

All of the four par 5's on River are great, and I feel there are a lot of good risk / reward holes throughout the course.  Hole 11 is a really, really tough par 5 that requires 3 well placed shots to have a chance to score.  The course builds to a great finish with the last three holes being classic Dye holes in my opinion.

I also think the greens on the River are really subtle, seems like every four to five footer has something going on with it.

That said, I really like the back nine on Meadows.  I've never played the original 18 at the resort but if I did I feel like I would be missing out on something not getting to play holes 5 - 13 on River.  That was a disappointment for me when they played the women's US Open there since they played the original 18.  I would guess, though, that there's not enough space on the 5-13 River stretch to accommodate galleries, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Phil McDade]

Phil-

I would agree that the Irish is more difficult...by about 3 shots from the tips. While I don't think its a bad course, the experience of WS (playing along Lake Michigan may not sound cool to someone used to an Ocean, but for a kid from Chicago that is pretty neat) makes it one of a kind.

Pat:

Ironically, my friend grew up in Coos Bay, Oregon, just a stone's throw from Bandon -- pre-"Bandon," however. I don't think he's played the Bandon courses.

[RJ_Daley]

Phil, shocking that he feels that way if he had access to Sand Pines! 

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