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[Ben Sims]

Tom,

Two eights and a seven I'm guessing--back in '91-'92.  Would those three Raynors still score there today?

[Sean Arble]

Well, I won't use the Confidential Guide because that is someone else's opinion.  Plus, there are some 20ish courses listed that are really the musts with the others falling away into good sidekicks or ones I don't care about even if they are very good - there is just too much good stuff on the table to be expected to eat it all. 

For my money and time, I think Jud, Dell, Rob, Jim, and Eric have the strongest sides.  I would have to look into more deeply before I could figure out the best side, but a cursory look tells me its between Jud and Dell.

Ciao

[Kalen Braley]

My unofficial tally for Round 1:

Jaeger would have been second with 28, except I can't count Shinnecock as a Macdonald course, so that's 18.

Mac and Kalen each had 25, giving Kalen the 10 for Shinnecock even though the commissioner disagrees.

Vindication at last...I can finally rest peacefully after several sleepless nights!!   

[jeffwarne]

surprised to see nobody picked Rees Jones with
Sleepy Hollow
Palmetto
Bethpage
The Country Club
among others

I mean if Tilly gets credit for Sleepy Hollow(which has been restored in by Hanse in McRaynor style) and Mackenzie credit for Palmetto(he grassed the greens in 1932ish)

[Tom_Doak]

Ben:

Yeamans Hall was a 5 in The Confidential Guide back in 1991.  After reading that, they hired somebody to fix the greens, and now I think it's a 7 ... some people would say 8.  But none of the courses you listed were 9's, and no amount of restoration would put them there.

[Ben Sims]

Ben:

Yeamans Hall was a 5 in The Confidential Guide back in 1991.  After reading that, they hired somebody to fix the greens, and now I think it's a 7 ... some people would say 8.  But none of the courses you listed were 9's, and no amount of restoration would put them there.

Word.  I guess I did much better in round 2.

[Jim Franklin]

No one picked Ross' Northland CC? Wow.

[Bill Brightly]

I actually started scoring the picks with the Confidential Guide, but that is a lot of work  so I stopped...

So my picks are:

#1 Jaeger
#2 Hodgdon
#3 Jud
#4 Colton
#5 Smith

[Jud Tigerman]

Tom,

I agree that Palmetto was a choke.  The pick was made very hastily without enough thought.  Although I think it is the kind of place I wouldn't mind having in a stable of courses to play for the rest of my life.  I was interested to see your comments on Yeaman's Hall Club.  I wonder how other courses that have had significant tree removal or renovation work done since the Confidential Guide originally came out would fare today.  Lawsonia and Skokie are 2 that come to mind...

[Anthony Gray]

  Whoever picked Simpson and Cruden Bay should be declared the winner.

  Anthony

[Tim Bert]

My unofficial tally for Round 1:

Eric Smith clearly won with 29 points.
Jaeger would have been second with 28, except I can't count Shinnecock as a Macdonald course, so that's 18.
Jim Colton had a clear 27 points.
Jud T. had 26 ... but he choked on Palmetto, if he'd taken Royal Melbourne he'd have had 30!
JC, Alex and Patrick also scored 26.
Mac and Kalen each had 25, giving Kalen the 10 for Shinnecock even though the commissioner disagrees.
Ron had 24.
Ben 23.

I have never been to Bulls Bay, Teugega, or Banff  so I could not put a total on the selections from Jay, JNC, or Rob ... but even if all those courses are 10's, which I really doubt, none of them could have broken 26 points.

I have been to Pacific Dunes, Ballyneal, and Old Macdonald, and I can't say any more than that ... but I would guess it put Tim somewhere in the top half, anyway.

There's no way you think my courses average out to less than a 9 on your scale, so you can call me top half, but I'm in the top 3!

[Jim Colton]

Tim,

 I'm prepared to give you a 29 or 30 for Rd. 1.  Surprised no one picked the Doak's course on the Moon.

[Jay Flemma]

Why dont we also score with the GCA.com top 100 we did last year?

[Mac Plumart]

In all seriousness, for those of you with an interest in "scoring" this draft it would be very interesting to score it using four or five different sources.

#1--The Confidential Guide
#2--Golfweek
#3--Golf Digest
#4--Golf Magazine
#5--This GCA.com 100, if it exists...I wasn't a member then.

This should yield different winners and should show some patterns, trends, biases amonst the major rates.  There is also the Golf Blog 100 and The Top 100 Courses in the World internet site...I am sure you've all heard of it, but if not I can get you the website.

These different lists of winners should lead to more discussions, criticisms, and trash talk all revolving around golf course architecture.

FYI...I am not goofing around on this post, this is a "for real" thought.

[Alex Miller]

It seems to me that perhaps the easiest way to do this would be to have every player rate the competitions 1-14 in their own opinion.
Then we tally those up and see who is on top.

[Jud Tigerman]

i agree with alex...everyone ranks everyone EXCEPT themselves.  there's little point in using the official ratings or guides as the point was not to pick the highest rated courses available but the ones you would most like to play for the rest of your life....

[JC Jones]

I declare brown cow the winner.


The problem with picking a winner is that several people made, as kind of outlined in the initial rules, made decisions based upon sentimental or personal favorites.  So while Belvedere may only be a 6 on the Doak Scale and certainly not rated elsewhere, it is of higher value to me than some obscure course that is a 8 on the Doak Scale but is located in Nepal.

I think the exercise was fun and certainly we can discus the merits of each person's "team," I'm just not sure I see the value in declaring one person the winner, outside, of course, male pride and general chest pounding.

[Ronald Montesano]

Amen, JCJ...it's an exercise, neither less nor more

[Mac Plumart]

I am with JC...why is everyone obessed with who won?  The rules in the beginning laid out the just for fun, personal preference, feel to the exercise.  Frankly, did anyone lose?  Look at these lists!

If you had to play a set of course for your entire life is the guy with Oakmont a loser since he doesn't have Pine Valley while that guy is a loser because he doesn't have Cypress while that guy is a lose because he doesn't have the Old Course?  As a funny aside, someone probably has more than one of those courses I just listed (since I didn't check the results prior to writing this) and will declare himself the winner based on my post.

However, I do think it would be valuable to see who had the highest rated courses per the different critics/raters...if someone wants to take the time to compile it.  It should yield some interesting results.

[Jay Flemma]

I like my idea best - we "call up" three other guys and set up four round fantasy trips.  So Eric, Alex, and Ben, I'll "host" us all at Oakmont.  each of you pick a place.  (e.g. - Jay Oakmont, Eric Muirfield, Ben Shoreacres, Alex Fishers)

Or if you wanna do four rounds at my places - Oakmont, MPCC, Bulls Bay, and Sleepy Hollow.  What four would each of you take our little foursome to play?

Or we can do another thing...try to play everything we own in one year...before the 2010 draft!  Why don't we make this draft a yearly thing - Like we should with that armchair architecture contest we did.  It would be fun to make those regular entries on the calendar.  Again, I'll start.  I'm playing Sleepy Hollow this wkd. (Wish it was last week, I hear the Halloween Tournament is cool).