[Tom Huckaby]

Tom

Things change, people make things change, but you have to feel it worth the hassle to push for change. Yes you have a way of playing golf that is not my way.

It’s down to the individual to stand up for his opinions. Giving up because you believe it’s a waste of time is not a good enough reason, give up because you do not care, well yes I can understand that. 

Perhaps I have a bit of Robert the Bruce in me and keep watching that spider who never gives up. My way of golf maybe a thing of the past but I will fight to retain it, I will not give up. Slowly, slowly, little, by little that’s the way – at least I will do down fighting with my sword (5 Iron) in hand which will allow me in to my Valhalla – no regrets, I may well fail but as long as I did my best that is all we can ever ask.  Yes I do understand, I just don’t easily throw in the towel.

But again that’s my way, it may not be yours - Our most important and harshest critic is ourselves.

Melvyn

Melvyn:

I understand that's your way and as I believe I've said before, I admire you for it.  Of course given who you are, how could you treat this any other way?

Where you have put people off in the past is your denigration of those who do not see it your way; or those who see it as an impossible standard to which to strive.  You seem to have softened in that a bit and although I likely just did insult you, I see that as a good thing.

 

Stand up for your opinions, fine - we all should.

Judge others for disagreeing, especially when you don't have all the facts about their issues?  That I don't see as cool, even for Robert the Bruce, or William Wallace (to whom my wife is directly related, btw.)

In any case this is not the point here.

The point here is that I'd prefer to pick battles that have a chance of being won.

TH

[Garland Bayley]

Garland:  I do appreciate the festive colors used.

...

I was hoping to be blamed for pulling a Mucci. 

[Tom Huckaby]

Garland:

Your response needed to be far far far more hard-headed, as well as putting words in other people's mouth they never said nor intended, before you get that "honor."

 

[Garland Bayley]

/

[Jim Nugent]

Do GPS devices make players play better?  Do they score lower? 

[Garland Bayley]

Everyone reading this needs to post the following in the golf shop.

You are not good enough to play slow!*

*You only need an approximation to the distance to your target, because you are not good enough to hit the ball to exact distances like the touring pros are.

*You only need an approximation of the line of the putt, because you are not good enough to stroke the ball on an exact line with and exact speed like the touring pros are.

*Let your natural subconscious control take over and you will be amazed at the results.

[Tom Huckaby]

Do GPS devices make players play better?  Do they score lower? 

Now that is a hell of a question.

And of course the cheap easy answer is some yes, most no.  And even for the yesses other things could be substituted... like lessons....

 

I like Garland's sign idea, in any case.   

[John Burzynski]

Just like they explained in logic class in high school...a causation is always the result of a correlation, but a correlation does not necessarily mean that there is causation.

Not sure the GD snipet article on GPS from this month's magazine means anything.  I would like to see this tested on someone else but professional golfers, 'everyday Joe's', as the popular saying these days goes. 

I was linked up as a single with another golfer this past summer who had a GPS unit.  He constantly felt the need to come up next to me and tell me, " you are X yards away" before each shot that I took.   Irritating, but he quit once I turned around and asked him a question or two about his GPS unit.  I think he just wanted to show it off, which is fine, I am a gadget guy with other things, so I felt his need to show it off.

I do see more and more of these creeping onto the course; barely a round or two goes by that I don't see someone who I am paired up with or on the adjacent hole either lasering or GPS ing a hole.  And I play on a $20 a round muni.

I guess GPS and the like technology in golf are just like any other game or sport, you can use whatever level of technology is permitted within the rules, whatever you enjoy.  You can still use a wooden framed tennis racket if you want, it is just heavier and more clumsy than a newer model.  Same with wood v. aluminum bats, nostalgia vs. power and technology.   

I choose not to use it, but that is just me.  Not sure I can put a ball within 5-10 yards of a given GPS yardage point consistently, anyhow.

[SL_Solow]

Garland, You miss my point.  Whether an exact yardage helps a player is not relevant. The relevant fact is that many players believe it helps them.  Most are not like Melvyn and unless you are convinced that you can change these players they will continue to seek yardages.  Thus, if one technique is faster than another, it should accelerate play.  I am not suggesting it is the best way for them to play, rather I am making a practical observation based on actual playing conditions.

[Garland Bayley]

Shel,

Did you see my golf shop poster above?

[Kirk Gill]

I played once with a cart equipped with gps. On one hand, I felt like the anti-christ was along for the ride. On the other, as I pulled up near my ball I could look up and in a second know exact yardages (although I MOST certainly fit into Garland's category of golfers who aren't good enough for it to matter).

It certainly helped our speed of play. No looking for sprinkler heads, etc.

I'm firmly in the camp of those who prefer to play without electronic aids, but when the devil is on your shoulder, whispering in your ear, it's easy to give him a listen.........

And yes ! I was in a cart ! Guilty as charged............

[Rob Rigg]

Fact: Using the GPS laser sighter POS takes longer than walking down the fairway, looking at sprinkler heads and deciding what club you need to pull.

150, 155, 158, 146 - for 90% of golfers out there it doesnt matter.

If you are playing your home course and need a GPS device to figure out distance then you are an idiot and hopeless. Using one will NOT speed up your play.

If you are playing a course for the first time and are in the 90% it doesnt really matter either.

This is another money maker that has no place on the course IMO.

Last round I played, I had to politely TELL a guy with one of these things to stop telling me the feckin yardage to the pin because he was interupting my downswing.

Get to your ball, pick a club, hit it and move on - that's how you speed up play. Yes, this it totally unrealistic in America, a pity.

[Lloyd_Cole]

"Still not impressed? Well, consider pace of play. When the 2007 LPGA Teaching and Club Professional National Championship provided each competitor with a SkyCaddie GPS unit from industry leader SkyGolf, all three rounds were completed in less than five hours for the first time in the 20-year history of the event."

Was there an ad for Sky Caddy somewhere close by? 'the industry leader' is not a phrase I expect to hear outside of advertorials.

[Rob Rigg]

Sky Caddie own the Golf Channel - they sponsor Big Break and play their ad with Gary McCord all the damn time (I think that's Sky Caddie - er, might not be)

On the positive side - those f'ers are waterproof!

[John Kirk]

I like knowing exact yardage.  The difference between 145 and 149 yards matters to me.  I'm happy with sprinkler heads and hopefully a pin sheet.  I don't own one of them GPS thingamabobs.

[Rob Rigg]

John,

You are not in the majority in terms of distance importance . . . still good to know you don't own one of those thingamajigies!

Sidenote - Garry the GPS freak infiltrated your Oregon home course (on the public side) - can you talk to the troops about not letting his ilk on the premises? 

I will be eternally grateful.

[Jon Wiggett]

Talking about a product that speeds play up so it is possible to play a round in under 5 hours. Gentlemen, how sad is this thread Firstly there should be a requirement for people to play in under 3.5 hours or maybe even 3. If you can use a range finder and stay at this pace then good if not eyeball it and hit.

[Jim Nugent]

Firstly there should be a requirement for people to play in under 3.5 hours or maybe even 3.

And what happens to golfers who take longer?

[Jon Wiggett]

Well Jim,

not really sure. Don't the tour have a rule about slow play. It used to be 45 seconds to play the shot once the ball was reached. 3 players averaging 72 shot would require 162 minutes to play their shots plus walking 6 miles for the average round at 4 mph is 90 & total 252 = 4 hrs 12 minutes not over 5. A 2 ball (Masters last round/Open) require only 3 hrs 18 mins. I would suggest applying the rules in a pro tournament, Jim.

For amateurs maybe the rangers that are often found in the USA should be required to look. In GB&I, at a lot of clubs you would be told to play faster by the poor sods behind you.

What would you suggest?

[Steve Lang]

   Tell the poor sods to go marching on a beach or in the highlands, with full packs

   and take the anti-GPS holier than thou attitude to another shrine

   and take that "whatever Joe-sixpack does is stupid" smirk off your face, its not becoming for one so enamored of so-called purist mental acuity

  and leave the keys to your ride on the table,..  here's a shovel.. your figgin horse just made another pile on the driveway

   and the cliff is right over there buds,  don't get too close..  ooooppps sorry to see you mistake that last 5 yards !

[Jon Wiggett]

Steve,

I don't have a problem with GPS

I just think it is more important to get round in 3.5 hours and not 5+ than know if its 153yards or 155yards

You obviously are okay with snails overtaking players on the golf course with a long queue behind them

I guess I don't have that 'don't give a s*#t about others on the course' attitude that some people have

[Tom Huckaby]

Fact: Using the GPS laser sighter POS takes longer than walking down the fairway, looking at sprinkler heads and deciding what club you need to pull.

150, 155, 158, 146 - for 90% of golfers out there it doesnt matter.

If you are playing your home course and need a GPS device to figure out distance then you are an idiot and hopeless. Using one will NOT speed up your play.

If you are playing a course for the first time and are in the 90% it doesnt really matter either.

This is another money maker that has no place on the course IMO.

Last round I played, I had to politely TELL a guy with one of these things to stop telling me the feckin yardage to the pin because he was interupting my downswing.

Get to your ball, pick a club, hit it and move on - that's how you speed up play. Yes, this it totally unrealistic in America, a pity.

Your last statement shows you do get the point.  I was worried there for a second.

Gents, I doubt anyone maintains that use of these devices speeds up play in GENERAL.  What they do is speed up play for those who are damn likely to use them, as I have explained several times.  I truly do believe when one considers who is using them (painfully slow to begin with) the net effect of their use overall is indeed faster play.  And it is a pity, but that's golf here in America.

[Kirk Gill]

If golfers would eliminate elaborate pre-shot routines they'd use a LOT less time. And golf instruction plays into this. There's probably nothing that annoys me more on a golf course than waiting through someone's interminable twitches and adjustments only to see a duffed shot. Golfers can suck equally well without all that stuff. Do those who teach the game of golf see it that way?

[Jon Wiggett]

Kirk,

IMHO 99% of golfers don't know what a pre-shot routine is used for. They make a poor effort to copy the better players but miss the real important things. Its not what you do but why

Also, if you are not playing at 5 hcp or better, then your routine if longer than 20 seconds after pulling the club, is too long.

[Kalen Braley]

Talking about a product that speeds play up so it is possible to play a round in under 5 hours. Gentlemen, how sad is this thread Firstly there should be a requirement for people to play in under 3.5 hours or maybe even 3. If you can use a range finder and stay at this pace then good if not eyeball it and hit.

Steve,

That was exactly my thought when making the back-handed complinment comment earlier in this thread.  I find it unbeleiveable that they are bragging about very good players who don't spray the ball over the yard getting thier rounds in under 5 hours.

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