Old Oaks CC(Tillinghast) in Purchase, NY

[Steve_ Shaffer]

I don't  hear too much about this Tillinghast course other than it is the home club of Bernard Madoff who also belongs to Atlantic, Palm Beach CC and Boca Rio. What's the story?

Great looking clubhouse:




www.oldoakscc.org

[Michael J. Moss]

A Charles Allison course built according to plans actually drawn up by AW Tillinghast. Evidently, Mr. Tillinghast had a falling out with the leadership prior to contruction. They found a pretty able substitute though. Used to be 27 holes, but Route 684 eliminated some of the third nine, which they abandoned. They have some wonderful property where the remains of some of these greens can still be recognized. It will be interesting to see what happens with these unused acres. Not the best time to do anything for awhile I suspect.

Of Ken Dye's many commissions in the Met area, this was one of his most recent and, in my opinion, best.

I also suspect Mr. Madoff will not be placing a tee in the ground at Old Oaks again, or at least for a very long time. ...The bum!

[Jay Flemma]

I'll be playing that one next spring.  I'll be curious how it plays compared to a place like Southward Ho, another Tillie we don't talk about much here.  I liked how the greens at Southward weren't as much of a pedestal as some of the other tillie I played.  It was low profile both in it's green construction (not built on rock, so he didn't have to go above grade) and in terms of how laid back the members are.  Nice place, SH.  I hope OO is the same. 

[Carl Nichols]

How loud is 684 on the course?  My home course is pretty close to a highway, but they've done a pretty good job of limiting the noise.

[Adam_Messix]

The clubhouse is closer to the highway than the entire golf course and everything except holes 1 and 18 are across a local road and down a pretty significant hill.  Old Oaks is an excellent golf course;quite difficult and usually very firm and fast tee to green.  The thing that stuck out in my mind was the amount of back to front tilt in many of the greens.   I also wouldn't want to have to make a 4 on 17 for my supper either. 

[Patrick_Mucci]

Steve Shaffer,

Who told you that Bernie Madoff was a member of Boca Rio ?

Old Oaks was a neat 27 hole golf course until I-684 took a good portion of one nine.

The 18 hole golf course is divided by a road that must be crossed several times.

It's a very nice facility.

Over the years many trees were planted that should be removed.
The trees are NOT an asset to the golf course.

The golf course would benefit from an aggressive tree management/removal program.

The course enjoys interesting terrain.

The club represents olde world elegance

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Pat,

The NY Times reported:

His company’s portfolio was ample: $17 billion. His address was appropriate: East 64th Street, a few blocks off the park. He golfed at the Atlantic in the Hamptons, at Old Oaks in Westchester County, at the sunny Boca Rio in Boca Raton. He was reported to have three homes and a yacht in the Bahamas.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Steve,

"Golfing at" and being a member are two different things.

I do know that some members of Boca Rio were hit very hard by the Ponzi scheme.  As were U.S. Senators and other intelligent, sophisticated investors.

This will probably result in additional membership losses.
It comes at a bad time for any golf club.

How the bad economy, coupled with additional membership loss will affect maintainance and GCA remains an area of concern for many clubs whose members were affected by this scheme.

Having 20-20 hindsight makes geniuses of us all.

The guy was the former Chairman of Nasdaq, had 20-30 years of credibility, offered conservative returns and listed a clientele of highly reputable individuals.  He had been audited by outsiders and presented detailed monthly statements to investors.  If investors requested occassional funds for use, they were sent within a week.  So how would you know something was wrong ?

So how is it that the rocket scientists on this site knew that he was a phony ?

The only mistake made by some, and it's a significant mistake, is that many investors didn't diversify.  Many investors had the great majority of their net worth invested with him.

But, could you blame them for over-weighting their portfolio ?
The man had a 20-30 year PROVEN track record, a great reputation and a sophisticated clientele.

Some friends of mine have been wiped out.

I talked to some fellow members of my club in NJ and we're just glad he didn't come to our club because we would have lined up to give him some of our money.          Who amongst us wouldn't ?

If this scheme is as far reaching as some predict, some clubs may drastically alter their operations for 2009, including what goes on with the golf course.

I've heard that several clubs are thinking about pseudo-mergers in order to stem costs.

Will confederations come into existance, collectives where purchasing and other functions are performed for a group of clubs, including maintainance equipment ?

Food for thought ?

Time will tell.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Pat,

I understand the difference between "golfing at" and "being a member."

That same article reported he was a member of Old Oaks and Palm Beach CC among the 6 he belonged. He stopped posting scores many years ago. If he wasn't a member of Boca Rio, where else was he a member- Atlantic(Yes), Fresh Meadow(Yes), The Falls, Banyan, etc?

Here is the NYT article:

www.nytimes.com/2008/12/13/nyregion/13madoff.html?scp=7&sq=madoff&st=Search

I'm glad he didn't show up at Commonwealth when I was there.

http://clusterstock.alleyinsider.com/2008/12/madoffs-golf-scores-eerily-consistent