Best Uphill Par 3s

[Brian_Ewen]

Bryan
Your pic of Gullane looked familiar to me .

Its just struck me , the hard hike up the 12th at Balngask :

[Ari Techner]

Thanks to everyone for all the great pics and examples.
The gathering punchbowl green is a good idea and one I had considered as it would fit in very well with the rest of the course.  About half the greens have a little bit of bowl type lip on one side or another.  Also the par 3 that we are eliminating, though not a good example of one is almost a full punchbowl type green.  It was once a great hole but some years ago they blew up the original green and rebuilt it flat because they said there were complains of too many 3 putts!      It is now the only site that will work for the new clubhouse area they want to build.  Plus its a bad and awkward finishing hole and the new finish might be the strongest hole on the course with an amazing green. 
The only reason not to do the punchbowl is it would not be very natural and would require a good amount of land movement when I think we could build a great hole with a green that is in a pretty natural setting. 
Making the shot a little sideways rather than straight up the hill is something we are looking at also. 
Once we clear some trees that have grown in and alot of smaller growth I will know more about exactly what I have to work with. 
In the meantime we are working now on reclaiming some old bunkers, digging a few new ones and reclaiming a whole bunch of old green space. 

[Michael Rossi]

#16 at Beacon Hall Ontario Canada

[Mark Pritchett]

Here is #9 at Chattanooga Golf and CC.

[Jim Johnson]

Just to raise a point here...
I had a conversation with Canadian course designer Les Furber (Predator Ridge, Silvertip, etc.) several years ago about a potential local project, and one thing I can recall from that conversation was his discussion about par-3 holes, and that he HATED building an uphill par-3 hole. Said that if the golfer ever got a hole-in-one, he/she'd never see the ball go in the hole. I had to agree with him on that one. And, if I had my choice between running up to the green to see how close my tee shot is to the cup, or watching my tee shot rolling into/just past the cup on an at grade or downhill hole, I'll take the visual stimulation of watching my ball roll toward the hole 10 out of 10 times.

Ari, is it possible to build a "sidehill" hole there? Aside from Furber's comment, there is also the "view" element. Not much of a view staring uphill, especially with the knowledge that you're about to wind yourself silly dragging that 50 pound bag up the hill. And the view is nothing compared to a sidehill view anyway. Case in point, Mark's photo of the 9th at Chattanooga...the ridge to the left, clubhouse behind, lake/river below to the right, etc.

Just a thought.

JJ

[Michael Wharton-Palmer]

I cant go far beyond #5 at pinevalley and #3 at Merion..both only slightly uphill but wonderful holes.
Very tough to hit the green and once one arrives the fun begins....brutal putting surfaces.

[Jason Topp]

For very severe terrain, I like this one at Veenker in Ames, IA.  I suspect it is a Maxwell original.  It is a good two clubs uphill and the yardage is 98/134/155 to a very small green.  Off the tee, you want to bail out left because f the threat of the creek to the right of the green.  Doing so leaves you a pitch from well below the green surface.  The hole could be softened by some gathering contours rather than bunkers behind the green.




View from the tee:



View from behind the green:

[Phil McDade]

Jason:

I've read bits here and there about Veenker. How true is it to Maxwell's original design? I've been mulling an Iowa two-fer of Veenker and Langford's Wakonda. Curious your thoughts on the Iowa State course -- still used by the university golf teams?

[Jon Terbell]

First that comes to mind is the 8th at the Valley Club of Montecito.

It is a medium length par 3 (about 155 yards) that's green sits on top of a Steep rise. The tee itself is also elevated however the shot still requires some extra club and the front bunkering uses the slope brilliantly. The green is multi leveled, it runs off to the right so that if you miss there your ball runs down the hill into an orchard (dead), and the bunkers in front might be my favorite on the course. They have the unique shaping of VC bunkers, are quite deep presenting a stern challenge especially when the pin is back, and are built seamlessly into the hill.

I can't seem to find a good picture, if anyone as one I'd love to see it.

[Brian_Ewen]

Just to raise a point here...
I had a conversation with Canadian course designer Les Furber (Predator Ridge, Silvertip, etc.) several years ago about a potential local project, and one thing I can recall from that conversation was his discussion about par-3 holes, and that he HATED building an uphill par-3 hole. Said that if the golfer ever got a hole-in-one, he/she'd never see the ball go in the hole. I had to agree with him on that one. And, if I had my choice between running up to the green to see how close my tee shot is to the cup, or watching my tee shot rolling into/just past the cup on an at grade or downhill hole, I'll take the visual stimulation of watching my ball roll toward the hole 10 out of 10 times.

No doubt I would HATE , the type of golf course you like ..... 10 times out of 10 .

[Jason Topp]

Jason:

I've read bits here and there about Veenker. How true is it to Maxwell's original design? I've been mulling an Iowa two-fer of Veenker and Langford's Wakonda. Curious your thoughts on the Iowa State course -- still used by the university golf teams?

Phil - it is about half original and half miserable.  Chris Clouser's book describes what it original and what has changed.  I would not make a special trip for Veenker, but think it is worth adding to a trip in the area in order to experience some Maxwell greens.  

My suggested Des Moines are sampler would be:

1.  Wakonda - terrific Langford
2.  Des Moines Golf and Country Club - early Pete Dye, some holes work, some do not
3.  The Harvester - one of the better courses built in the last 10-15 years in the midwest.
4.  Veenker - see above.

[Jim Johnson]

Just to raise a point here...
I had a conversation with Canadian course designer Les Furber (Predator Ridge, Silvertip, etc.) several years ago about a potential local project, and one thing I can recall from that conversation was his discussion about par-3 holes, and that he HATED building an uphill par-3 hole. Said that if the golfer ever got a hole-in-one, he/she'd never see the ball go in the hole. I had to agree with him on that one. And, if I had my choice between running up to the green to see how close my tee shot is to the cup, or watching my tee shot rolling into/just past the cup on an at grade or downhill hole, I'll take the visual stimulation of watching my ball roll toward the hole 10 out of 10 times.

No doubt I would HATE , the type of golf course you like ..... 10 times out of 10 .

lol

[James Bennett]

First that comes to mind is the 8th at the Valley Club of Montecito.

It is a medium length par 3 (about 155 yards) that's green sits on top of a Steep rise. The tee itself is also elevated however the shot still requires some extra club and the front bunkering uses the slope brilliantly. The green is multi leveled, it runs off to the right so that if you miss there your ball runs down the hill into an orchard (dead), and the bunkers in front might be my favorite on the course. They have the unique shaping of VC bunkers, are quite deep presenting a stern challenge especially when the pin is back, and are built seamlessly into the hill.

I can't seem to find a good picture, if anyone as one I'd love to see it.

[Jon Terbell]

Thanks, James. When was this picture taken? I have not been back since this time last year and have not seen the completed renovations.

Realized I left out in my description that one of the most difficult features of the hole is the narrowness of the green. The extremely shallow target leaves little to no room for misjudging your club selection. With the green running quickly back to front, if you don't take proper pre-caution, it is easy for your chip get away from you and dribble down into one of the front bunkers.

[James Bennett]

Thanks, James. When was this picture taken?

March 2007, en route from Australia to St Andrews for the Reverse Old Course get-together.  The 'temproary' greens were being rpepared at Valley Club then, ready for the green rebuilds.  Don't know of subsequent progress though.  Panhandle Bill might.

James B

[Michael Powers]

#3 at Beverly Golf & Tennis in Mass. is probably the most severe uphill par 3 I've ever seen.

About 150 yards dead uphill, maybe up 60 feet?  The green is broad and subtly undulating, and there is a bunker to the right and a chipping area in back.  The flagstick is also probably 15-18 ft. tall so it can be seen from the tee!

Wayne Stiles, roughly 1930.

Brad,
You have good intel on BGTC being a Stiles?  It's not in the book and I have not ever been able to find any info on it.

[Pete_Pittock]

Ari,
In addition to Bandon Dues #2, don't forget Pacific Dunes #5 and #11. But pass on the one at Aldebrook in Tillamook.

[Buck Wolter]

For very severe terrain, I like this one at Veenker in Ames, IA.  I suspect it is a Maxwell original.  It is a good two clubs uphill and the yardage is 98/134/155 to a very small green.  Off the tee, you want to bail out left because f the threat of the creek to the right of the green.  Doing so leaves you a pitch from well below the green surface.  The hole could be softened by some gathering contours rather than bunkers behind the green.

Jason- I beat you to the punch on the value golf trip and you beat me to Veenker here -- it's the hole I immediately thought of. My sister played HS golf and took a 12 on the hole as she had a hard time carrying the hazard. Very intimidating tee shot for such a short hole.

[JSlonis]

Flynn's 15th hole at Philadelphia Country Club is one of the best "severe" uphill par 3's that I've played.  I'll have to hunt around to see if there is a photo anywhere.  It's a good bit longer than what you're looking for as an example.

[Rob Rigg]

Ari if you can ever get a pic of #4 at County Cavan in Ireland or #9 - they are two interesting uphill par 3s on a very natural course.

#4 is about 160ish up the side of a hill to a green carved out of it. Right is okay, left is dead as there is a steep drop off. The hole is in a 1/2 bowl (or cup even) with the front open. Quite interesting.

The 9th is straight up hill - you can see your ball the whole way but it is quite the trek - about 180 yards I think. The green is also sloped back to front so you can hit the green and roll off. Devil of a hole, especially when the wind is blowing.

[Gerry B]

good thread
i would include the following including some previously mentioned:

5 at PV
3 at merion east
9 at 5 farms east
15 at philly cc - good call - it is a gem
5 at fishers island - a fitting finale  to perhaps the best 4 hole stretch in golf
16 at beacon hall - good call - arguably the best hole on the course - can be a round wrecker
11 at shinnecock
the eden at forsgate
3 at piping rock -  the redan
10 at bel air - and 16 is really good as well
2 at st louis cc and #12 the crater hole is really good as well

in the where are they now dept - i really liked the old 5th at Pebble Beach and the 13th at Castle Harbour i Bermuda - have not been back since it was redone as  tuckers point - therefore not sure if it is still there

[Rob Rigg]

This isnt a great pic but shows some of the strategy of the 4th at Cavan - it is simple, there are not bunkers, the land does the work but it is a lot of fun - I think a good uphill par 3 is one of the more challenging shots in golf and should be able to speak for itself without needing bunkers, or other man made additions, to make it more difficult.

[Lloyd_Cole]

Ari
I'm so glad I could contribute to this thread without doing anything (thanks James).
After having thought long and hard about the 7th @ RM I remain confused as to how the uphill par 3 is a problematic hole. I like the semi blind aspect to the hole concept also - better players may tend to overthink the issue rather than just going for the middle of the green, as they should. We have a similar, but infinitely inferior hole at The Ledges near me, and I'm always in two minds as to what club to hit. That is always a bad starting position - Architect 1 - Player 0.

[Paul Nash]

I forgot that there are 2 great uphill par 3s at Hankley Common - the 7th, which is an awesome hole, and the 16th, which is also special.

There is also a par 3 on the Edinburgh Course at Wentworth - you can see it from the railway. Not sure of the number but something like 7

[Greg Murphy]

At Katepwa, the last hole discovered was a short-short of only 85-125 yards. I doubt uphill par 3's are at the top of anyone's list of favourite hole types, and certainly this hole would not likely have come about had it not been for other earlier routing priorities and commitments. It was ultimately the horizon line at this location that inspired it as a desirable location for a green.

All in all, I think it works quite well, probably even better than a short-short drop-shot hole. The hole slopes quite a bit back to front and left to right and has a small rolled false front that was created partially to give some view of the green surface. The reason the hole works so well is because it is so short. It gives fits to better players who spin the ball and often can't hit a full shot. They can't help but think about spinning their ball back off the green. But a potentially worse fate awaits any ball hit too far above the hole. Also, since right handers tend to pull lofted irons left, it's not uncommon to see bogies and doubles on the hole for those who find themselves in the left hand bunker faced with an almost impossible downhill shot to any pin cut on the front half of the green. The hole would probably play easier for low handicappers if it was 20 yards longer and a full iron. On the other hand, it's a great birdie opportunity for the high handicapper that does not spin the ball.

Another reason I think it works well is because the horizon line draws the eye upward and depending on the cloud patterns of the day, it provides a really pleasant, variable visual backdrop. It would not work nearly as well with the green pushed to the top of the horizon line or cut deeper below and before the top of the ridge.

Finally, when one gets to the green itself there is revealed a panoramic view of lake and valley. I don't have a shot of that but the third photo below gives some idea. One thing is for sure - uphill par 3's do not photograph well.

JJ has commented that Furber thinks not being able to see a hole in one ought to be avoided at all costs, but while a drop shot short-short allows one to see their ball roll into the hole once every ten or fifteen thousand tries, there are far more shot factors at play on the uphill hole of this length, so arguably the short-short is a better uphill than downhill hole.