News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« on: October 29, 2008, 02:22:29 AM »
I've just had the privilege of spending three days at Cape Kidnappers for the made-for-TV event that will be shown two weeks from Saturday and Sunday.  There was perfect weather for both days and I hope the golf course looks as awesome on TV as it did in person.

I won't spoil the ending but will say that there was a 3-man dogfight on the back nine at Cape Kidnappers so it should make for some memorable TV.  Those guys are really good (and nice to boot), and on a very calm afternoon at the Cape they could really show off their skills.  The course record fell in the process, which is not all that big a surprise.

I also got to play 18 holes in the pro-am this morning with Sir Bob Charles, which was a treat.

Scott Macpherson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2008, 05:16:59 AM »
HI Tom,

Glad you got great weather and didn't have to post a photo in the thread on playing golf in 30-40mph winds!!)

Just curious though, had Sir Bob played CK before? What were his comments? And how was the course looking in your opinion?

scott

TEPaul

Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2008, 05:41:39 AM »
TomD:

Who were the players in this made for TV event?

A couple of years ago you mentioned that you'd learned a lot by basically watching or picking the brain of some tour pro and how they manage and strategize around a golf course. What did you learn from these guys this time? Did anything surprise you that you never contemplated conceptually via design?

Joe Bausch

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2008, 06:54:46 AM »
Gosh I hope it was filmed and will be broadcast in HD.
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Dean DiBerardino

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2008, 08:04:19 AM »
Gosh I hope it was filmed and will be broadcast in HD.

Joe:

Looks like the event is on NBC, so it should be in HD.  With only four players to cover, hopefully it won’t be a “hybrid” of HD and SD that we’ve seen in the past from NBC.

Jeremy Rivando

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2008, 10:27:13 AM »
Glad to hear the weather was perfect, it really must have been a treat to see those guys playing well out there.

The foursome consists of Adam Scott, Anthony Kim, Brandt Snedeker and Hunter Mahan.

A reminder that it will be on air November 15th and 16th.




Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2008, 11:21:17 AM »
On a related note, I was in my dentists office the other day and read an article on the new lodge/hotel that was built at Kauri Cliffs.  Looks nice!



http://www.kauricliffs.com/Default.aspx

Tim Leahy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2008, 01:08:08 PM »
the Golf Channel announce the winners and scores yesterday on its update show. :o If you can't wait check their website.
I love golf, the fightin irish, and beautiful women depending on the season and availability.

Scott Coan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2008, 02:49:51 PM »
I also had the chance to watch the pro's tackle Kidnappers and it was an absolutely perfect weather day.  TomD will be real proud of the way his course handled the event.  It should make for some great viewing as filmed in HD.  Nice to see that even the top-notch pro's are fooled by those devilish greens!!!  I was also surprised by how well the course handled the spectator viewing.  Just a few bottlenecks but tons of great elevated viewing areas where you could just sit and watch without having to lear over the person in front of you.

TomD, how hard did it blow the day after for the pro-am?  We played down off the hill and it was blowing a gale. 

Ash Towe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2008, 03:10:35 PM »
Scott and others,
Do you know if and when The Challenge will be shown in NZ?

Scott Coan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2008, 03:17:27 PM »
Scott and others,
Do you know if and when The Challenge will be shown in NZ?

I think I remember hearing that a highlights package will air in NZ on Nov 25/26.  Would be great if a DVD is produced from the HDTV broadcast as I would certainly buy one. 

Ash Towe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2008, 03:36:47 PM »
Scott,
Thanks for the info.  Very much appreciated.

Anthony Gray

Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2008, 04:51:22 PM »



  So which course is better Cliffs or Cape?



Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2008, 02:03:36 PM »
Anthony:

I have a bias in that debate.  Scoring was about the same for the two days ... a different player broke the course record on each course.  I think the scores at Kauri Cliffs were 66-70-71-73 (vs par 72) and at Cape Kidnappers it was 65-66-71-74 (vs par 71).

Tom Paul:

What did I learn? 

First, that all four are very nice young men -- I was surprised how young they all seemed to me. 

Second, that Anthony Kim's best unposted round at High Pointe from his summer up in Michigan was 61 -- six shots better than anybody else has ever done. 

Third, that you CAN fool the best players and keep them off balance with subtle stuff -- they really had trouble scoring on the front nine because they were taking big numbers out of play, but then once one player started making some putts their competitive sides kicked in and they just made mincemeat out of the finishing holes, which are tough for everyone else.  If they all had a week at Cape Kidnappers in calm conditions, I'm sure they would annihilate the course.  (However, when the wind came up the day after in the pro-am, only one of the four played the course as well as they did in competition.)

Fourth, that Adam Scott is 30 yards longer off the tee than the other three, except when Anthony Kim really catches one.  Adam left himself with 98 yards to the green on the 17th, which is 470 yards uphill.  He did have a SLIGHT helping breeze.

Fifth, that driver is the straightest club in their bags.  None of the four even thought about hitting a different club on the par-5 15th, which is 40 yards wide and death to both sides, even though they all knew they would play it as a three-shot hole so driver didn't matter much.

Sixth, that none of them try to work the ball off the tee, at all.  They just hit it hard and straight.  I think Paul Cowley is right, that designing holes which curve in the landing area would give them fits.

Last, that in the end, the guy with the fewest putts wins.

Matt_Ward

Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2008, 02:37:13 PM »
Tom D:

Was there anything you would add to future designs given what you viewed ?

I personally believe that having fairway turning points -- seen with a number of holes at WF/W is a tough thing for players to handle. Being long and straight -- is what they do best. Create a hole or holes that move 30-45 degrees to the right or left and it makes for some tough sledding if they are unable to do so. WF/W has a number of such holes that feature that element.

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2008, 02:48:17 PM »
Matt:

I'm sure doglegs would rein them in some, but we don't often get property with mature trees to enforce the doglegs, and without the trees these guys approach doglegs the way that Tiger played #7 at Royal Troon or Danny Lee played #7 at Pinehurst No. 2 ... they just rip it at the front of the green and chip from there.

Jim Nugent

Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2008, 02:58:00 PM »
How did the players like Cape Kidnappers? 

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #17 on: October 31, 2008, 03:11:33 PM »
Jim:

They all said they loved it.  But what else would you say when you are playing for $1.5 million?  The NBC team loved it, too.

Phil Benedict

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #18 on: October 31, 2008, 03:53:06 PM »
I just think the whole idea of trying to design around the skills of the world's best is an exercise in futility.  They have outgrown the traditional dimensions of the game. The recourse for courses that host big events - narrow fairways, thick rough, or in the case of Augusta, recent tree plantings - is inconsistent with making the game fun for the vast majority of players.

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2008, 02:15:15 PM »
Just a reminder. The shows air on NBC Sat/Sun at 4 pm EST, 1 p.m PST.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2008, 02:48:11 PM by Pete_Pittock »

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2008, 02:42:24 PM »
Are they playing one course Sat and one course Sun.  Which day is Cape K?
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2008, 02:48:46 PM »
Saturday-Kauri Cliffs
Sunday-Cape Kidnappers

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2008, 03:16:14 PM »
Great, I don't have to muck up Saturday plans then.  I believe Kauri was already featured in that Couples-Campbell SWWOG wasn't it? They had cameos with Julian Robertson, and the now deceased architect, David Harman.
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Joe Bausch

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2008, 08:02:33 PM »
There is nothing to suggest that the broadcast on NBC will be in HD.   >:(

http://www.hdsportsguide.com/golf/
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Bob_Huntley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Kiwi Challenge - Kauri Cliffs and Cape K
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2008, 10:27:31 PM »
I also got to play 18 holes in the pro-am this morning with Sir Bob Charles, which was a treat.

Tom, back in 1971 or thereabouts, three of us played in a friendly warm-up before the Bob Hope Classic at Indian Wells with Bob Charles.. It was arranged by my house guest, Bob Glading, who won the 1947 New Zealand Open as an amateur and the following year won the NZ PGA. The other member of the group was Rolly Joslyn who won the US Air Force Championship by beating Dow Finsterwald in the final.

We were going along and I said to Bob's caddie, he of the limp, who I think carried for Ben Crenshaw later on, "Gosh, Bob is not very long is he? His reply was short and to the point. "Mr. Huntley, what you shooting?" I replied that I was one under. He came back," Mr. Charles is four under and we've only played seven holes,why does he need to be longer."

Thirty four years later I played another round with Bob at Silverado in a Champions Tour Pro-Am. He looked the same, played the same, weighed the same and was as companiable as he was so long ago. Surely, he is one of nature's gentlemen.

Bob