[Mike Benham]

Even an architectural slant, maybe not GCA but still the work "architect" is in the article ...

From today's SF Chronicle Olympic v. Lincoln Park

Mismatch play: Regal Olympic to face rumpled Lincoln

By Scott Ostler
Thursday, October 23, 2008


Oh, what an epic match it will be Friday when the teams from the Lincoln Park Golf Course and the Olympic Club square off!

What a clash of cultures!

Joe Sixpack vs. Joseph Singlemaltscotch III.

Muni hackers vs. pâté snackers.

The hoi polloi vs. the hoity-toity.

You get the picture.

The event that brings these two teams together is the Northern California Golf Association Team Match Championship, at Poppy Hills. The original field of 106 12-man teams is now two.

They're brothers in a way, these two teams from clubs sharing the same big neighborhood on the city's West end. But on closer inspection, the Olympians and the Lincolnians are more like distant cousins. From different planets.

The Olympic Club's Lake Course is rated one of the nation's 25 finest by Golf Digest. Lincoln Park's cow pasture is rated among San Francisco's 25 finest muni courses.

Lincoln Park, however maligned and unkempt, is true to its heritage. The course was built over a paupers' graveyard, which might explain the lumpy greens.

While San Francisco politicians consider converting Lincoln Park to soccer fields or an amphitheater, the Olympic Club is prettying up to host the 2012 U.S. Open.

The Olympic Club boasts two 18-hole, par-71 courses, about 6,800 yards each. Lincoln is a par-68, about 5,000 yards - so cramped that the fairway mice have sublet to cockroaches.

Both clubs are on stunningly gorgeous properties and Lincoln Park even has views of the Golden Gate Bridge. The Olympic Club, though, is like the old wisecrack about an elegant garden: "This is what God would do if He had money."

Fortunately for the OC, Friday's showdown is at a neutral site, because the Lincoln Park boys have a distinct home-course advantage.

"Most teams that come here to play us lose," said Bob Dalziel, LP's No. 3 player. "They get confused and upset."

Maybe it's the trash-strewn parking lot, the three different colors of grass ("Color-coded fairways," one LP regular calls them) and greens with a fungus that causes ugly splotches (on the grass, not on the golfers). The Lincoln greens are slower than a DMV line.

The Lincoln Park rough is roughed up with trash and yard clippings. Some of the ball-washers lack handles and many tee-side benches have walked away. But a city resident can play 18 holes for $21, Monday-Thursday.

The Olympic Club is famous for its three Hot Dog Bill's snack shacks, featuring sumptuous hamburgers shaped like hot dogs. Justin Timberlake told Golf Digest he loves to play the Olympic just for "the best hamburgers I've ever had in my life."

Lincoln Park has no snack stand on the course, although there is a bar and grill. I phoned the pro shop and asked to be transferred. A nice man named Larry said, "I can't connect you, but I'll take the phone over there." I heard him walking for 30 seconds.

In the grill, Sandra Wong said the hot-dog/draft-beer combo goes for $7. The house pours one red wine and one white, $4.25 per glass. The Olympic Club did not return my phone calls.

Ah, but golf is about golfers. And though it would be unfair to exaggerate the class differences between the OC and LP golfers, it would be fun.

Duly noted: The Olympic Club is far from the snootiest CC in the city. Its membership is diverse, and to join the club costs an arm or a leg, not both. Also, one member of the LP team is an Olympic Club member, and each team has an architect in the lineup.

That said, the OC team includes attorneys, an oral surgeon, an investment banker, and CEOs/CFOs of software companies.

Lincoln Park's No. 1 player is an adjunct professor of math at USF, the go-to guy for divvying up the lunch tab. Lincoln also has a retired cable-car operator and a retired merchant seaman.

Now we're talkin'. The old salt is Dalziel. Bonus points if Capt'n Bob shows up with a parrot on his shoulder and knocks in his putts with a wooden leg.

The OC team has at least two players in their 60s, but Lincoln has a formerly dead guy. That's Dalziel again. Lincoln Park hosted the City Championships some years ago and Dalziel, about to tee off on No. 1, had a massive heart attack and died on the tee box. Three retired firemen waiting to play rushed to his aid and revived him.

"I never got my green fee back," Dalziel grouses.

Now Dalziel is as healthy as the Olympic Club's budget, and he's dying to play Friday, and so are the other 23 golfers.

The players all respect one another, and after a roaring-fine match Friday, they'll all sit down to enjoy a beverage, laughing over how the media wildly overplays the haves-vs.-have-nots angle.

Then the OC boys will have their chauffeurs drop off the LP boys at the Monterey Greyhound station.
Same city, different worlds

Comparing features of the Olympic Club and Lincoln Park:

Feature:                                                    
Clubhouse sommelier                           OC   
Guy selling sodas out of his car trunk      LP
Fancy guard shack to keep out riff-raff     OC   
Riff-raff                                               LP
Fast greens*                                          OC   
Fast fairways**                                 LP
Picturesque man-made lakes              OC   
Picturesque broken-pipe-made lakes        LP
Previous NCGA titles^                             LP


*rated by stimpmeter

**rated by kids who sneak onto course at night and ride blocks of ice down the hills

^Lincoln won in 1995 and 1997

[Tom Huckaby]

Ahhh, the dream of all of us public course guys.... to take down the snooty private club.

 

I play in this for Santa Teresa.  Lincoln Park was in our group once.  All I have to say is... nice guys yes, but a bigger bunch of baggers I have never seen.  The volume of low 60s nets they threw at us was quite remarkable...

SO... they are either baggers or something is up at LP causing their handicaps to be artificially high.  The fact that they have won this NET event twice already, and may well again... well that to me speaks volumes.

So again.... GO OLYMPIC CLUB!  Take down the baggers!

TH

ps - just kidding re taking down the snooty guys.  Hell I AM a snooty guy compared to these blokes.  And the main thing isn't winning this anyway... at least for us Teresans, the main goal was to make the playoffs so we could play a team like Olympic!  I bet the LP guys are rueing the fact they didn't get OClub in any earlier round (only finals are at Poppy Hills - earlier playoffs go half the guys at one site, half at the other).

[Kalen Braley]

Huck,

You sound a bit bitter there...there is nothing more dignified than being a gracious loser.    

I'd have to agree though, it does sounds a bit suspicious with that many net scores in the low 60s they threw at you guys.

And BTW, the hamburgers must really be all that if Justin Timberlake will vouch for em. 

[Tom Huckaby]

I too look to Justin Timberlake for my food recommendations.

 

As for moi, hell yes I'm bitter. 
TH

[David_Tepper]

Pardon me while I bask in the glow of days long gone by, but I played (not especially well, I might add) on the Presidio GC/Presidio Army team that won the NCGA team tournament in 1992 (I think that was the year). It was big fun and a great competition, especially the playoff brackets that narrowed the 16 division winning teams down to the 2 finalists.

I think the format of those matches (2 head-to-head matches and a better-ball match in each foursome) is excellent.

Back in those days, there was a separate playoff for both the Thursday league and the Saturday league. We won the Saturday league.   

[Tom Huckaby]

David - very cool and feel free to bask! 

The format remains the same.  2 points for each match - head to head A v A, B v B, then better ball AB v. AB.  Six groups, twelve guys on each team.  Thursday and Saturday leagues.   LP and OC are playing in the Saturday league final.  The winner of that then plays the Thursday league winner to determine an overall champ.

The matches are VERY fun - I gear my year around them.

And my Santa Teresa team has never made the playoffs... oh we came close this year... finished 4-2 in our group and lost the group title on overall points (tiebreaker).  Group winners make playoffs.

TH

[Jon Spaulding]

Mike SinglemaltBenham....so what time you teeing off?

[Tom Huckaby]

Mike SinglemaltBenham....so what time you teeing off?

Well it does mention CFO of software companies....

Need a caddie?  WE must take down the baggers.

 

[John Keenan]

Good article by Scott Osler. The image of the course condition of LP versus O is quit striking. I would doubt the O members would ever refer to color coded fairways.

Tom H

To be fair to LP they did note that the won events when they played at LP which is not I guess all that surprising given the unique flavor of LP. But if they are true baggers give them no mercy!!

[Tom Huckaby]

Good article by Scott Osler. The image of the course condition of LP versus O is quit striking. I would doubt the O members would ever refer to color coded fairways.

Tom H

To be fair to LP they did note that the won events when they played at LP which is not I guess all that surprising given the unique flavor of LP. But if they are true baggers give them no mercy!!

John - of course they win their home matches - that is one weird course and local knowledge helps a lot.  Hell we win most home matches at Santa Teresa and we suck.  That doesn't bother me at all.  What raises the eyebrows is they won the WHOLE SHEBANG twice already, and here they are ready to do it again... that means they win their group, then go through 4-5 rounds of playoffs.... the group consisting of home and home matches againts 3 other teams, then the playoffs being 6 guys at one site, 6 at another, total score wins.

No, home course advantage would not fully explain their remarkable success.

 

[Jed Peters]

This article is a bunch of pap.

Olympic is FAR from snooty or high roller-ish.

Scott Osler, well...nevermind. I'm not his biggest fan, let's just say that.

The article is pap.

[Jed Peters]

Oh yeah, speaking of "upscale" and "snooty", Mr. Ostler must really know what he's talking about:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2001/07/06/CC172660.DTL

FYI, every year at OCC's xmas buffet, I want to run an experiment. Take everyone from my family's table and mix them with every other family's table.

100 bucks says no one would notice.

[Tom Huckaby]

This article is a bunch of pap.

Olympic is FAR from snooty or high roller-ish.

Scott Osler, well...nevermind. I'm not his biggest fan, let's just say that.

The article is pap.

Jed - I think he meant it tongue in cheek.  Heck, he even says directly in the article:

Duly noted: The Olympic Club is far from the snootiest CC in the city. Its membership is diverse, and to join the club costs an arm or a leg, not both.

You just have to remember how "down to earth" Lincoln Park is.  Hell Santa freakin' Teresa seems snooty in comparison.

I enjoyed the article.

TH

[Jed Peters]

This article is a bunch of pap.

Olympic is FAR from snooty or high roller-ish.

Scott Osler, well...nevermind. I'm not his biggest fan, let's just say that.

The article is pap.

Jed - I think he meant it tongue in cheek.  Heck, he even says directly in the article:

Duly noted: The Olympic Club is far from the snootiest CC in the city. Its membership is diverse, and to join the club costs an arm or a leg, not both.

You just have to remember how "down to earth" Lincoln Park is.  Hell Santa freakin' Teresa seems snooty in comparison.

I enjoyed the article.

TH

I think I'm a bit biased against Mr. Ostler. Sorry.

[Tom Huckaby]

No hassles man.  And I'm sure you have your reasons for bias against Ostler.  As for me, I've always enjoyed his writing.... and it is kinda cool these two clubs (of all possibilities) meet in the final of this event.

TH

[Bill_McBride]

David - very cool and feel free to bask! 

The format remains the same.  2 points for each match - head to head A v A, B v B, then better ball AB v. AB.  Six groups, twelve guys on each team.  Thursday and Saturday leagues.   LP and OC are playing in the Saturday league final.  The winner of that then plays the Thursday league winner to determine an overall champ.

Back in the olden days of college golf, that's how we played our matches.  One of the (rare) highlights of my career was the match vs Long Beach St when we didn't have a sixth man.  I played #5 and beat their #5 and #6 in the best ball.  Those guys were cussing and throwing clubs coming up the hill to the 18th green at Virginia CC!

That really is a fun format, have to stay on top of things to play two matches concurrently!

[TX Golf]

This is the same format that is also used in the Bay Cities junior matches across the Bay Area during the summer months. It is a pretty fun way to compete.

[Tom Huckaby]

The rules get kinda weird when playing concurrent matches like this - you have to be very careful conceding holes.  Check that - the rules aren't weird, treatment of them is weird.  Once a hole is conceded it's conceded.  But you have to be careful because in conceding in your own match you also might give away the better ball match, because he picks up the moment you concede... There was some instruction in how to handle it - you say something like "I am abandoning the hole" or something like that - meaning opponent has to play out the hole for better ball.

Also the handicapping gets odd, as you stroke off the low man for the better ball.... sometimes you give a shot in head to head and get a shot in better ball.

It is very fun in any case!

TH

[Patrick Kiser]

All I've got to say is ... where's this soda guy selling out of the trunk of his car?

I was there just last week and on many occasions before and not once have I seen this vendor...

Hmmm...

[TX Golf]

When we played in the junior leagues there weren't any strokes which simplified matters, and everyone had to play out every hole because our total schools needed to be kept track of for some reason. I don't remember why but I think  the team scoring averages were used for tie breakers or something like that. Either way it is a fun way to go about it.

[Kalen Braley]

I'm rooting for the caviar boys to take down the maggot-wagon eating LP baggers as well.  Certainly given the fact that it seems they've rigged the whole thing with bogus handi's.

On 2nd thought, I guess all those wine-sipping, cheese-snacking finance/banker/CEO guys will get a taste of thier own medicine for once by being on the wrong side of a rigged system!!!    

[Steve_ Shaffer]

When will the Merion v. Walnut Lane match take place?

[JohnV]

The rules get kinda weird when playing concurrent matches like this - you have to be very careful conceding holes. 
...
TH

See Decision 30-3/1.  Lots of examples.

30-3/1 Examples of Rulings in Four-Ball Match with Concurrent Singles Matches

When players are involved in concurrent matches, whenever possible the Rules are applied only to the match affected. When it is not possible to separate the matches, the four-ball match takes precedence.

A and B are playing C and D in a four-ball match. There are also concurrent singles matches between A and C and between B and D. The following are examples of the application of the Rules in such a format:

1. A concedes the match, a hole, or a stroke to C but stipulates that the concession is solely for their singles match. The concession is not valid in the four-ball match.

2. A concedes the match, a hole, or a stroke to C and does not specify which match the concession is intended for. The concession applies to both the four-ball and the singles matches.

3. A concedes the match, a hole, or a stroke to D. The concession applies only to the four-ball match as A has no authority to make a concession in the B-D singles match.

4. The balls of all four players lie on the putting green and A’s ball is the farthest from the hole with B’s ball on the same line. Side C-D concedes B’s next stroke for the four-ball match only, but B goes ahead and putts before A. In the four-ball match, A is disqualified for the hole (see Decision 2-4/6).

5. B moves A’s ball without authority under the Rules. In the four-ball match, A incurs a penalty stroke (Rule 18-2a) but, in his singles match against C, he incurs no penalty. B incurs no penalty in any match.

6. Other than during search, A moves D’s ball. In the four-ball match, A incurs a penalty stroke (Rule 18-3b) but, in his singles match against C, he incurs no penalty.

7. On the 3rd hole it is discovered that B started his round with 15 clubs. In the four-ball match, Side A-B has two holes deducted from the state of the match (Rules 4-4a and 30-3d) after the 3rd hole. B has two holes deducted from the state of his singles match against D. A incurs no penalty in his singles match against C.

8. During the round, B made a stroke with a non-conforming club. In the four-ball match, Side A-B is disqualified (Rules 4-1 and 30-3e). B is disqualified in his singles match against D. A incurs no penalty in his singles match against C.

9. On the 5th hole, B holes out in 3 to win the hole for Side A-B in the four-ball match. A has a putt left to win or halve the hole in his singles match against C and asks B for advice. There is no penalty to either player. A and B may exchange advice at any time until the four-ball match has been concluded, at which point A and B are no longer partners and become outside agencies with respect to each other.

[Tom Huckaby]

Thanks, John!

Our captain goes over that with us before the start of each season.... still, it shouldn't surprise you it gets screwed up fairly often - particularly example 2.. and sometimes 9.

TH

[Mike Benham]

Mike SinglemaltBenham....so what time you teeing off?

I am in the lower class of members, I have a big "NHGP" on my forehead which makes me ineligible for these events ...

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