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Phil Benedict

  • Karma: +0/-0
Have Player Architects Made Golf Harder?
« on: October 26, 2008, 09:33:02 AM »
My brother just played some Nicklaus course on or near Hilton Head. He's a low single digit handicap but he hated the course from the gitgo because it's just too hard.

This got me wondering whether the proliferation of player architects has made courses more difficult. First of all, pros spend most of their time on more difficult courses.  Second, things that intimidate regular golfers (eg water hazards) don't bother pros so much.  Pros don't have to worry about lost balls. Their perspective on what's hard is so different from the rest of us, they may tend to design harder courses without even thinking about it.

Dean Stokes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Have Player Architects Made Golf Harder?
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2008, 09:39:00 AM »
No, but I wish they did make them harder.

Golf is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a challenge and the advent of modern technology is making it easier.

I have never played a golf course that was too hard but I have played many that were completely boring as they were too easy.

Jack, if you are reading this - "please toughen up your course designs". :D

Living The Dream in The Palm Beaches....golfing, yoga-ing, horsing around and working damn it!!!!!!!

Ken Moum

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Have Player Architects Made Golf Harder?
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2008, 07:49:47 PM »
Actually, I think very good players have affected both architecture and maintenance/evolution of courses to make them too hard for about 90 percent of golfers.

Meanwhile, the courses haven't gotten harder at all for them.

The difference, IMHO is in the kinds of things you infer. Forced carries, narrow fairways, tall seondart rough, lots of trees, large numbers of bunkers and ultra-fast greens are some examples that cause the typical amateur to lose balls and pile upstrokes, while the best players either don't "interface" with them, or actually prefer them (Fast greens, for instance).

Although it's rare, you could end up with is a course that's boring for good players and almost impossible for everyone else.

I'm the only person I know who has any interest at all in architecture, and players I know who are under about a 4 handicap almost all think good = hard.  They say things like, "Rough is the only defense this course has."

So you end up with 25-yard fairways.

OTOH, it's a waste of time trying to get average players to move up a tee or two, even if there are only a couple of par fours they can reach in two shots.

K
Over time, the guy in the ideal position derives an advantage, and delivering him further  advantage is not worth making the rest of the players suffer at the expense of fun, variety, and ultimately cost -- Jeff Warne, 12-08-2010

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Have Player Architects Made Golf Harder?
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2008, 01:40:54 AM »
I don't think that player/architects have really changed what the rest of architects build.

However, MANY clients ask architects to build them a tough course because they think that players like tough courses, and they think that tough courses generate more press. 

Jim Nugent

Re: Have Player Architects Made Golf Harder?
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2008, 02:57:25 AM »
A few top player/architects:

Old Tom
CBM
Park
Crenshaw
Herbert Strong
Braid
Travis

Did they make golf harder, or did they make it better? 



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