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Tiger_Bernhardt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Shinny versus Atlantic
« on: October 11, 2008, 05:09:18 PM »
Is this a perfect set of courses to use to compare modern archtecure versus classical. They are on simliar tracts of land a few miles apart. They both have plenty of resources to draw upon for budget etc. However Shinny is a gem of a classical course that has stood the test of time. There is very little obvious dirt movement. Yet Atlantic which is also a very good corse uses conotainment and mounding over and over which frankly takes away from the design. It had a huge buget yet still has drainage issues. I am curious what others think. Cheers and Go Tigers, gators suck

PThomas

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2008, 05:39:01 PM »
Hi Tiger

i've been to neither, but fwiw someone recently told me that they have softened up the mounding at Atlantic!  maybe not enough...
199 played, only Augusta National left to play!

Patrick_Mucci

Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2008, 05:51:25 PM »
Tiger,

Atantic's site is far from a good one, Shinnecock's site is a great one.

Atlantic had an abundance of environmental and permitting issues, Shinnecock had none.

Atlantic hasn't had several architects reworking the golf course, Shinnecock has.

Tiger_Bernhardt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2008, 06:02:33 PM »
Pat but Atlantic had one great architect whom you defend with tireless spirit. He would be one Rees Jones. What is wrong with Atlantic's site? Modern times dictate permitting environmental etc. It is the mounding that creates the first jolt to the senses.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2008, 10:33:20 PM by Tiger_Bernhardt »

wsmorrison

Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2008, 07:07:36 PM »
Atlantic hasn't had several architects reworking the golf course, Shinnecock has.

It took SHGC a while, but they finally found one with real talent  ;)

SB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2008, 08:17:11 PM »
Shinnecock is one of the top courses in the world, currently ranked the number 4 course in the country.  Why compare anything to it.  Why didn't you compare Atlantic to West Hampton or Southampton? 

Ed Oden

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2008, 09:15:09 PM »
Seems to me Shinnecock and Friars Head have more in common in terms of the site.  Wouldn't that be a better comparison? 

Mike Sweeney

Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2008, 10:10:58 PM »
Pat but Atlantic had one great one whom you defend with tireless spirit. He would be one Rees Jones. What is wrong with Atlantic's site. Modern times dictate permitting enviroenmental etc. It is the mounding that creates the first jolt to the senses.

Tiger,

Shinnecock was all but fogotten from Top 100 list in the 70's. Mounding by Rees is old news, most here do not like it.

The Atlantic site is more rolling and flatter that Shinnecock. It was a farm first. Shinnecock was raw land and has elevation, long vistas, National next door, water views, bumps and nooks and cannies on the back and is flatter on the front which is where the weaker holes reside. While not on the water, Shinnecock sits in what is probably the narrowest peninsula on Long Island and it has to be one of the highest vistas in the area. It is way more sandy up at Shinnecock than out in Water Mill and Bridgehampton area which has less sand base which is why you see more farms.

Rees clearly had wetlands at Atlantic and I think he did a great job of incorporating them into the course property. I think Atlantic is at least a very good course sitting in the Top 15 on Long Island which is a tough neighborhood.

By the way, Hampton Hills GC has the Pine Valley of great sites out in the Pine Barrens just north of Westhampton. It could have been awesome, but it isn't.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2008, 10:25:19 PM by Mike Sweeney »

Tiger_Bernhardt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Shinny versus Atlantic
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2008, 10:45:42 PM »
Mike I thought Atlantic had a good and not significantly lesser a site. It does not have  National for a neighbor and lesser distant vistas than Shinny. However the view of the course from the clubhouse seems much alike to me. I found the green complexes to be very good at Atlantic but much of the earth work took away from them and the holes in general. It was needless movement of dirt which detracts from the holes and adds little to nothing which is my point on this. I am not sure it belongs in a top anything on Long Island or a larger area. I see very little in common with Friars Head other than both being modern and on Long Island. Also I am hard pressed to discuss any hole for they were not as memorable as a really good course should be. The staff was great as was the club. It was the architecture and construction that got me. I also found the course way to healthy grass wise but that could have been the day so no real comment there.

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