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Adrian_Stiff

  • Karma: +0/-0
New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« on: September 20, 2008, 09:27:47 AM »
The new Golf World Course rankings are out; Turnberry got the #1. The Castle course was the highest new course at #67, Remedy Oak made it at #89, New Zealand got back in at #91, Dundonald new at 93. St Andrews New (last time 70) is no longer top 100, K Club was a big dropper too, Queens Course at Gleneagles was another casualty, newish courses St Andrews bay (Torrance), The Grove and The Wisley also dropped out the 100.
They also listed the next 100 (though not in any order this time) , Renaissance Club was included, Celtic 2010 and St Pierr got back in.
1. Turnberry
2. R C Down
3. R Birkdale
4. TOC
5. Muirf
6. Carnasty
7. R Portrush
8. Woodhall spa
9. Loch Lomond
10. Sunningdale old
11. Dornoch
12. Kingsbarns
13. Waterville
14. Ballybun
15. Hoylake
16. RSG
17. Lytham
18. Portmarnock
19. European
20. Wentworth west
21. Walton old
22. Saunton east
23. Troon
24. Sunningdae new
25. Nairn
26. County Louth
27. Ganton
28. Lahinch
29. West Sussex
30. Glen Kings
31. Formby
32. N berwick
33. Berk red
34. Prestwick
35. Alwoodly
36. Aberdeen
37. Doonbeg
38. St Enodoc
39. Deal
40. Porthcawl
41. West Gailes
42. St Davids
43. Hillside
44. Notts
45. machrihanish
46. West Norfolk
47. Carne
48. Silloth
49. St G hill
50. Cruden Bay
51. Rye
52. Swinley
53. Woburn Marq
54 Wentworth East
55 Little Aston
56. Gull #1
57 C Sligo
58 Blairgowrie
59. Donegal
60.Ballyliffen
61. Island
62. Machrie
63. Woburn Duke
64. berk blue
65. Aldeburgh
66. Walton new
67. The Castle Course
68. Hunstanton
69. B & berr
70. M Juliet
71. Old head of kins
72. Ferndown old
73. Adare
74. hankley
75. Lindrick
76. Tralee
77. Woking
78. Worpl
79. Southerness
80. C House monty
81. Rosapenna
82. Chart hills
83. Aberdovey
84. broadstone
85. Addington
86. West hill
87. Castletown
88. Gleneagles Cent
89. Remedy Oak
90. RAF
91. New Zeal
92. druids Glen
93. Dundonald
94. K Club
95. Nefyn
96. Belfry
97. South & Ains
98. Dukes Course ST And
99. Goodwood
100. St Mellion
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Matthew Hunt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2008, 09:32:17 AM »
Is this the one RCD has been at #2 for last few editions?

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2008, 09:45:22 AM »
Sorry to see Brora's too brief tenure in the top 100 come to an end! :(

Melvyn Morrow

Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2008, 10:02:20 AM »
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I believe it just goes to show how good these rankings are. They reflect the opinions of the few and are as accurate as the Good Wine Guide.   

Tom Birkert

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2008, 10:12:03 AM »
Hoylake above RSG? Loch Lomond above Sunningdale?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2008, 10:15:00 AM »
I don't see the point of this list.  Year-to-year changes are mostly background noise, and there is maybe one new course every five years that deserves to crack the top 75.  (If a new course finishes 85th, it will likely be gone in favor of the next new course pretty soon.)

I guess they just think everyone is a sucker for lists even if it's a list that never changes.

Jon Wiggett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2008, 12:55:01 PM »
Who has played Remedy Oak? is it really top 100?

Brian_Ewen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2008, 01:11:39 AM »
I played Turnberry twice last week , and even taking the horrible weather we have had this summer , I thought the condition of it was terrible .

The member I was playing with , said the rumour was they were closing it down in October , and that was it until the Open in July .

Jim Nugent

Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2008, 01:32:30 AM »
Would any of you place Belfry in the top 100?

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2008, 05:00:06 AM »
Jim

I can see Belfry as a bottom of the list top 100 course - though it wouldn't make my list.  In fact, my list wouldn't go to 100.  75 is more than ample spots to pick the best of GB&I   

The two I don't understand are Nefyn & St Mellion. 

I have never heard of RAF or Remedy Oak. 

No mention of Brora, Beau Desert, Tenby, Huntercombe, Princes, Wallasey, or Pennard - comfortable top 100s all more deserving than Hillside. 

It is heartening to see courses like Addington, Donegal & Castletown continue to garner some accolades despite very few people talking them up. 

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Brian Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2008, 05:14:18 AM »
I am staying in Donegal for a week from next week....so it looks like the course is worth a visit then?

I would not put the course in the Top 100 at all.  I played the Ryder Cup week when it got canceled in 2001. I had tickets to the event but as everyone knows it was postponed to the year after.  Anyway I played the same week and even though it was in immaculate condition I was bored to tears....

Turnberry is one of my favourite courses in the world but I wouldn't put it ahead of Royal County Down.  I cannot understand the popularity of Royal Birkdale which I find to be one of the most uninteresting links courses on the Open rota.

Bunkers, if they be good bunkers, and bunkers of strong character, refuse to be disregarded, and insist on asserting themselves; they do not mind being avoided, but they decline to be ignored - John Low Concerning Golf

Kevin Pallier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2008, 07:55:40 AM »
It continues to amaze me why Turnberry gets rated so highly  >:(

Swinley and St Georges Hill should be better ranked than what they are.

Jim

I certainly wouldn't play The Belfry before Brora....

Jonathan Cummings

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2008, 07:58:54 AM »
I don't see the point of this list.  Year-to-year changes are mostly background noise, and there is maybe one new course every five years that deserves to crack the top 75.  (If a new course finishes 85th, it will likely be gone in favor of the next new course pretty soon.)

I guess they just think everyone is a sucker for lists even if it's a list that never changes.

Good point Tom.  The same may well come to the US lists.  As fewer and fewer courses are built our US will become more static.

JC

Adrian_Stiff

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2008, 08:17:28 AM »
The Golf World top 100 GB & I is bi-annual and is certainly the most respected and definitive list. Its panel is comprised of architects, writers, and in fairness it is pretty fair. There will always be a few raised eyebrows of certain positions, and the top 100 is a collation of 100 voters. I met one the other day Dale Concannon and I was amazed when I spoke to him afterwards how much he took in re the course in just one visit (probably more than most would in 30 visits). His opinion about courses fairly corresponded with mine, I also think that this latest list would fairly correspond with TDs CG, I dont think much would be a point out.

Remedy Oak is pretty good to outstanding according to some of my friends that have played it, the worst comment I have heard is that it could have been even better.

The Belfry is much better as time has gone by, if you strip the course down there are not too many flaws now, its very 'American' with fountains and lakes, but the majority like those things. Its still a must play because of the history for Brits although its too be skipped when you all come across as there are more interesting plays.

I saw Turnberry for the first time last year and I was impressed, Troon I was dissapointed (in half the course) and Prestwick was kinda WOW!!! although it sorta needs a redo to take out the 'sillys'. Dundonald was quite nice, Barrasie very nice (never even made the 200!)

For me I would find it hard not to have either Muirfield or TOC at the top, great golf courses are like pretty girls they are all nice but maybe the ones that smiled back we favour.
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Marty Bonnar

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2008, 08:39:35 AM »

I have never heard of RAF or Remedy Oak.  


Sean,
Royal Ashdown Forest perchance?

cheers,
Effers.
The White River runs dark through the heart of the Town,
Washed the people coal-black from the hole in the ground.

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2008, 02:15:02 PM »
If anyone can post a link to see the rankings online, that would be appreciated. Thanks!

Ash Towe

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2008, 03:17:20 PM »
For those guys who have played Waterville since the changes made by Fazio, and Ballybunion, does Waterville deserve to be ranked higher.  I have never played either.

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2008, 04:59:33 AM »
As much as lists mean little, this is the one I wait for... As Adrian said, it's biennial and has a large ratings panel...

That said, the changes are all cosmetic really... although it's interesting to see that they have got rid of one of their previous rulings - that a new course had to be open at the time of the previous rankings to qualify for entry... i.e. that it had to be at leat 2 years old... this was surely so that they could consider The Castle Course... But with that decision, I'm disappointed not to see The Renaissance in there...

As for The Belfry, I was pretty much bored by it as well...

The most significant new entry appears to be the Dukes Course at St Andrews... seems to give a thumbs up to the changes of a few years ago.


Paul Nash

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #18 on: September 22, 2008, 09:24:00 AM »
I just went to buy this - is it the one with Faldo on the front saying "how we are going to win the Ryder cup"?!! If so, there is no mention of Top 100 - this was the October Issue. Just wondering if this was an old version and if the Top 100 is the November edition?

While not wanting to read this thread as I always look forward to reading the magazine, I did notice someone metioned Remedy Oak - I have heard very good things about this course but have not played it.

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2008, 10:26:16 AM »
Paul -

Golf World usually does the Top 100 list in the November issue.

DT

Adrian_Stiff

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2008, 11:30:37 AM »
I just went to buy this - is it the one with Faldo on the front saying "how we are going to win the Ryder cup"?!! If so, there is no mention of Top 100 - this was the October Issue. Just wondering if this was an old version and if the Top 100 is the November edition?

While not wanting to read this thread as I always look forward to reading the magazine, I did notice someone metioned Remedy Oak - I have heard very good things about this course but have not played it.
Should be in the shops this week Paul.
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2008, 11:37:02 AM »
The issue is on the newstands from the 25th.

I agree with Ally & Adrian the Golf World rating is well researched and the reviewers are mainly top golfers, writers, architects, administrators and respected people from the world of golf. There is no booking a (free) tee time for 4 and expecting to get wined, dined and fawned over.

Tom B - They rated Loch Lomand over Sunningdale Old in 2000, 2002 and 2004.

Tom Doak - I take your point about new courses breaking in and out and there are few true changes. However from our perspective at Deal in the '90s we were in the top 30 and drifted out to a low of 49 by 2000. Massive investment in the course and a move to low impact sustainable practises over the last 4 years has reaped benefits and we now climb 6 places to 39. Add in the effect or 3 or 4 new courses such as Kingsbarns, European and Loch Lomond and I would say the club has plenty to be proud of.

It's good to see New Zealand getting back in the top 100, as Sean Arble's current post shows it's a quality venue but at 6000yds length isn't a driver in these ratings.
Cave Nil Vino

Noel Freeman

Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #22 on: September 22, 2008, 11:42:30 AM »
Chappers-

I hardly ever post anymore but I think Deal superior to Turnberry.. I'm not going to go into the merits of it hole by hole but as someone who has seen 60+ courses on this list, I think Deal and Sandwich are underrated.. Also, I like the European Club but it is way way too high as is Berkshire Red.  Woking is a much better course than the Red as is the Addington..

Then again, I'm a Deal homer..

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2008, 11:48:31 AM »
Woking is a much better course than the Red as is the Addington..


i'd go with this....

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New Golf World Top 100 Britain & Ireland out
« Reply #24 on: September 22, 2008, 12:10:31 PM »
Should courses of sufficient difficulty to host professional events get a boost in these rankings?  I'm divided on the question.  On one hand, such difficulty is usually a detriment to the enjoyment of 99% of the people that play the course.  On the other hand, any objective standard of greatness would, in my opinion, require that the course provide an interesting variety of challenges to all classes of players.


For whatever it is worth - this is how I would rank the courses I have played.

 I would add Brora to the list in the range of Gullane (probably just above) and I would consider adding Lundin Links somewhere in the same range(although I could be blinded by the great time I had at the Buda Cup).


4. TOC
14. Ballybun
28. Lahinch
11. Dornoch
1. Turnberry
32. N berwick
34. Prestwick
6. Carnasty
41. West Gailes
13. Waterville
76. Tralee
23. Troon
56. Gull #1
71. Old head of kins
37. Doonbeg

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