EXPERIMENT #3

[Carl Nichols]

Try to find an old set of clubs from the mid-80's, before metal drivers and woods, and play your home course.  Pretty certain you'll end up hitting a wider variety of shots.  (I'm left-handed and had to play Olivos GC in Argentina with rental clubs that were probably from the 60's, and it gave me the idea to try this in the states).   

[Tommy Williamsen]

Since I am old I have clubs from the 60's, 70's, and 80's all over the place.  The new balls dont work very well with persimmon.  The interesting thing is that when I used to play the small forged irons I hit the middle of the club more often than I do now with larger irons and woods (metals).

[Carl Nichols]

Certainly better if you can find old balls too, but I don't have any of those around the house.

[JSPayne]

Where's Sean Tully on this one? He can outdrive me with his persimmon.....and I'm no short knocker!

Maybe it's the mystical air of times long forgotten that enshroud the Meadow Club.....antiques take on a breath of fresh air while the new-fangled technology struggles for breath. 

[Tom_Doak]

Pretty much all the clubs in my bag are from the mid-80's ... Ping Eye 2 irons, Wilson 600 putter, even a Cleveland Classic persimmon 3-wood which I rarely use anymore, but I can still hit.  (I hit it on the 13th green at Rock Creek today with the persimmon 3-wood ... probably a first.)

I spend most of my life trying to figure out how to counter technology, so I am a conscientious objector to playing with much of it.

[Rob Rigg]

I still much prefer forged irons - although I have given in on the woods.

Is there much of a persimmon cottage industry these days?

I'm sure the trees are happy we have moved on to metal . . . but I do miss that beautiful sound off the tee.

I learned to play right handed because I could never find any lefty clubs - now that I play left handed I don't know if I could even find persimmon woods.

Great craic though playing with that stuff - and the whippy shafts to boot.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Many have suggested I dispose of my old and faithful early 80’s clubs and revert back to Hickory. Don’t have a problem with that if ALL do the same. Also don’t have a problem with sand tees but the Caddies do. Carrying the clubs without a bag is one thing but expecting them to also carry 20lbs of sand in their pockets, is one step too far.

Yet for the good of the game I would be willing to try – problem is how many of you out there actually care enough? 

Golf was once all about the challenge. Now most can’t play or do not want to play unless it is all made easy for you. Need carts because just to lazy to walk, need markers and electronic distance aids as lost the ability to judge distance, seem unable to select a club unless the distance in known. 

The modern golfer must wonder what the game is really all about, it’s just too easy, expect the next aid will be something that actually swings the club and hits the ball while controlled from the cart – makes me wonder why you bother playing in the first place - hardly seems a challenge anymore with all these aids. 

[Jim_Kennedy]

Carl,
I have an older set of Pings, woods included, that I sometimes play. What really is a challenge is playing my older set of Wilson Staff irons, and a quick look at the sole tells why. The negative 'bounce' is what really made these clubs hard for the average player, there's no room for error (especially when playing the short irons). A swing that hits the ground a bit early results in a very heavy shot, not so with modern irons which have a pronounced, and positive, bounce. 

[Ken Moum]

Well, I haven't had the 40s, 50s or60s sets out this year, but I have played a couple of after-work nines with my hickory set.

I'm currently a 10 and shot in the mid-forties both times. And I do that a LOT with my modern set.

I have also, within the last three years, played serious tournament golf with irons from the 1960s and woods from the 1980s. I didn'tdo it as an experiment, I did it because those were the clubs that produced the lowest scores for me.

Ken

[Deucie Bies]

Try to find an old set of clubs from the mid-80's, before metal drivers and woods, and play your home course.  Pretty certain you'll end up hitting a wider variety of shots.  (I'm left-handed and had to play Olivos GC in Argentina with rental clubs that were probably from the 60's, and it gave me the idea to try this in the states).   

Carl,

I am right handed and played at Olivos and I got similar clubs.  I might not have hit it as far as I do at home, but other than that I didn't notice much difference.

[Bruce Leland]

A recent experiment with the clubs I had in college produced different results than I expected.  1976 Wilson Staff irons, MacGregor M85 Super Eye-O-Matic driver and and M85 Eye-O-Matic 3 wood.  I hit a bucket of balls and found the irons very playable, the 3 wood as good as what I've got in my current set but struggled miserably with the driver.  That driver was one of my all time favorite clubs as was the 3 wood. 

I was a bit disappointed in my inability to hit it well.  I managed only 2 or 3 good drives out of 15.  I might start playing the irons and 3 wood regularly, however  ;-)

[RSLivingston_III]

Great idea about getting out the Pro-classic clubs, they will give a great experience.
Hickory clubs can take a lot of work to assemble a high quality set.
As for balls, try a standard Pro-V1 and NOT the x. Balls optimized for the new metal woods and high swing speeds work poorly with wood head clubs.

[Bruce Leland]

Great idea about getting out the Pro-classic clubs, they will give a great experience.
Hickory clubs can take a lot of work to assemble a high quality set.
As for balls, try a standard Pro-V1 and NOT the x. Balls optimized for the new metal woods and high swing speeds work poorly with wood head clubs.

Since I found 14 dozen Tour Balata's in the basement this Spring, I don't worry about balls!

[Patrick_Mucci]

Bruce Leland,

I think it's an easy transition to go from a small driver face to a large driver face.

I think it's very difficult to go back to a small driver face.

When I look at the swing of young golfers today, there's no way that they could use that swing with a Power-Bilt, shallow faced driver in their hands.

The larger club faces have changed the golf swing.
Just look at the arcs and the seperation of the right elbow from the body.

Then go back and look at Gene Littler or Bobby Jones's swings.

[Ken Moum]

Bruce Leland,

I think it's an easy transition to go from a small driver face to a large driver face.

I think it's very difficult to go back to a small driver face.

When I look at the swing of young golfers today, there's no way that they could use that swing with a Power-Bilt, shallow faced driver in their hands.

The larger club faces have changed the golf swing.
Just look at the arcs and the seperation of the right elbow from the body.

Then go back and look at Gene Littler or Bobby Jones's swings.

Pat,

Having played  LOT of serious golf in recent years with vintage clubs, I think there's a factor that many overlook re. the old drivers.  That's LOFT.

I cannot accept that they are significantly harder to hit than todays three woods, give that they have slightly larger faces than the modern three wood and are the same length at ~43 inches.

HOWEVER, 1960s drivers were fitted to a golf ball that spun a huge amount off the driver, and good players commonly used drivers with actual 9* of loft.  Those old drivers also had a pretty high CG, given that they had aluminum sole plates and a lead plug that was poured in place.

Today most 9* drivers have 11 or 12 degrees of loft, and if you hit them on the top half of the face, they have a degree or so more than that. They are designed to hit balls that spin a lot less than the balatas, especially at drivers clubhead speeds.

I never was much good with the old 9* persimmon drivers, so my collection has several brassies that I use as a teeing club, as well as a few legitimate 11* drivers and I used to even have one that was 14*. 

(BTW, did you know that when Palmer Golf brought out the first driver that was an "exact" duplicate of Arnie's it had 14* of loft on a deep-face head. Remember, Palmer was a great driver, but hit it very low.)

Anyway, if all you did was hunt up a true 11* driver, or a brassie to use off the tee, I suspect you'd find that a lot of the "difficulties" presented by the old equipment would disappear pretty quickly.

As crummy a ballstriker as I am, I find that on a reasonably firm course, I can hit ProV1 90-95% as far with a 42.5" brassie as I can with a 45" titanium driver. And I am often slightly straighter with the brassie--which is why I have played so much with old clubs lately. FWIW I am a 10 handicap who averages about 2 GIRs a round.

Ken