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Sean_A

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WOKING - Whats the Score?
« on: September 07, 2008, 09:47:24 AM »
I have been reading some F Pennink stuff lately due to his work at Burnham.  A few things popped up which didn't actually surprise me, but they confirmed (sort of) some impressions of mine. 

First, Pennink claims that the man to thank for Woking's clever greens and the centreline bunker on #4 is Paton.  Many claim Low was at least responsible for the bunker.  Does anybody know the story?   

Additionally, Pennink states that entirely new 9th and 10th holes are now open.  This was written circa 1961.  Where did the old holes go?  Does anybody know the story?

Ciao

New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Chris Burgard

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: WOKING - Whats the Score?
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2008, 07:57:32 PM »

Sean,

I'm quite sure that Darwin credits the centreline bunker on the fourth to Paton in Golf Courses of the British Isles.

Chris

Neil_Crafter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: WOKING - Whats the Score?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2008, 12:40:43 AM »
Chris, you are right on the money there, Darwin does indeed credit the bunker to Paton. There are some on other holes he credits to Low.
Neil

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: WOKING - Whats the Score?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2008, 05:41:39 AM »
With regards to the 9th and 10th, I'd like to know the answer to that as well Sean... The 9th is a bit out of character with the rest of the course... In fact I think George Ritchie (Golf Manager) and Martin Ebert (Architect) had been looking at doing some fairly serious redesign to that corner but that may have been knocked on the head... I think the 10th is quite a nice par-3 with a good green site... but it does feel a bit claustrophobic...

Other than those directly connected to the club, Philip Spogard is probably your man on this forum...

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: WOKING - Whats the Score?
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2008, 06:06:21 AM »
With regards to the 9th and 10th, I'd like to know the answer to that as well Sean... The 9th is a bit out of character with the rest of the course... In fact I think George Ritchie (Golf Manager) and Martin Ebert (Architect) had been looking at doing some fairly serious redesign to that corner but that may have been knocked on the head... I think the 10th is quite a nice par-3 with a good green site... but it does feel a bit claustrophobic...

Other than those directly connected to the club, Philip Spogard is probably your man on this forum...

Ally

You are right, the 9th is out of character because there is only one way to play it from the new tees further back and it just looks different somehow.  Perhaps its a lack of fairway bunkering - I don't know.  I do like the 10th especially since they removed the lower left bunker or at least that is what it looked like they were gonna do when I was last there.  Though I am not convinced about the high bunker(s). 

I always thought the 16th seemed like an afterthought hole as well.  I am not at all keen on it.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Philip Gawith

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: WOKING - Whats the Score?
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2008, 10:02:02 AM »
This is what Ran wrote in his course profile........

Fourth hole, 350 yards; Originally, Dunn laid out an ordinary straight-ish short par four. Then one day, inspired by the Principal's Nose at the sixteenth hole on The Old Course at St. Andrews and without consulting with the Board, Paton placed two bunkers smack in the left middle of the fairway right where drives liked to go. The golfer now had the option to play safe on his tee shot, going left of this bunker complex. However, he then faced a ticklish approach over the left greenside bunker. Conversely, he could elect to drive aggressively between the bunkers and the out of bounds train line and leave himself a straightforward pitch. Paton's bunkers created quite a furor in their day. Tom Simpson, on a stormy day, went out and studied the fourth hole for nearly the entire day, so engrossed was he by the hole's strategic merit. The golf world owes much to that day as Simpson became inspired enough to become a first rate architect in his own right. He left many outstanding designs behind, including Ballybunion, Cruden Bay and Morfontaine. Although Paton's fairway bunkers garner the attention at this most famous of inland holes, note needs to be paid to what he did greenside. His front left bunker combined with the green that runs from front left to back right are essential compliments to the Principal's Nose as without them, the hole wouldn't possess near the same strategic merit.

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: WOKING - Whats the Score?
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2008, 10:36:00 AM »
With regards to the 9th and 10th, I'd like to know the answer to that as well Sean... The 9th is a bit out of character with the rest of the course... In fact I think George Ritchie (Golf Manager) and Martin Ebert (Architect) had been looking at doing some fairly serious redesign to that corner but that may have been knocked on the head... I think the 10th is quite a nice par-3 with a good green site... but it does feel a bit claustrophobic...

Other than those directly connected to the club, Philip Spogard is probably your man on this forum...

Ally

You are right, the 9th is out of character because there is only one way to play it from the new tees further back and it just looks different somehow.  Perhaps its a lack of fairway bunkering - I don't know.  I do like the 10th especially since they removed the lower left bunker or at least that is what it looked like they were gonna do when I was last there.  Though I am not convinced about the high bunker(s). 


I think the 9th plays more parkland with no heather covering whatsoever and an awkward green that is out of character with the others, being rather flat, featureless and a good bit smaller in scale.... I know there was talk of putting a new tee in that would utilise the second shot of the hole but eradicate the existing drive. This would have provided a straightaway hole with full visibility and an initial carry over marshy land... I think this idea was done away with because it would also mean a long walk from 8 green to 9 tees...

As for the high bunkers on the right of ten, they certainly add to the fear factor because they provide a difficult recovery with the added scare of going over the other side and down the hill... I do think they also added to the claustrophobia of the hole however (I mean this in a negative manner) and stopped interesting kicks in from the right. They certainly make it more of a target shot hole.

These are all recollections from one visit last year so I may be off the mark with some things that I am saying...