Old Macdonald a 10?

[Anthony Gray]

    Will the new course at Bandon Dunes be a ten?


    Does enybody have any photos of the site or routing?

[John Kavanaugh]

Only if you can make NGLA an 11.

[Mike Hendren]

Or Shinnecock a 12. 

[Jim Adkisson]

Only time will tell...looking forward to November to look over at PD 14th tee and see what the progress looks like...I guess that our bi-annual trips to Bandon will start taking 5 days and 4 nights to play all the courses a minimum of twice...BUMMER!

[Tom_Doak]

Well, I'm sure it will be at least a 5.  And we ARE only half done.

But there is no way I would ever say (or even think) that I was building a ten at the halfway point of construction.  That would be the kiss of death, like jinxing a perfect game in baseball.  You just keep throwing pitches and see what happens when you get the last man out.

[Chip Gaskins]

The Golf Channel reported two nights ago there would be 10 holes open for play next summer. Not sure where they got their info, but they did about a 2-3 minute clip on Old Macdonald.

[PThomas]

talk about the bar being set high!

good luck Tom et al!

[Jerry Kluger]

     Can it be a 10 - absolutely - why not?  I would guess that the reason why so many would challenge it as a 10 is because they view it as a modern NGLA.  Okay, let's say that it is - it doesn't mean that the current interpretation of CBM's vision should be simply offhandedly rejected.  It is an interpretation which does not mean a duplication.  The concept of many of the holes will be the same but the execution will most probably not be. 

     Perhaps the most widely copied hole is the Redan - whether at NGLA or elsewhere, does that make all the copies bad - of course not, some are arguably even better than the original.  How about the Cape - CBM originally used the term to describe a hole where the green was surrounded on three sides by water and had nothing to do with the diagonal tee shot over water.  Today, the term is used with reference to the latter feature and not the original.  Would a Cape at Old Macdonald that is designed with the feature which CBM had originally intended perhaps be better than the one at NGLA?  Point is, just because the course is a tribute to CBM does not mean that it cannot be one of the best.

[Kalen Braley]

I love the enthusiam, I really do...can't wait to play it myself.

But all this talk is a wee-bit premature, lets at least wait until its all fully in the ground and one can strike gawf balls around on it. 

[Tom Huckaby]

Man I gotta agree with Kalen here.  Let's not go nuts nor put on any undue pressure.  Jeez....

CAN it be a 10?  Sure, why not?  Heck any course CAN be.

WILL IT?

Read Kalen's wise words.  Talk about too soon to tell....

TH

[TX Golf]

I am with Kalen on this one.

Lets all hold back here for a bit until we actually see the course. Yea, it is possible that it could be a ten, but as Tom said the course is only halfway finished.

In relation to this topic, and I know I am going to get slammed for saying this, but isn't it possible that we are also jumping to conclusions on Pacific Dunes and Ballyneal. Including Old MacDonald as a ten as well just seems goofy to me. In the past two hundred years only about ten courses built have received his distinction of a ten, and we are saying that he has built an additional three in the last six years. Come on, I love his work as much as the rest of you, but these numbers seem to suggest that there might be some favoritism going on. Lets see how the do with the test of time. Anyways, I am interested to hear the responses.

Robert

[Rich Goodale]

I love the enthusiam, I really do...can't wait to play it myself.

But all this talk is a wee-bit premature, lets at least wait until its all fully in the ground and one can strike gawf balls around on it. 

I heartily disagree.  Tom Doak himself says it's a 5 and only half finished.  That sounds like a 10 to me.

[Michael Dugger]

Other thread...with images....

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,36312.0.html

[Tom Huckaby]

I love the enthusiam, I really do...can't wait to play it myself.

But all this talk is a wee-bit premature, lets at least wait until its all fully in the ground and one can strike gawf balls around on it. 

I heartily disagree.  Tom Doak himself says it's a 5 and only half finished.  That sounds like a 10 to me.

LOL!  Excellent gotcha.

 

[Ronald Montesano]

Wow...scratching at nothing to get this thread, huh?  Slow day at the office or in the land of retirement?

[Tom_Doak]

Actually, Rich, there are a few nine-hole courses that are rated better than 5's in The Confidential Guide.  It's a long way from there to a ten. 

Plus, we've actually built TEN holes at Old Macdonald now ... maybe that's what Anthony Gray was referring to ... but if not, you can do the math on that one. 

[Phil Benedict]

Isn't this like speculating that Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie's daughter will be a 10?  The genes are great but you just can't tell until she grows up.

[John Moore II]

I suppose it is possible for this course to be a 10 at some point in time, once enough people play it enough times to evaluate it. But I would say that about nearly any course that is under construction. There is likely the potential for them to all be 10's. But it is highly unlikely that any of them will be. Having not seen the land that Old Macdonald is located on, I can't make an assessment on potential quality. But overall, I would say given the previous designs done by Mr. Doak, it will certainly be very high quality and may be good enough for a 10.

[Tom_Doak]

I repeat my earlier assertion that this is a silly thread.

But I'll disagree with John Moore.  Most courses under construction have no chance to be a 10, because that is not the goal of their developers.

[John Moore II]

I repeat my earlier assertion that this is a silly thread.

But I'll disagree with John Moore.  Most courses under construction have no chance to be a 10, because that is not the goal of their developers.

I just meant that there is always a very slight potential (certainly its slight, with you having only rated 12 courses a 10) that any course, given the right circumstances could be perfect/very near perfect. There is very little likelyhood of it happening because I would think that most designers are not capable of building such a course. But its a very slight possibility, at least at first.

[Tom_Doak]

John:

My point was it's not just up to the architect.  You have to have a good client and an above-average site before there is any chance of winding up with a 10 ... Pinehurst #2 is maybe the only one of them which somebody could call an average piece of ground, and the sandy ground there was key to building the greens they built.

[Ian Andrew]

Nigel: "This is a top to a, you know, what we use on stage. But it's very very special because, if you can see..."
Marty: "Yeah?"
Nigel: "...the numbers all go to eleven. Look, right across the board, 11, 11, 11, 11."
Marty: "Most amps go up to ten."
Nigel: "Exactly."
Marty: "Does that mean it's louder? Is it any louder?"
Nigel: "Well, it's one louder, isn't it? It's not ten. You see, most, most blokes gonna be playing at ten. You're on ten, all the way up, all the way up, all the way up."
Marty: "Yeah."
Nigel: "You're on ten on your guitar. Where can you go from there? Where?"
Marty: "I don't know."
Nigel: "Nowhere, exactly. What we do is if we need that extra push over the cliff, you know what we do?"
Marty: "Put it up to eleven."
Nigel: "Eleven. Exactly. One louder."
Marty: "Why don't you just make ten louder and make ten be the top number and make that a litte louder?"
Nigel: "These go to eleven."