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Jeff_Mingay

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Let's "restore" a Macan course
« on: August 19, 2008, 06:56:11 PM »
I just wrote the following at the "Canada's Top-100 courses" thread and figure this subject needs its own base for discussion:

"When will we see some comprehensive restorative-based work done at (Vernon) Macan-designed courses?

I mean, all the Victoria clubs -- Victoria, Colwood, Gorge Vale -- and a number of clubs with Macan-designed courses in the US Pacific Northwest proudly reference Macan at web sites. Yet, no comprehensive restorative-based work... yet.

All over the USA, Ross-, Tillinghast-, Mackenzie-, Flynn-designed courses have been "restored". Here, in Canada, Thompson courses have been "restored". Nothing thus far at Macan-designed courses.

Which are the leading candidates?

I'd put Royal Colwood at the top of the list; and, trust me, the work required there is minimal and relatively inexpensive.

(Perhaps this topic deserves its own thread but,) which other Macan courses could be "restored" relatively easily and inexpensively?"
jeffmingay.com

Sean Leary

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Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2008, 07:18:40 PM »
Fircrest and Inglewood.  Tree removal to start.

RJ_Daley

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Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2008, 08:07:50 PM »
Jeff, maybe it would be worth exploring a take-off on the societies like DRS or Tillinghast Society, or Set Raynor Society.  But, due to Macan's lesser recognition throughout the mainstream golf world, perhaps a broader focus or named society would be in order to encourage or develope grants for restorations like Macan's.  How would a Canadian focused preservation society of GCA go over?
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Carl Nichols

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Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2008, 08:32:59 PM »
I'll be in Victoria for several days in September--are any of these must-plays? It will be tough for me to sneak away for a round and I'd do so (or try to do so!) only for a truly must-play.

Cory Brown

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Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2008, 10:21:53 PM »
Carl,
I think Gorge Vale, Royal Colwood, and Victoria are all must plays.  But if I were to choose one that I would be willing to insult family members or business associates to go play I think it would have to be Victoria.  The setting at Victoria is spectacular.  I don't necessarily think it is the best golf course of the three, but there are only a few other courses in North America with settings as nice as Victoria, and they are all in Monterey (maybe a bit of an exageration but not much).  The course has some incredible holes along the water, with a few good, not great, inland holes.


Scott Stambaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2008, 11:35:52 PM »
Jeff-

I made mention on another thread of the very thing you pointed out-  clubs back East recognize the importance of what they have.  Destroy a Tillinghast and you'll likely be burned at the stake.  Destroy some of Macan's work- "Who's Macan?" 

Educating a membership on the relevance of their golf course is no easy task.  Believe me, I speak from experience...  It seems to me that very few new players to the game have any sort of connection with historical aspects of a club.  (I'm speaking of my experience in the PNW.  My experience in California was much different.)

So, someone mentions rebuilding a green, moving things around, rerouting some holes, building ten sets of tees, digging lakes, creeks and water features, putting up a windmill, etc...,  and next thing you know things start happening.  I'm sure you see this kind of stuff all the time.  I'm not going to mention any clubs, but I have seen some very, very unfortunate things being done to Macan's work. 

My feeling is, if a club needs to be educated on why they need to embrace their history, then fine.  Management has to be the one to spearhead it.  Guys like you shouldn't be expected to knock on the front door.   The door should already be open via the Golf Course Superintendent and/or General Manager.  If a club does not have strong educated leaders willing to make an effort, then Macan restorative-based projects will continue to be too few and far between.  I just can't see a club exploring the option of a restoration without management leading the way.

As far as candidates go, Sean nailed two of them.  I know Inglewood had Asmundson doing some bunker work there, I'm not sure if it was restorative-based or not.  Fircrest is probably Macan's best work in the U.S.  I haven't played there in quite a while, but I know that it is similar to Colwood in that it has Douglas firs bigger than most can imagine. 

Here's the one my money is on to possibly be the first- Overlake.  They have made some questionable decisions on some past golf course projects but not anything that has really ruined most of Macan's features.  There were a few greens rebuilt in the 60's by Sarazen/Muirhead, but there are few who could pick them out.  Interestingly, Sarazen was quoted as loving Macan's courses, perhaps when he had an opportunity to work on one of them he realized that not much needed to be done.  And, one green rebuilt about ten years ago by John Harbottle.  Rebuild the tees, bunkers and undertake a massive tree removal/replanting program is all that needs to be done.  Most fairway/approach lines have already been recaptured, shrunken green edges have been restored and with excellent control of the water with a new irrigation system, the membership is completely supportive of the firm and fast regimen.  That doesn't sound too biased, does it?

Carl- I think the only reason Cory likes Victoria so much is because he tore it up there... ;) 











Neil_Crafter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2008, 05:16:49 AM »
Jeff
Here's a photo of Macan from 1919 I found in an English pictorial magazine called The Sketch, he was playing in the Active Service Golf Tournament at Sandy Lodge. Darwin and CK Hutchison were other participants.
cheers Neil


Bob Jenkins

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Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2008, 07:56:50 PM »

Jeff,

I fully agree that a Macan restoration movement should be promoted.

Royal Colwood would be a prime candidate.

What about Marine Drive?

Cory Brown

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Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2008, 08:26:56 PM »
Bob,
Marine Drive would be a great candidate.  It is already a great course, but a few things could make it really spectacular.  Just curious, but what types of changes/restorative work should be undertaken there in your view.

Scott,
I wouldn't say I tore it up Victoria, I just didn't get beaten like a rented mule like I did at Colwood and Gorge Vale. ;D

Tony Ristola

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2008, 07:20:52 AM »
In the late 70's Gorge Vale was ripped up. What's left I'm not too sure.

Interesting photo of the 7th at Victoria. I don't recall bunkers down the left. Or any at all on this hole. These are original?

Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2008, 06:35:38 PM »
Scott,

I need to get down to see Fircrest; I continually hear good things about this course. Overlake, too, apparently.  Thanks for your info.

Bob,

With all due respect, I think Marine Drive is over-rated. It's cramped (18-holes effectively routed over less than 100 acres). Over-planting and a plethora of evergreen trees don't help this situation. The greens aren't very interesting; either are the bunkers. Historic photos I've seen don't show much either. Restoration? I don't think it's possible at Marine Drive. But, a Macan style and flair could definitely be injected there.

Tony,

I think the only bunker at Victoria's seventh hole that may have been there before a recent renovation is the one you see at the end of the fairway. The others in the photo were added very recently.

Neil,

This may be the best photo I've seen of Macan! Very cool. Thanks for posting this image.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2008, 08:58:32 PM by Jeff_Mingay »
jeffmingay.com

Raymond

Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2008, 07:23:29 PM »
FYI...The LPGA is playing Macan's Columbia Edgewater this weekend. The TV telecast tomorrow is on ESPN2 at 3:00 CDT I believe. There is probably not alot of Macan's original work still left (the routing is still mostly intact) but the ladies on tour do list it as one of their favorites that they play each year. Beautiful Sequoias, planted in the early 50's frame the fairways but they could probably stand to thin them out a bit. Built in 1925 it is a terrific walking course. It plays to about 6800 yds from the tips and sits on just about 100 acres.

Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2008, 08:31:03 PM »
Raymond,

My younger bro. caddied on the LPGA Tour for about 7 years and always spoke highly of Columbia-Edgewater... even before his older brother told him Vernon Macan originally designed the course.

As Scott says, I think my brother's response was "Who's Vernon Macan?"  :'(
jeffmingay.com

Raymond

Re: Let's "restore" a Macan course
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2008, 09:09:04 AM »
Jeff,

No respect...when they showed the stats on the course yesterday on TV they credited McCan with the design.

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