[Matt_Ward]

Given the range of responses from people on the thread I posted itemizing the top 50 metro area courses, I decided to add a top 25 listing -- but this time from the public side because only two (2) courses from the public side actually made the top 50 given the NYC's area deep roster of superb private clubs.

The only requirement was that the club had to provide access to the public a on a seven-day basis and only courses within a 75-mile radius of Times Square were considered  -- with the exception of the length of Long Island.

I've also made it a point to add some comments on each listing -- did not do that with all of the top 50 I mentioned previously.

My comments start with the top five -- others will be added with each grouping as time provides.

As always, feedback is much appreciated and welcomed.

* * *

All courses are in alphabetical order within each grouping ...

F I R S T          F I V E
 
BALLYOWEN (Hamburg, NJ)

First rate effort by Roger Rulewich -- somewhat out of place with the existing rolling farm land on the front side but provides quality holes such as the risk and reward 2nd, the unique par-3 6th being wedged in between holes, the demanding 7th and the Shinnecock-like 9th hole.
Back nine is the better half and has the better overall combo of holes.
Only ACC tops this North Jersey gem for being the best overall public in the Garden State.

 
BETHPAGE STATE PARK / BLACK COURSE (Farmingdale, NY)

I commend the progress that's been done but I have to say I'm a bit taken back by this obsessive desire for even more length here. The Black is a fascinating journey and its overall scale is something few can really comprehend until being there.

Lacks any semblance of finesse play. Muscular course to the max and has some of the most daunting and terror producing long par-4's you can imagine with the likes of the 12th and 15th, to name just two.

The closing hole has been changed a few times and still needs to be tweaked because the Rees Jones creation is nothing more than so-so hole at best.

Curious to see the reaction of the participants with the return of the US Open in '09.

 
LINKS AT UNIONVALE (Lagrangeville, NY)

Gets little attention because of its remote Hudson River valley location. Designed by Stephen Kay and incorporate a desired Irish motif but it's more of a wish than a reality.
 
I'm not fan of the forced lay-backs at the 1st and 2nd holes but the overall course is well done and you can't beat what it offers for the price you pay.
 
Kay has also added diagonal bunkering on any number of holes and the player must determine the proper angle and distance needed to cover the target line that's sought.


POUND RIDGE (Pound Ridge, NY)

The work of Pete and Perry Dye. Extremely demanding and often times unyielding design that forces your hands at just about any tee location. Still have a few issues with the course -- the tree blocking the 18th fairway and the tiny fir trees that have been planted there need to go.

Credit the Dyes for a superb routing that fits into tight quarters. The main weakness? The quartet of par-3's is good but far from superb -- save for the unique and fun short par-3 15th with its stone wall behind the green.

Pound Ridge places a great premium on driving the ball well off the tee. You have sufficient landing areas but you don't get the usual muni widths that allow for careless play.

The biggest strength? The contouring and angling of the putting surfaces makes you play high level approaches for much of the time there. No doubt the $235 price tag will turn plenty of people off but for those who want to see what the Dyes can create -- Pound Ridge provides enough thrill situations that won't disappoint. The key to playing the course is following the line Clint Eastwood made famous, "A man's got to know his limitations."

 
THE CLUB AT MORGAN HILL (Easton, PA)
 
Well done routing and diversity of holes at this course immediately over the Delaware River and just off I-78. Hats off to architect Kelly Blake Moran for a fun layout with plenty of unique green contours.

Morgan Hill is entertaining and although the property is quite hilly and does require cart usage the nature of the holes and shots encountered never remotely borders on goofy or silly golf.

I am big fan of the chain reaction par-5 5th and the long uphill par-4 6th. Both are unconventional for ordinary public course design.

The only real weakness comes at the transition dropshot par-3 12th. After you get passed that you have a wonderful uphill par-5 13th and the uphill par-3 14th is a hole type often neglected by many other designers.

The closing hole is a bit of a letdown -- it's OK just not great.

All in all, Morgan Hill demonstrates a crafty land plan on a demanding site. The golf required will leave you wanting more. The sure sign of a quality layout.

SECOND FIVE
 
Centennial / Lake & Fairways
Heron Glen
Hominy Hill
Golf Club at Mansion Ridge
Montauk Downs State Park
 
THIRD FIVE
 
The Architect's
Bethpage State Park / Red Course
Knoll / West
Oyster Bay
Tallgrass
 
FOURTH FIVE

Great Gorge / Lake & Quarry
Hudson Hills
Richter Park
River Vale
Spring Lake / Thunderbird
 
FIFTH FIVE
 
Eisenhower Park
River Vale
Spook Rock
Sunset Valley
Wild Turkey
 
Honorable Mention Listing ...

Bowling Green
Howell Park
Charleston Springs (North)
Knob Hill
Pine Hollow

I will add a few others as well ...

[Richard Hetzel]

River Vale is listed TWICE, why not toss in West Point?

[Cliff Hamm]

Had not been familair with the Golf Course at Mansion Ridge.  Checked their web site and it refers to the course as being semi-private.  No mention of public play or greens fees.  Is it open to the general public?

[Mike Sweeney]

Long Island National ?

Architects?

If you catch it in good condition and can keep the round under 5 hours, I think Split Rock in the Bronx makes the cut.

[Matt_Ward]

Gents:

My pardons for listing River Vale twice. Still the layout is quite fun to play.

In my mind either Howell Park (Francis Duane design) or Bowling Green (Geoffrey Cornish layout) and both in Jersey would make the final botton five. The Cornish layout is generally invisible for many people because so few have played it yet it's been around for well over 40 years.

I also believe Mansion Ridge is available for public play - albeit they have a preference for members signing onto one of their plans.

Mike S:

Didn't add LI National because the layout is really not beyond the likes of Tallgrass or even Pine Hollow for that matter. Architect's deserves mention for a whole host of reasons. Don't know Mike if you've been back there in quite some time but things have improved beyond the high level they exhibited previously.

In regards to Split Rock -- you have plenty of "ifs" in your post. Generally the turf conditions there go from muddy and wet to hard like concrete as the hot weather bakes the turf. No doubt the layout has a few moments of note but it's not consistent throughout and the pace of play desire you state is more dream-like than reality.

Rich H:

West Point needs to bring a few axes to cut a number of trees down. I still enjoy the par-4 17th though. West Point offers a few unique moments but nothing more than other nearby courses like Otterkill or Garrison and others of this type.

[Mike Sweeney]

http://www.pineridgegc.com

Also worthy of consideration by Ron Forse.

PS. Matt, I just saw Hudson Hills on your list. You have got to be kidding me. If there was ever a site in Westchester that says "don't build a course here", Hudson Hills is it. Okay maybe #2 behind Sanctuary GC.

Did not see Architects on your original list, we are in agreement there.

[Matt_Ward]

Mike:

Hudson Hills is no doubt created on a severe site. No doubt about that. But there are holes of quality and I felt the Westchester area needed some sort of representation beyond the affordable nature of Pound Ridge.

Mike, Pine Ridge is a decent layout but it's not anything really special and the terrain is fairly mundane.

Mike, one of my enjoyable places to play from the taxpayer-owned layouts is Sprain Lake in Westchester. Never really in great shape because of the constant pounding but the risk and reward 11th is always fun and the rolling nature of the property could truly be improved.

[John Foley]

Matt,

I agree Unionvale is a very good course. I need to get back there this year, but I do remember those forced layup holes being very poor.

Is Branton Woods 100% private now?

How would you compare Mansion Ridge to Branton Woods & Unionvale? It was one of the few times in my life I walked off a course, mainly pace of play, but I do remeber being un-impressed. It's been awhile though.

BTW - Wild Turkey is a very very good golf course.

[Michael Mimran]

Garrison Golf Club - Dick Wilson design.  I don't know where on this list it would go, but definitely worth a spot.  Doak gave it a 4 in the CGGCA.

Personally, I like Casperkill and little known Red Hook golf club.  Probably worth of an honorable mention. 

Royce Brook - east
Links at Shirley

John, Yes Branton is 100% private.

[Bill Brightly]

If you are inclusing Easton PA in the NY Metro area, you might as well throw in the public access courses near Atlantic City: Seaview Bay and Twisted Dunes, both really fun courses.

[Matt_Ward]

John:

You raise a good point on the forced lay-ups at #1, #2 and to some extent with #18. I would hestitate to cal them "poor" but can fully understand how you and others of the same thought feel about such an inclusion. Generally, I am not a fan of such a contrivance but the totality of what is there at Unionvale is able to overcome the situation. The sad part is that so few people have actually played the course.

Many, often make the mistake, in simply assuming that the bigger ticket courses in and around Unionvale are worth the time and $$. That's a mistake on their part.

Mike, I can't answer your personal disgust with Mansion Ridge unless you can provide some additional details. The pace of play is almost always an issue when there -- more often than not you have people who cannot handle the severity of the site itself. In regards to the holes themselves the facility is routed well given the up and down nature of the property. Sufficient width and if played from the correct tees an appropriate challenge for nearly all types of players.

Appreciate you seconding Wild Turkey -- often gets a lot less notice because of big brother Ballyowen.

Bill B:

The mile limit was 75 miles -- Morgan Hill barely gets in -- the ones in and around the AC area are outside that limit.

Mike M:

No doubt one can argue the point for Garrison. I consider it a fine sporty course but not at the same level as my other honorable mention types such as Bowling Green and Howell Park, to name just two.

In regards to The Links at Shirley -- can you tell me how that layout is beyond the likes of Pine Hollow. Very flat and boring property with drab holes for the most part.

Good mention of Royce Brook / East. If the West were not private now it would be included. The East is likely an honorable mention in my mind.

[BVince]

17th at West Point is a par 5...plays up hill all the way to the green

By the way...I love to hear it mentioned at all on this thread

[Matt_Ward]

Bill:

Mea culpa on my part -- the 17th is a par-5 as you mentioned. I also like the par-4 14th hole -- 418 yards from the tips. The problem with a number of holes at West Point is the need for a few trees to be eliminated. I a number of spots there is ample involvement to the point of outright intrusion on the actual design itself.

The 7th at WP is also a very good par-5 hole -- especially off the back tee.

Good layout and worth a look for people in the area.

[Dave Bourgeois]

Glad to see Unionvale make it so high on your list.  I absolutely love the course despite the couple of strange holes. 

Agree with Mike Sweeney on Hudson Hills.  Mohansic is really the best of the Westchester Munis.  There are some really good greens there along with a routing that takes advantage of many of the hills.  If they dumped the par3 7th and used the old par 3 3rd it would be even better.

Red makes it in the 1st or 2nd 5 for me.

Centennial can be fun, but the mounding is terrible.  Some good holes there, but not high value.  Spend the extra 1/2 hour and get to Unionvale.

Rivervale needs to manage their tree situation as there could be a good course there.  Many of the greens and very good.

Richter is higher for me, but I am a homer.

If Oxford Greens in CT makes the 75 mile range then I wonder where it would be?



 

[Matt_Ward]

Dave:

You're being a bit overly gracious on Mohansic. I don't doubt Hudson Hills isn't a perfect course but given the existing obstacles they did a fine job. I'm not hoisting the course as a "must" play public but it's got plenty of solid holes among the entire 18 to merit consideration.

Sad part is that the disparity between pribvate / public in Westchester is likely the widest gap of any county in the USA in such categories.

Centennial is also a bit better than you mention. Don't know if you have been back recently but it's not as severe as you outline.

River Vale is truly an enigma -- the potential is there but that word has been stated for that layout for quite some time. The tree situation is only one part of the puzzle -- getting the bunkers fixed and hacing new sand included would also help. Still there's enough meat on the bone there to merit a play by any die-hard public player.

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