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Joel Zuckerman

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Native American-owned golf courses
« on: July 13, 2008, 10:06:10 AM »
As many of you know, one of the true growth areas in golf architecture over the last 10--20 years has been the spread of courses on the lands of Native Americans--not always, but often with a casino component involved.  I have played/visited quite a few, but my list is incomplete, and there's no governing body or comprehensive list I've been able to access that shows all of these courses, which I think number nearly 60 as of now.  Would those of you who know of these types of courses in your area please respond and let me know what's missing from this list?  Thank you!

Northeast:
•   Lake of Isles Golf Club—Connecticut
•   Turning Stone Resort—New York

Midwest:  (Minnesota)

•   Black Bear GC
•   Dacotah Ridge
•   The Meadows at Mystic Lake
•   Wilderness GC at Fortune Bay

(Michigan)

•   Escanaba Resort 
•   Grand Traverse Resort
•   Wild Bluff

(Wisconsin)

•   Pine Hills GC


California:

•   Barona Creek Golf Club
•   Cache Creek
•   Sevillano Links

Arizona:
•   Apache Stronghold GC
•   We-Ko-Pa GC
•   Whirlwind GC


New Mexico:
•   Black Mesa GC
•   Inn of the Mountain Gods
•   Sandia GC
•   Towa Golf Resort
•   Twin Warriors

Nevada:
•   Las Vegas Paiute Resort

Mississippi:
•   Dancing Rabbit

Idaho:
•   Circling Raven
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Jeff_Brauer

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2008, 10:14:30 AM »
There is the WinStar resort in Oklahoma, designed by DA Wiebring and Steve Wolfard.
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2008, 10:16:05 AM »
In New Mexico, I think Santa Ana GC located next to Twin Warriors and Pueblo de Cochiti GC-www.golfcochiti.com- both qualify.

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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2008, 10:30:47 AM »
In Arizona, Talking Stick GC in Scottsdale and Cocopah Bend RV & Golf Resort in Yuma also qualify.
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"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

David Stamm

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2008, 01:12:44 PM »
Journey at Pechanga, in Temecula, CA.

http://www.journeyatpechanga.com/course.asp
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"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

David Stamm

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2008, 01:13:50 PM »
Sycuan in San Diego, CA

http://www.sycuanresort.com/
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"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Will MacEwen

Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2008, 01:23:19 PM »
Dungeness in Washington State, but it looks like the band purchased an existing course at some point.

http://www.dungenessgolf.com/sites/courses/dungeness.asp?id=202&page=3483
« Last Edit: July 13, 2008, 01:25:27 PM by Will MacEwen »
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Craig Van Egmond

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2008, 01:54:13 PM »

In addition to Winstar that Jeff Mentions above, here in Oklahoma, there is Cherokee Hills, an extensive remodel of an old Perry Maxwell course that is part of the their Casino/resort.



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Jim Nugent

Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2008, 02:19:51 PM »
Can anyone give feedback on some of these courses? 
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David Stamm

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2008, 02:28:12 PM »
Journey at Pechanga is brand new, so I can't comment since I haven't played it yet. It's very close to Cross Creek, another Arthur Hills course.

Sycuan used to be Singing Hills. There is 2 18 hole full length courses and one 18 hole par 3 course. Not great, but not bad either. Some decent holes throughout the property with some bad ones as well. If I'm not mistaken, they were originally Bell jr courses with a Ted Robinson jr redo.
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"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Ronald Montesano

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2008, 02:56:54 PM »
1.  Senecas in Niagara County, New York, have a casino in Niagara Falls.  They are building an RTJ2 course north of the city in Lewiston, New York.  Average piece of property that they will have to juice up for maximum sexiness.  The Senecas also own land in SW New York and have a casino there in Salamanca.  Word on the fairway is that they are looking for property on which to build or an existing course to make their own.

2.  Mohegan Sun at Pautipaug is the former Pautipaug Country Club in Connecticut.  It was purchased by the Mohegan tribe a few years back, jazzed up, and reopened.  Lake of Isles is owned by the Mashantucket Pequot nation, is across the street from its Foxwoods Casino, and has two Rees Jones courses.  The North is public-access while the South is private (but can be had with a phone call or two.)

3.  Turning Stone has 3.5 courses plus a little nine-hole job they purchased from local owners.  Shenendoah is a Rick Smith design, Kaluhyat is RTJ2, and Atunyote is Tom Fazio.  K is un bearable narrow, A is quite open and relaxed (funny that it's the site for the PGA Tour event) and Shenendoah is a blend of the other two (that's a very banal and basic assessment, for pithy's sake.)  Smith also did a 9-hole par three course that is second only to Threetops in Michigan for par three courses that I've played (although I've only played two good ones!)
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Wayne_Freedman

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2008, 03:11:07 PM »
You missed Sevillano Links in Corning, California.
Not a bad golf course, btw.

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Mike Erdmann

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2008, 04:52:44 PM »
In Oregon:

Wildhorse  http://www.wildhorseresort.com/htm/sub_pages/golf.htm
Chinook Winds  http://www.chinookwindscasino.com/golf_new_golf_courses_northwest_casino/  Currently is an older executive length course, recently purchased by the tribes and will soon be redeveloped into a full length 18.
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Tom Yost

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2008, 09:55:30 AM »
Quote from: Steve_ Shaffer on July 13, 2008, 10:30:47 AM
In Arizona, Talking Stick GC in Scottsdale and Cocopah Bend RV & Golf Resort in Yuma also qualify.

Cocopah Bend certainly qualifies as Native-American owned.  Not sure if it qualifies as a golf course however!   ;D
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Joel Zuckerman

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2008, 11:40:43 AM »
I recall somebody telling me their was a Native-American owned GC in Florida..anybody know for a fact?

Thank you--
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RJ_Daley

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2008, 12:40:34 PM »
One of the most complicated and strangest histories of a golf course and real estate development project I've ever seen that has been a saga for over 15 years now... 

Owner developer has unique 9 hole - double greens and multiple tees, sporty routing that can be played around twice with varied hole designs.  Begins as a successful operation.

Owner developer gets many investors and town gov behind him to hugely expand the project to McMansion district around new 18 hole quality design complex.  Then build extravagant clubhouse to go along. 

R.E. sales moderate to brisk, and most of the lots sell out, successfully.

Oneida tribe makes various claims including to control water/sanitation facilities as the entire complex is within old or traditional reservation parcel. 

Owner/developer hemorages red ink due to overexpansion of CH and new 18 holes, grandiose plan that can't meet expenses to operate. 

Owner developer sells golf course to the town gov to operate as a muni (sort of) maintains ownership of clubhouse F&B and banquet operations and maintenance facility, which he leases out service to the town gov. 

That goes to pot, chapt 11 on clubhouse and maintenance and after several bids, false starts, fits, trials and tribulations; the place gets a bid from Oneida tribe, as described:
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080629/GPG0101/806290636/0/GPG0101

This whole saga is a graduate level course in golf course development, how not to's and pitfalls of over constructed and overly grandios planning and development....  ::)
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 12:42:47 PM by RJ_Daley »
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2008, 04:08:31 PM »
Joel,

The one in Florida is:

www.miccosukee.com/golfclub.htm
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"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Andy Troeger

Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2008, 08:52:16 PM »
Quote from: Steve_ Shaffer on July 13, 2008, 10:16:05 AM
In New Mexico, I think Santa Ana GC located next to Twin Warriors and Pueblo de Cochiti GC-www.golfcochiti.com- both qualify.

Santa Ana definitely qualifies, and 90% sure Cochiti does as well. Additionally, Isleta Eagle south of Albuquerque qualifies as well.

I'm pretty sure Paa-Ko Ridge (Sandia Park, NM) and Sierra del Rio (Elephant Butte, NM) do NOT qualify, but I'm not 100% sure on either account. There are a lot of Native American reservations out here!
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Tyler Kearns

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2008, 10:08:18 PM »
Dakota Dunes in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
The Players Course in Winnipeg, Manitoba
Lake of the Sandhills in Buffalo Point, Manitoba

TK
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Dan Herrmann

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2008, 08:08:35 AM »
Kah-nee-ta in Warm Springs, OR. 

It was my first experience of high desert golf about 20 years ago, and I really enjoyed it (although it's nothing special from an architectural standpoint).  It's very inexpensive too.
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Native American-owned golf courses
« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2008, 08:34:11 AM »
This one just opened:

Sweetgrass in the Upper Peninsula of MI

www.golfcoursenews.com/news/news.asp?ID=4388
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"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”
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