[mike_malone]

 A friend asked me to poll the site.

[Matt_Ward]

Michael:

If price and range of courses is in play head to the Mesquite / St. George area -- abot 75-90 miles east of Vegas. The range of courses is better and you get a bit more for your $$$. You also are on the doorstep of two National Parks with Bryce and Zion.

In golf you have the likes of ...

Wolf Creek - one of the most unique courses anywhere !
Falcon Ridge
Casablacna
Oasis

in the town of St. George

Entrada (limited availability)
Sunbrook
Coral Canyon
Sand Hollow

If the person has to stay in Vegas I would offer the following with price in mind ...

Paiute Resort (play the Wolf at least once)
Primm Resort (located just over the NV / CA stateline in Nipton)
Boulder Creek (just south of Vegas and a superb buy / layout)

[Jed Peters]

I really really really enjoyed the Paiute courses just outside town. They were fun to play (all of them) and there were some "all day" rates that were available to keep playing.

Great range, good staff, no houses, fun layout.

Reflection Bay at Lake Las Vegas--I understand this is a good track, haven't played it. DO NOT PLAY THE FALLS. It was POOP when I played it.

Also, Bear's Best sucks as well.

[Chris Ord]

the only course i've played there was desert pines g.c., and i really didn't go for it.  it was supposed to be the "cheaper" option in vegas and it still cost $125 (although i just looked on the website and it appears as if the rates have gone down).  my issues with it were two-fold: i.) it's a very claustrophobic layout, and ii.) more importantly, i no longer can recall a single hole.  i've never played bali hai or the gimmicky royal links but for whatever reason, i find them intriguing. 

[tlavin]

Southern Highlands is worth a visit.

The course at the Wynn Resort is mostly forgettable.  Nice, picturesque but artificial par-3's, customer friendly fairways with sideboards on virtually every hole and an atrocious waterfall that makes you think you're playing at Epcot National.

[J Sadowsky]

Never played it, but everyone who has, seems to have wonderful things to say about Cascata and Wolf Creek. 

[rjsimper]

To pick up on Paiute from Jed Peters comments - Wolf is the superior of the three, and the Sun/Snow Mountain courses are fine, not amazing...but mostly interchangeable in quality.

[Jason Topp]

If you care about price, Paiute and Primm are good choices.  If you do not care about price, play Shadow Creek.

[Rich Brittingham]

Is Wolf Creek as good as it looks on its website?

[Sean Leary]

I enjoyed Rio Secco quite a bit...

[Matt_Ward]

Rich B:

In a word ...

Y E S

P.S. There's been plenty of talk on the course -- if you access the archives you can see it all for yourself.

[Jed Peters]

To pick up on Paiute from Jed Peters comments - Wolf is the superior of the three, and the Sun/Snow Mountain courses are fine, not amazing...but mostly interchangeable in quality.

Agreed 100%. Fun to spend the day out there.

[rjsimper]

Is Wolf Creek as good as it looks on its website?

From what I have heard, good is in the eye of the beholder.  Spectacular and unique are typically thrown around in consensus, but good depends on what you are wanting. 

I will say, however, that I am eager to play there. 

[Rich Brittingham]

From the old posts I get a semi "Stranz-y" feel. 

[Jason Topp]

From the old posts I get a semi "Stranz-y" feel. 

This is like putting sausages in front of my dog - even though I do not really want to debate the course for the millionth time.

Wolf Creek is not like a Strantz course..  Strantz courses are fun and, while unique, offer shot challenges that anyone can reasonably discern and handle. 

The 8th hole is an example of what I do not like about Wolf Creek - 220 or 250 yards, downhill something like 10 stories, to a green that is surrounded by water on three sides.  Contrary to the description there is not bail out room to the right, the area is small and has a cart path next to it so that the ball is likely to go into the environmentally sensitive area in which you are not supposed to tread and therefore cannot hit a recovery shot.  Throw in 100 degree temps, a 20 mile per hour wind and speed bumps on the cart paths and I literally think my best strategy would be to hit it in the water.

[Kalen Braley]

Jason,

Not to be a contrarian, but it looks very reasonable from the white tees.  If ones game isn't suited for the shot from the back tees, then they should move up right?

[Jason Topp]

Jason,

Not to be a contrarian, but it looks very reasonable from the white tees.  If ones game isn't suited for the shot from the back tees, then they should move up right?

Fair point Kalen, but I really do not want to play a course at elevation at 5800 yards.  Theoretically, I could jump from tee to tee but that would be pretty tough to figure out your first time at a vacation destination course.

[John Mayhugh]

I think Wolf Creek is worth a trip to play, simply because it is so unique.  I hated the fact that the much of the desert area must be played as an "environmentally sensitive" area.  You have to treat it as a hazard even though you could easily play shots from it.  Jason's right that the eighth hole is a poor one, but I don't think this is indicative of the rest of the course.

Vegas is not where you go for great golf architecture.  Instead, take in the glitz & glamour.  If money is no object, I would think Cascata should be included.  Then, for variety, there is the tee-mate program at Rio Secco.....
http://www.riosecco.net/sites/courses/layout9.asp?id=604&page=32616

[Kalen Braley]

Jason,

Not to be a contrarian, but it looks very reasonable from the white tees.  If ones game isn't suited for the shot from the back tees, then they should move up right?

Fair point Kalen, but I really do not want to play a course at elevation at 5800 yards.  Theoretically, I could jump from tee to tee but that would be pretty tough to figure out your first time at a vacation destination course.

Jason,

I agree it doesnt sit well when wanting to post a score, but you make a good point.  With the elevation drop and at elevation, I'm betting the hole plays more like 175 from the 210 tee so that could make for a less extreme hole.

I still think Matt Ward has the best take on these kinds of courses.  Its like eating Thai Food vs Steak and Potatoes.  Yes its different, yes its a bit exotic...but its still really really good.

If we want to talk about unplayable holes, I can think of one that is considered the finest par 3 in the world.....16 at CPC.  And thats at sea level with no elevation drop!! 

[Jason Topp]

Jason,

Not to be a contrarian, but it looks very reasonable from the white tees.  If ones game isn't suited for the shot from the back tees, then they should move up right?

Fair point Kalen, but I really do not want to play a course at elevation at 5800 yards.  Theoretically, I could jump from tee to tee but that would be pretty tough to figure out your first time at a vacation destination course.

Jason,

I agree it doesnt sit well when wanting to post a score, but you make a good point.  With the elevation drop and at elevation, I'm betting the hole plays more like 175 from the 210 tee so that could make for a less extreme hole.

I still think Matt Ward has the best take on these kinds of courses.  Its like eating Thai Food vs Steak and Potatoes.  Yes its different, yes its a bit exotic...but its still really really good.

If we want to talk about unplayable holes, I can think of one that is considered the finest par 3 in the world.....16 at CPC.  And thats at sea level with no elevation drop!! 

No comparison between this hole and 16 at Cypress Point which has a big bailout option that anyone can take. 

I think you are off on the distance.  On the day I played, the hole was more like 250 because of the wind.  I hit driver, hit the green and made a 3 but I did not think it was a reasonable hole.

Nothing wrong with different.  Nonetheless, just because it is different does not mean it is good.

Here is another example from the course - number 9.  From the blue tees it is uphill so there is no chance to reach the green.  It is a driver to a 50 yard wide fairway and a wedge to a normal green.  The opposite extreme - so bland and therefore without interest.  Perhaps on this one, I should go to the back tee, but then would be faced with a 240 yard carry off the tee.

 

[Jon Spaulding]

I think Wolf Creek is worth a trip to play, simply because it is so unique.  I hated the fact that the much of the desert area must be played as an "environmentally sensitive" area.  You have to treat it as a hazard even though you could easily play shots from it.  Jason's right that the eighth hole is a poor one, but I don't think this is indicative of the rest of the course.

Vegas is not where you go for great golf architecture.  Instead, take in the glitz & glamour.  If money is no object, I would think Cascata should be included.  Then, for variety, there is the tee-mate program at Rio Secco.....
http://www.riosecco.net/sites/courses/layout9.asp?id=604&page=32616

I hereby nominate Rio Secco for the location of KP7.......

Considering price is no object; have your friend set up a game at Southern Highlands. I played there in March, took a caddie, and it was quite nice. There are a few awful holes there, but the majority are decent.

[George Pazin]

Never played it, but everyone who has, seems to have wonderful things to say about Cascata and Wolf Creek. 

Haven't read any of my posts, eh?

Is Wolf Creek as good as it looks on its website?

If you like how it looks...

See Jason Topp's posts for a good idea of my thoughts.

[Doug Bolls]

Depending on what you are looking for, I really enjoyed Bear's Best - not too far from Vegas Strip.  A collection of Nicklaus' more interesting holes from his courses around the world.
Fun afternoon.

[rjsimper]

Okay that photo is pretty bad.

Will anyone who really likes the course please try to explain what is going on there?  I could understand that look for a 150 yard hole from the tips, but the blue tees are 6400 yards and they throw this at you at 217?  If anything it seems like the blues should be up with the whites at 150, leave the 217 for the blacks, and TNT the 250 tee box. 

I'd still like to play the course, but I'd like to play it with Top Flites instead of ProVs

[George Pazin]

Okay that photo is pretty bad.

Will anyone who really likes the course please try to explain what is going on there?  I could understand that look for a 150 yard hole from the tips, but the blue tees are 6400 yards and they throw this at you at 217?  If anything it seems like the blues should be up with the whites at 150, leave the 217 for the blacks, and TNT the 250 tee box. 

I'd still like to play the course, but I'd like to play it with Top Flites instead of ProVs

Ryan, scorecard yardages are almost meaningless on this course. It is flat out bizarro golf. Some of the tees are downright dangerous - I honestly can't believe they let people go up on #2 tee. For me it was a bizarro 5 iron out into the wild blue yonder that eventually found its way back to earth and the 2nd fairway.

The course looks like one of those gag calendars of the world's hardest golf holes. If you like to watch your tee shots soooooooooooaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrr   off big cliffs, WC is one helluva course.

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