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Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2010, 09:30:56 PM »
Golf is an elixir for so many much like gambling, women, alcohol and thus many very powerful people make bad decisions regarding it.  That's what allowed the golf business and the game to come to where it is today.  Whether it be equipment, real estate or maintenance.  Remember all the golf IPO's where sophisticated business men who would never put money into a stock with another name were lined up to lose money on golf stocks..just to say they were part of it.....anyone in the industry had to have a gut feeling that so much of this could not be justified in the longhaul....the golf industry made it look as if all projects, equipment etc had to be Mercedes when there was a huge market for Hondas....and it didn't work.....how many RE ads did one see in a golf digest in the mid 60's?  There is so much power at play within the industry that a golf writer can be unemployed in a second for going against such....same for TV .....I see no way a writer can break from it....
« Last Edit: January 10, 2010, 09:58:19 PM by Mike_Young »
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Anthony Gray

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2010, 09:50:06 PM »
Golf is an elixir for so many much like, gambling, women, alcohol and thus many very powerful people make bad decisions regarding it.  That's what allowed the golf business and the game to come to where it is today.  Whether it be equipment, real estate or maintenance.  Remember all the golf IPO's where sophisticated business men that would never put money into a stock with another name were lined up to lose money on golf stocks..just to say they were part of it.....anyone in the industry had to have a gut feeling that so much of this could not be justified in the longhaul....the golf industry made it look as if all projects, equipment etc had to be Mercedes when there was a huge market for Hondas....and it didn't work.....how many RE adds did one see in a golf digest in the mid 60's?  There is so much power at play within the industry that a golf writer can be unemployed in a second for going against such....same for TV .....I see no way a writer can break from it....

  Mike makes an inteligent point here. Many would invest in golf without due diligence before other "stocks" just to be part of the  crew. A close friend, now 78 years old bought the farm on a golf course. The real money was on the residential lots around the course. The "thrill" and "prestijge" of being a golf course owner superseeded his better judgement.

  Tony Typo


Jerry Kluger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2010, 10:08:32 PM »
To be honest, I don't see it as ill conceived real estate developments - just too many.  There are some beautiful homes on good golf courses but without the demand they are going to die.  I was recently down in south Florida playing golf at one of those developments and I asked myself an even more difficult question:  What will these developments look like in 30 or 40 years?  My answer was - ghost towns. The baby boomers are retiring and buying into these developments but when we are gone there will be no demand for them and they will fall apart.  They depend upon club dues and homeowners associations but the children of the baby boomers have no need for them and no interest in owning them - scary.

Magazines like Golfweek are still in the game for ad revenue and have their best resort, real estate and casino lists.  When I asked one writer about why write the puff pieces about the courses if you know that you have to come out with a positive he review - his response was I should not read them as I am not the person they are targeting. 

A golf magazine is not where I would expect a warning of possible financial disaster because of the over development of golf communities - this should have come from Forbes, Barons or the WSJ because they write about finance and investments - golf magazines write about golf.

Gib_Papazian

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #28 on: January 11, 2010, 01:51:07 AM »
While there are no working scribes today with the chops of Darwin, Dobereiner or Herb Wind, there are a good number of honest, skillful writers on the national scene who occasionally expel their deepest thoughts without regard to consequences.

Whitten's scathing dismissal of Turnberry last year comes to mind as well as David Feherty's angry diatribes - though transparently packaged as high comedy.

In my view, the gaping hole in American golf writing is on the regional and local level, where poorly composed, stilted pap gets passed off as journalism under the indifferent eye of sports editors who view "the golf guy" as little more than an annoying nuisance.

Oddly, it was my experience that the managing editor and publisher generally took far more interest than the sports editor in my byline - primarily because they played our game. Most everyone else in the newsroom would rather eat glass than write or read about golf. I had one idiot call me up just before going to press to let me know he corrected all my "spelling errors." As it turns out, I had written a course review and used the word "penal" several times - which this genius copy editor had changed to "penile." Luckily, we caught it just before the final layout was completed.  

One of the other components of this dearth of honest opinion is that big tournaments are often assigned to a regular beat writer because the golf column is written by a lowly “correspondent” (or “stringer”) - which is a euphemism for underpaid chump who is technically an independent contractor and not an employee.

This explains why tournament press conferences are repetitious exercises where writers who only cover golf once a year struggle to ask cogent questions about a game they do not understand on any more than a rudimentary level.

In short, they don’t know enough about the subject to even attempt an edgy column because 99% of the writers have never devoted more than a passing thought to the game beyond playing in the yearly pressroom scramble tournament in tennis shoes and borrowed clubs.

With the plum assignments covered by senior writers, the “golf guy” is usually left to write 300 word pieces about high school golf and/or course openings where a stampede of subsistence level hacks crowd the 'Press Day' buffet line after a shotgun start and then prostitute themselves as a P.R. arm for whichever course coughed up a tee time and some Swedish meatballs.

Most of the local NorCal golf writers hated me. It did not start out that way, but after 12 years I stepped on a lot of sensitive toes. I pissed off the Sierra Club, Mayor Brown, the PUC and any golf management company or private club that treated juniors badly or tried to take advantage of the public.

Many thought I was arrogant, opinionated and bored my readers to tears with hopelessly pedantic recitations of my highfalutin opinions of this course or that ‘game improvement’ product. Nobody likes a loose cannon who refuses to ride the gravy train.

The difference between me and those other stiffs was that I didn’t have to be nice to anybody. In my view, you either write exactly what you think for the benefit of your readership, or admit to that Armenian in the mirror that you are in the game for the freebies and just another shameless leech whose affections can be had for cheap rent.

If you only make $100 a column and your recreation depends on alms from local G.M.’s or others with the power to fork over comp tee times or demo clubs to the local golf scribe, you cannot exactly piss in their Cherrios about poor conditions and overpriced green fees.

And believe me, the editor does not want to get a bunch of complaints from a local course or business who buys ad space in a rag already bleeding red ink. It gets even worse when free papers spring up in competition whose entire revenue stream is derived solely on ad sales based on phony circulation numbers. My sports editor used to lament that he sometimes received "more mail and calls about your stupid golf column than all the important sports put together." Sorry. Really . . . .  

So in answer to the question, the reason there are no more bluntly honest writers (at least on the local level) is that even if they knew enough to evaluate (and fairly criticize) what is before them, the consequences both personally and for the newspaper make it easier to take the path of least resistance and play the game.

Unless, of course, the writer is a congenital twat who writes for the readership - and the readership only. To idiots like me, to do otherwise would have violated the sacred trust of those who turned to my byline for the truth as I saw it, regardless of who liked it or who it pissed off.

In golf, that is rare these days.      



  

 

    


« Last Edit: January 11, 2010, 11:33:22 PM by Gib Papazian »

mike_beene

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #29 on: January 11, 2010, 01:57:35 AM »
Honest writing often still misses future events because a writer is still a product of his own experience and in addition may be challenged by a confused,lazy or less than honest opponent.Thus,the reader still must choose and human nature makes most hear what they want to hear. Only hindsight is consistently 20/20. Maybe a bust makes people,for a short time,open their eyes and be more objective.

Gib_Papazian

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #30 on: January 11, 2010, 02:01:00 AM »
Mike,

I read that post four times and have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say. Is that some sort of mystical Koan?

Please explain. Sincerely.

mike_beene

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #31 on: January 11, 2010, 02:14:35 AM »
Gib,let me try it this way: no matter how honestly a person writes,there has to be a reader who discerns the honest writing. That gets tougher when 3 prostitutes write something different. Or when there are honest differences of opinion. There are so many potential places for conflicts of interest it is difficult to know who is credible. I dont think writing would have,nor perhaps should have,averted the bubble bursting(although it might assist a few diligent researchers.) Just did the all nighter from Maui to Dallas so my brain function may be lower than usual.

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #32 on: January 11, 2010, 01:51:23 PM »
When we put together the most recent World Atlas of Golf one of the writers was Iain Carter, the BBC's Radio Golf Correspondent. He must get to see some pretty dismal courses during the year following the European Tour as well as a few good ones ANGC, US and [British] Open venues, Walker Cup venues etc. He wrote with enormous affection, appreciation and understanding about such courses as The Addington, Royal North Devon, Royal West Norfolk and so on, although, in the end, these were cut from the main body text. I loved his comment regarding Royal North Devon, that TOC's condition would be exactly like this if it hadn't had many years' worth of Open money coming in to maintain it.

Peter Dobereiner wasn't entirely on our wavelength about golf course design. In Golf Courses of the European PGA Tour he was far from critical of courses such as Royal Waterloo, Fulford, Valderrama, St Mellion. I also remember him advocating playing the Open Championship in alternate years on only two courses, Royal Birkdale and Muirfield, because they were the only courses that were not unfair on the then roster. I recall, too, an article in which he proposed that it would be better for the game if all bunkers were dug up and replaced with trees, because good players could always get out of bunkers easily and were rarely penalised for directional error, whereas trees should be planted in such a way that once you were out of position you should be forced to drop a shot by hacking back onto the fairway or even at 180-degrees from the intended direction.

Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #33 on: January 11, 2010, 02:45:42 PM »

  One of my favorite Frank Zappa quotes . . .

 "“Rock journalism is people who can't write interviewing people who can't talk for people who can't read.”

 
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #34 on: January 11, 2010, 03:12:42 PM »
Slag-

Zappa on GCA! Solid!  8)
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Bruce Wellmon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #35 on: January 11, 2010, 03:20:30 PM »
Back to the book. My wife and I have read the 2 available in the US. The third, "The girl who kicked the hornet's nest" is not yet available stateside till March(?). They are excellent. If anyone has a copy of the third, PM me. Thanks.   

Gib_Papazian

Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #36 on: January 11, 2010, 11:22:37 PM »
Mark,
As I tried (unsuccessfully) to express on the previous page, the most important ingredient in a writer is to communicate "their truth."  Dobereiner's postmortem disagreement with the prevailing dogma in this little corner of cyberspace does not invalidate his views. It simply means that he arrived at different conclusions in what was really a different era.

My primary issue is with those who slither on the fringes of journalistic immorality for personal gain - a disease endemic to writers in this era of infomericals disguised as objective reporting.

-g     

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #37 on: March 15, 2010, 06:22:26 PM »
Fans of Stieg Larsson's writing will be interested in this article on Nordic detective novels in the current issue of The Economist:

http://www.economist.com/culture/displaystory.cfm?story_id=15660846

Bob_Huntley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #38 on: March 15, 2010, 06:40:13 PM »
Steve,

"I think you have confused Matt Taibbi with a high quality investigative journalist. No doubt he is a critical questioner and insightful commentator, but his brand of "slam first and retract later" shouldn't be mistaken for factual analysis and journalistic integrity. His recent pieces on GS and high frequency trading reveal his ability to selectively twist a series of events into a conspiratorial weave, while conveniently omitting critical facts and viable alternative explanations.'

Forget his ignorance on high speed trading, did he not point out that GS was shorting the very same products that they were assuring their clients were of the highest quality? Or am I wrong?

Bob

 


Jonathan Cummings

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo
« Reply #39 on: March 16, 2010, 03:29:24 AM »
I read Shack 2-3 times a day.  He's the best.  Ran's interviews (as well as Ran's writing), Klein, Huggan, the meek Armenian, Riley (for humor and his wonderful metaphors), Whitten, Tatum and a few others are worth reading now-a-days. 

The problem I find with blogs is that there is just too much noise and not enough signal.  Although there are a few regulars on Shack's site that have great depth and great writing ability.

JC 

Steve Lapper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo New
« Reply #40 on: March 16, 2010, 07:02:21 AM »
Steve,

"I think you have confused Matt Taibbi with a high quality investigative journalist. No doubt he is a critical questioner and insightful commentator, but his brand of "slam first and retract later" shouldn't be mistaken for factual analysis and journalistic integrity. His recent pieces on GS and high frequency trading reveal his ability to selectively twist a series of events into a conspiratorial weave, while conveniently omitting critical facts and viable alternative explanations.'

Forget his ignorance on high speed trading, did he not point out that GS was shorting the very same products that they were assuring their clients were of the highest quality? Or am I wrong?

Bob

  




Bob,

    Taibbi, like several others before him (including the likes of Andrew Ross Sorkin, Gretchen Morgenson, Joe Nocera, and Laurie Cohen) did in fact highlight the well-revealed practice of GS. Unlike the others, he wove it into some mass conspiratorial fabric that contained more fallacies and questionable assumptions than economic facts. The other journalists simply revealed this (very common) disclaimer over the past decade when few readers cared much about the Street's oft-questionable practices.

  While I would not defend many of the GS practices (or the mass of other sell-side Wall Street firms that still, to this day, continue the practice of "shorting to their clients") there does exist very viable and economically important reasons for taking a short position against one's client.  For example, the most legitimate of which is the age-old practice of "market-making:" Facilitating the client's need for a security that may, or may not, be found in the firms real-time inventory. GS has long been considered the Street's best practitioner of this and, as such, provides highly valuable liquidity to the marketplace. In volatile markets, across all tradable asset classes, it is sound practice to seek out the most active provider of liquidity.

  GS is an uber-agressive, very, very savvy market-making firm. They run, perhaps, the world's largest proprietary hedge fund. Taibbi would have been more accurate to focus on their ability to aggressively use their leverage to extract ransom-like collateral from their counter-parties (i.e AIG 2007-08). Both GS and JPM lead the way in bullying their posiition around the financial world.

   Hope you are well and this helps to explain a little.  :)
« Last Edit: March 16, 2010, 07:18:48 AM by Steve Lapper »
The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking."--John Kenneth Galbraith

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