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Glenn Spencer

Swan Songs
« on: May 19, 2008, 02:21:46 PM »
I was talking with a friend of mine a little while ago and he mentioned that Miami Shores was built in 1949 and that Donald Ross had passed away in 1948. We both, being the sleuths that we are, were wondering if this might have been his last course. Is there any kind of information for such a thing? What were some of the best swan songs that were built by guys that did many courses?

What are the last courses attributed to:


Ross
Tillinghast
Emmet
Travis
Raynor

and some of the others? Thank you.

Greg Krueger

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2008, 02:29:23 PM »
Glenn, it is my understanding that Raleigh Country Club was the last Ross course. The Donald Ross Society would know for sure.

Bob_Huntley

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2008, 02:39:13 PM »
Glenn, 

I believe that MPCC Dunes was Seth Raynor's last project. It was finished by Robert Hunter.

Bob

David Stamm

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2008, 02:49:46 PM »
Glenn, I believe Tillinghast's last course(s) were the ones that he worked on w/ Billy Bell. Those would be Brookside in Pasadena and the Virginia CC in Long Beach. Philip Young can confirm or deny this.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

David Stamm

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2008, 02:52:41 PM »
Glenn, 

I believe that MPCC Dunes was Seth Raynor's last project. It was finished by Robert Hunter.

Bob


Bob, did work actually begin there while he was alive? 
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Glenn Spencer

Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2008, 03:10:15 PM »
Glenn, I believe Tillinghast's last course(s) were the ones that he worked on w/ Billy Bell. Those would be Brookside in Pasadena and the Virginia CC in Long Beach. Philip Young can confirm or deny this.

Wow!! I did not know that Tillinghast did Brookside. I played there and didn't even know it. Thanks for all of your information gentlemen. How many others courses did Tillie do in California.? In my mind, I just thought SFGC and maybe some others. How about Mackenzie's last?

David Stamm

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2008, 03:21:27 PM »
Glenn, I believe Tillinghast's last course(s) were the ones that he worked on w/ Billy Bell. Those would be Brookside in Pasadena and the Virginia CC in Long Beach. Philip Young can confirm or deny this.

Wow!! I did not know that Tillinghast did Brookside. I played there and didn't even know it. Thanks for all of your information gentlemen. How many others courses did Tillie do in California.? In my mind, I just thought SFGC and maybe some others. How about Mackenzie's last?


Techinically, I guess you could say Pasatiempo was his last since he tinkered with it (since he lived on the course) until he died there. He did, however have courses that were completed after Pasa was initially done.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

David Stamm

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2008, 03:27:15 PM »
Glenn, BTW, it was course number 2 at Brookside, if memory serves.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

John_Conley

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2008, 03:36:38 PM »
How about Mackenzie's last?

Probably his work in Australia.  My understanding is that he went, worked, returned, and died.  He did not get to return to see them completed.

Phil_the_Author

Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2008, 03:53:54 PM »
Glen,

The last original design(s) by Tilly was the single largest golf course complex ever built then or since. The three courses at Bethpage State Park, the Reb, Blue and Black courses. There has never been another example where three courses were planned and built all at the SAME time. Places such as Pinehurst and Bandon and the huge complex of 10 courses (and growing) outside of Beijing are larger, but at not time were three courses or more built and designed at a single time.

All three were scheduled for a 1935 opening, but weather  problems forced the seeding of the Black to be delayed until the spring of 1935 and so it didn't open for play in 1935 as the other two did.

There were two unintended consequences as a result. First, the 1936 Public Links Championship which had been awarded to Bethpage with the idea that it would be contested on the Black and Red courses would now be contested on the Red and Blue.

The second is that with the Black's hosting of the U.S. Open championship in 2002, Bethpage is the only golf club that can lay claim to THREE different courses hosting a national championship.

After tilly finished his PGA Course Consultation tour in August of 1937 he joined forces with billy Bell, but their work was limited by the Depression. Both Brookside and Virginia were major renovations projects and as such can not be considered original designs.

The very last original design that has ever been mentioned (this in an article in the Pacific Golfer by Tilly) was a reference to a new course design in Seattle that he and Bell were planning.

No one has ever been able to find anything else concerning this project, not even location for it.

Maybe there is a missing Tilly/Bell somewhere out there that Jordan or others have walked un unawares...  ;D

Chris_Blakely

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Re: Swan Songs
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2008, 04:37:53 PM »
I believe Emmet's last course was Hob Knob Hill GC.