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mike_malone

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #25 on: July 24, 2008, 02:45:35 PM »
 Dan,

   I think I came with #2 down to the old location, then a new green for #3 over in your teaching area, then #4 being a par 3 to present #3. A tee near #4 tee toward #5 and over the valley. #7 is the tough one, but maybe  start the hole closer to the property line on the left  and head down to near the present  #5 tee.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2008, 02:52:20 PM by michael_malone »
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D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2008, 04:00:01 PM »
Mike,
are you suggesting restoring the old 2nd hole?
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mike_malone

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #27 on: July 24, 2008, 04:05:38 PM »
 I did not know where #2 used to be when I came up with the idea that it ought to be down the hill near to #3 tee. That #2 green is out of place on that classic course. I imagine that low area over the creek would present serious challenges for construction of a green today. The key to my changes for the front nine is moving #3 green and using the existing green for a par 3.
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D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #28 on: July 24, 2008, 05:04:58 PM »
yes, i do not think the old #2 greensite would work. 

what jim wagner suggested was to move #3 green the other direction about in the middle of current 4th hole, which would be eliminated.  then to lengthen #5 with a new green further back. then connect the routing back to the 6th tee with a new par 3 in between 5 & 6.  this would also improve the practice area.

i agree that it would also be good to replace the 2nd hole as well, but you could easily go from one green straight to #3 tee.  then you would just have to find a place for another par 3, which could be either on the front or back nine, since both already have two par 3's.

dan
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mike_malone

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2008, 09:26:18 AM »
 How much area is available in the back of #5 ?
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D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #30 on: July 25, 2008, 09:54:21 AM »
there is alot of room behind the 5th green, which is a ridge above the third tee.  a green back there would have a severe fall off to the left, not unlike alot of other holes at PH.

also a twp. park (kent) borders the entire left side of hole #6
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mike_malone

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #31 on: July 25, 2008, 11:12:33 AM »
So that seems to open up possibilities for change. If one does not restore #10 to the old angle I would love to see that green closer to #11 tee making it a play around the pond to the left and up the hill.
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Joe Bausch

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2009, 04:57:23 PM »
I've found a December 19, 1926 article from the Public Ledger that suggests Francis Warner was the architect of Paxon.  His name has been mentioned in the past, so this is nothing more than a confirmation.  What is interesting to me is that originally a 27 hole layout was being planned.  You'll also note at the end of the article is something mentioning Toomey and Flynn getting a job at Brookline.




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Mike_Cirba

Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2009, 08:18:58 PM »
Joe,

Wasn't J. Franklin Meehan working with Warner at that point, based on some of the other articles you've found?

The stuff I saw back when stated it was designed by Warner & Meehan, I believe.
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Joe Bausch

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #34 on: January 31, 2009, 08:21:12 PM »
Quote from: MikeCirba on January 31, 2009, 08:18:58 PM
Joe,

Wasn't J. Franklin Meehan working with Warner at that point, based on some of the other articles you've found?


Yes.
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Mike_Cirba

Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #35 on: July 19, 2009, 01:31:32 PM »
Kyle Harris and I were talking about Paxon Hollow the other day and I told him that I would share the original routing with him.

This was sent to me a few years back from a fellow by the name of Kurt Kimmerling..

"#1 was as it is now.  #2 was a short par four that ran down over the hill behind the current hole's green.   #3 was at the bottom of the hill, a par three that ended near the existing #3 tee.   #4 is now number #3.   #5 was as it is now.   (That's right, the current #4 didn't exist on original course.)  #6 was as it is now.   #7 was as it is now.   #8 green is original but the tee was back then, further to the right near the current #4 green.   #9 was as it is now."

"You need to use our imagination now for the back nine.   The original #10 teed off near the existing practice green.   (You can still see the old tee.   It's used as part of today's "shag range".)   It was a par five that ended about where the existing #17 green is today.   #11 was actually the existing #16 played the other direction!   THe tee was at today's green and the green at today's tee.   #12 was the exsting #11.   #13 was the existing #12.   #14 Teed where the existing #13 tees today  It plays the same fairway, but the hold green was back in what is now the field behind the existing #13 green.   (You can still see the old green back there if you use your imagination).   #15 was a par three coming back towards today's #16 green.   #16 was the existing #16  #17 was what is now #15.  #18 played down the hill from today's #15 green and then played to the existing #18 green."

"The course routing was changed to remove the hill which had to be climbe between the then #10 green and the then #11 tee."

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D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #36 on: July 19, 2009, 03:02:55 PM »
mike you are close but how can you play hole #16 twice.  once bacwards and then again forward.  #10 played as you described with the green somewhere in the front of current 18 fairway.  Then #11 played as a par three to the current #17 green.  then you walked up the hill and played the old #12 which was basicall current #16 in reverse.  then down to the current #11 which was the old #13.
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Mike_Cirba

Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #37 on: July 19, 2009, 03:07:06 PM »
D_Malley.

Thanks...I saw that when I waas typing and hoped someone would chime in! 
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Kyle Harris

Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #38 on: July 19, 2009, 11:55:02 PM »
Pity that 13 isn't original to the Meehan design - it could be one of the best green sites I've played.

Who made the changes? There is plenty of commendable work there!
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA
« Reply #39 on: July 23, 2009, 07:14:22 PM »
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #40 on: November 17, 2009, 02:30:21 PM »
I recently played Paxon Hollow on a beautiful fall day last week. I was favorably impressed with the recent bunker work of Gil Hanse and Company. The course is fun to play and seems longer than the stated yardage because of the hilly terrain. IMO PH is just as hilly as Huntingdon Valley and perhaps even more so.Here are some pics:


From the 10th tee-short par4- 288y



Bunker 13



Approach 12



« Last Edit: November 17, 2009, 02:54:44 PM by Steve_ Shaffer »
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"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Joe Bausch

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #41 on: November 17, 2009, 03:00:09 PM »
Yowser, Steve, either my monitors are broken or your camera is not functioning well!  Just a tad heavy on the green color me thinks.
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D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #42 on: November 17, 2009, 04:02:20 PM »
steve,
what day were you here?

sorry i did not see you
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Matt OBrien

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #43 on: November 17, 2009, 04:17:14 PM »
Quote from: Joe Bausch on November 17, 2009, 03:00:09 PM
Yowser, Steve, either my monitors are broken or your camera is not functioning well!  Just a tad heavy on the green color me thinks.

If your monitor is broken then mine is as well!!!
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mike_malone

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #44 on: November 17, 2009, 04:17:48 PM »
 I would love to see those evergreens go on#10. This brings the creek into play. I'm familiar with the safety issues on #18, but "visibility" is the best safety. Besides I want to move the fairway way to the left on 18 anyway to bring more of the slope into play.
  There are so many available areas for play that aren't being used  on that course. Most courses would cry ( I was going to say"kill" but I'm afraid to use that word on this site) for such options.


 

    
« Last Edit: November 17, 2009, 04:41:27 PM by mike_malone »
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #45 on: November 17, 2009, 04:36:37 PM »
Adjust your monitors fellows. That's a Leica lens.  ;D
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"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #46 on: November 17, 2009, 09:34:19 PM »
Quote from: mike_malone on November 17, 2009, 04:17:48 PM
I would love to see those evergreens go on#10. This brings the creek into play. I'm familiar with the safety issues on #18, but "visibility" is the best safety. Besides I want to move the fairway way to the left on 18 anyway to bring more of the slope into play.
  There are so many available areas for play that aren't being used  on that course. Most courses would cry ( I was going to say"kill" but I'm afraid to use that word on this site) for such options.

Mike,
there are 5 evergreens down the right side of #10 which are all on the 18th hole side of the creek as you play the 10th hole.  i would like to see them all go except for that big one seen clearly in pic above which is closest to the tee.  That tree is very effective in forcing you to shape your tee shot (r to L) on #10 if you attempt to drive the green.  but the other four behind it are very close to the creek and are more in play on 18.  if you take them out you could cut the 18th fairway much closer to the waters edge.
  

    
« Last Edit: November 18, 2009, 07:18:40 AM by D_Malley »
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Sean_A

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #47 on: November 18, 2009, 02:01:46 AM »
Wow, this site looks VERY severe for golf.  It looks loike on some of those holes a shot 20 yards off line could end up in the next state. 

Ciao
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mike_malone

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #48 on: November 18, 2009, 11:29:21 AM »
 Sean,

   This course is a few miles from Rolling Green, so it shares our topography.
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D_Malley

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Re: Paxon Hollow GC, Broomall,PA-now with new pics
« Reply #49 on: November 18, 2009, 11:33:12 AM »
Sean,
It is a site with several hills and valleys.  just about every green has fall offs in the back and at least one side, approaches and recoveries can be very challenging, but are usually played with short irons.  there are alot times where you must make club selection choices on the tee shots.  the current total yardage is about 5700.
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