Courses that disappointed you

[George Freeman]

Shepherd’s Hollow in Michigan left me with more to be desired...this was probably b/c of its high rating by GD and my subsequent high expectations....

[John Foley]

Very suprised about the Pinehurst #2 mentions - I thought it was world class.

As for the disapointing list:

- Kingsley Club - I liked it, but expected more.  Some holes just felt forced. 9th hole is very severe & the front part of # 2 just do not give you enogh options.
- Troon North the second time around. - First time was shortly after it opened it felt like playing golf opn the moon. Second time when the development was complete just felt too overrun with houses.
- Seven Oaks @ Colgate - A few cool holes (like #2) and a lot of snoozers. The Turning Stone courses are better.
- Eagles Nest - Again it was expectations - Some very cool holes (#8 good postage stamp imitation) but I felt there should have been more. Did not like #1 at all.
- Cascata - Had the chance to be very good - The routing is good, however the greens and hazards are very boring and the waterfalls are a joke.

[Mike_Cirba]

My disappointments:

Turtle Point (Nicklaus, Kiawah).

Lou,

Are you sure that wasn't due to the socialist in your group? 

[Mike_Cirba]

Whistling Straits
Bandon Dunes
Hidden Creek

[Chris_Blakely]

Shepherd’s Hollow in Michigan left me with more to be desired...this was probably b/c of its high rating by GD and my subsequent high expectations....

Really, I actually liked Shepherd's Hollow alot (all 27) and thought it was a very good Hills course.  Now Longaberger GC in Nashport, OH.  I was disappointed after playing that one.  Not a bad course at all, just did not meet my expectations.

Chris

[Cory Lewis]

Courses that most disappointed me:

Baltusrol(Lower)
Oak Hill
Olympic
Bay Hill

[CJ Carder]

For me it was Cruden Bay.  A visually inviting course that left me saying, "eh."  I should have played a second round at Royal Aberdeen, or just sat in Cruden Bay's bar and had a few pints.

I had that same experience.  When we got to the course, looking out of the dining room window I thought it was going to be absolutely spectacular.  Yet for whatever reason, I walked off the 18th green thinking "finally, I'm finished, let's move on to Dornoch."  To me, the course felt a lot like a par 3 course in Myrtle Beach - just with better views and better land.  I also didn't like our caddy at all - nor did I particularly care for the feeling of impending doom that the whole atmosphere gave off that day. 

[Mike Hendren]

David,

I meant that the Camp Creek site was strong enough to accomodate a top 100 modern course.

[Jim Colton]

I'll add a vote for Torrey Pines - South, it must be leading this thread.

I'll also add:

The Glen Club - Glenview, IL - still waiting for a $75 refund because they must've overcharged me
Rich Harvest Links - for years I wondered what was on the other side of that fence.  Maybe my expectations were too high.

[Voytek Wilczak]

After all I've been hearing (and seeing on TV) about Pebble, playing it was a somewhat of a letdown.

After all I've been hearing about Pine Valley, walking the course was magical every time.

Maybe if I played PV there would be no magic!

[A.G._Crockett]

Peachtree, Shoal Creek & Settindown Creek. All great properties but ho hum courses.

Greg,
I've gotta go to the other thread and see what you DID like!  I've never played Shoal Creek, so I can't comment there.  I don't know what you had been led to expect at Settindown, but it is, if anything an UNDERRATED golf course.

I was able to play Peachtree yesterday for the first time, and was just blown away.  Without question, the most interesting set of greens that I have ever played.  Great classic design; forgiving through the air off the tee, but you had better play you butt off on the ground around the greens.  Subtle, brilliant GCA, IMO.

[Kyle Henderson]

Spanish Bay. I was warned of its architectural deficiencies, and I expected the playing corridors to be overly narrow due to environmental restrictions, but the green complexes were impossibly sloped and rarely tied in with their surroundings. In the few places where width was available, the course was pinched in with bunkers and rough. If I ever go back, I'll play the forward tees and hit irons only.

The setting of that course is perhaps my favorite of any I've played -- beautiful dunes and ocean views -- but I'm very glad I didn't pay full price that day.

[Tim Nugent]

Apache Stronghold - almost got divorced over that one (probably should have not played The Boulders the day before  - although Desert Mountain got me out of the doghouse the next day).  I've played muni's with more grass.  Expected more because the Tribe owned sooo much land and there were no restrictions, no houses, etc.  Perhaps if the tees took advantage of some of the existing nearby elevation...

True Blue - perhaps because I played Caledonia in the morning.

Gotta also go w/ Torrey Pines -  although played pre-RJ, I thought it went through great trouble NOT to incorporate the the natural features/vistas.

The Glen Club - just goes to show if you charge too much for something, there will always be a segment of the market that thinks it must be good.  Just goes to show - you don't always get what you pay for!

Turtle Bay - Jack did this? Really? How long ago? ... Oh, that explains it.

Laurel Valley - Looked like Palmer tried out new ideas every few years - no continuity.

Back nine at Crystal Downs - only because I wanted to play the front again.

I could go on, but then I'm often disappointed.

About Whistling Straights, I got the same feeling re:#5 but #18 works because it has #9 as a bookend.  Like Cypress Point, I don't know why they didn't put the CH down on the bluff overlooking the water.  Perhaps they never visited Shore Acres and had a cocktail on the patio.

[wsmorrison]

James,

The dog is Mr. Peabody.  His trusty dim-witted side-kick of a boy is Sherman. 

[Patrick Glynn]

Royal Portrush. Now I know this may come as a surprise to some, but from its reputation I have expected to be blown away by it. Its a really really good course, but I personally dont think its in the same league as RCD, Lahinch, Pacific Dunes. There are a couple of great stetches of holes 4 - 7 is a lot of fun, but then you get let down with weak Par 5s & the 8th is just a horrible hole. Thought the maintenance practices there were silly, the fairways are absurdly narrow in spots - more akin to a US Open set up than an old school links layout.

I would probably give it a "Doak 7" but there are just too many negatives for me to rate it any higher.

[Phil Benedict]

Royal Portrush. Now I know this may come as a surprise to some, but from its reputation I have expected to be blown away by it. Its a really really good course, but I personally dont think its in the same league as RCD, Lahinch, Pacific Dunes. There are a couple of great stetches of holes 4 - 7 is a lot of fun, but then you get let down with weak Par 5s & the 8th is just a horrible hole. Thought the maintenance practices there were silly, the fairways are absurdly narrow in spots - more akin to a US Open set up than an old school links layout.

I would probably give it a "Doak 7" but there are just too many negatives for me to rate it any higher.

Does anybody know what Royal Portrush's actual Doak Scale rating is?

[Phil McDade]

About Whistling Straights, I got the same feeling re:#5 but #18 works because it has #9 as a bookend.  Like Cypress Point, I don't know why they didn't put the CH down on the bluff overlooking the water.  Perhaps they never visited Shore Acres and had a cocktail on the patio.

Tim:

Everything about WS -- and I mean everything, from the routing, to the holes placed by the lake, to the ending of each nine in that ravine, with an amphiteatre-style set-up for crowds, to the large expanse of tent areas removed from the course -- was designed to host major tournaments. Kohler and Dye meant for the course to do exactly what it has done, which is to host major, prestigious tournaments. I'd argue the clubhouse setting is part and parcel of that approach.

[rchesnut]

Torrey Pines...and the 1000 other golfers on the course gave me almost 6 hours to see it.
Shadow Creek...for the reasons chronicled on this site in other threads
Turtle Point
Mayacama
 

[K. Krahenbuhl]

Royal Portrush. Now I know this may come as a surprise to some, but from its reputation I have expected to be blown away by it. Its a really really good course, but I personally dont think its in the same league as RCD, Lahinch, Pacific Dunes. There are a couple of great stetches of holes 4 - 7 is a lot of fun, but then you get let down with weak Par 5s & the 8th is just a horrible hole. Thought the maintenance practices there were silly, the fairways are absurdly narrow in spots - more akin to a US Open set up than an old school links layout.

I would probably give it a "Doak 7" but there are just too many negatives for me to rate it any higher.

Does anybody know what Royal Portrush's actual Doak Scale rating is?

9

[Eric_Terhorst]

One could reasonably argue that any opinion on the quality of a golf course is entirely subjective and that disappointment means that a course did not deliver what was promised to the player....

I think disappointment is a good indicator of quality...

Jason, the problem with your definition of "quality" is that it's measured against your expectations, not against a standard that incorporates either subjective or objective criteria, not even against a "model" course that everyone can agree is near-perfect.  It's between your ears--you made up the "promises" that were supposed to "delivered."  You thought the course was going to be something that it simply wasn’t.  That has nothing to do with the “quality” that another observer or an objective evaluator might perceive.

Tell me, how is a golf course designer or owner supposed to respond to that?  If you identify “flaws” in Pasatiempo, how shall we help you over your disappointment--have a séance and ask Dr. Mackenzie how to fix it?

I hope the aspiring course designers and relatively unheralded architects who are reading this thread will completely ignore it.  If Merion, Pinehurst, Pebble Beach, Pacific Dunes, and a host of other revered courses make a “disappointments” list, then I suppose the only sane response of a current practitioner is to toss in the towel…

[JSlonis]

Interesting to me that Bethpage Black appears more than once on this thread and also on the "Courses that pleasantly surprised you" thread.

[Lloyd_Cole]

Pretty much every 'Upscale Daily Fee' I've been invited to in the NYC area. Although I'm sure none of them are mentioned here as being worthy of consideration. It's just hard to see how someone would want to shell out $200 for conditioning, bag drop boys, pretty drink cart girls and conspicuously expensive clubhouses.

Fazio's UNC Finley course was completely uninspiring. Why did I go there again?

Birkdale - I had a bad day, but still...

Southport and Ainsdale - I guess I got too excited about, but Formby was wonderful.

Felixtowe Ferry - I made the mistake of reading Balfour's book and not Doak's notes before I went.

Sawgrass - 'Caddies sir? I don't think we allow them...'

[John Foley]

Pretty much every 'Upscale Daily Fee' I've been invited to in the NYC area.

Lloyd,

Would you put Branton Woods in that category??

[Jeff Tang]

Wolf Creek in Nevada was a major disappointment for me.  It is just too modern for my tastes, too crazy.

Others include TPC of Sawgrass, great last three holes but up until that point I may have been expecting too much.  I did play it mid summer, however, and the course was in awful shape so that may have contributed to my opinion.

Glen Club near Chicago is definitely near the top of the list.

The South course at Torrey was very underwhelming for a course with that proximity to the ocean and its reputation.

[Mike_Cirba]

Interesting to me that Bethpage Black appears more than once on this thread and also on the "Courses that pleasently surprised you" thread.

Jamie,

At the risk of starting another religious war, the Bethpage Black I played about 15 years ago would never appear on anyones "Disappointing" list.

Yes, it was pretty scruffy and pretty raw in places, but that was part of the charm.  To use a shameful analogy, it was like a rabid coyote at midnight after a fight with a cheetah....ripped fur, angry, bullying, bleeding, dangerous, and stealthy.

Today...jeezus...it's just so damn fussy.   It looks so put together and today it's more like Zena the warrior princess, but not battling dragons and cyclopsi, but dressed up in Gucci attending the Emmys.   It's still strong and will kick your ass, but anything distinguishing has been toned down and gussied up and polished and softened.