News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.


Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #50 on: March 12, 2008, 02:18:32 PM »


While you are at it, explain why the average handicap does not change given the billions of dollars on new equipment that gets spent.


Uhh....take your pick:

A.  The courses are about 1000 yards longer.

B.  The greens are 4 stimp readings faster.

C.  The millions of players that the game has added who have to work for a living and don't come from the well-to-do, time-on-their-hands crowd, so they don't play, practice or take lessons as frequently as the typical golfer did a couple of generations ago, i.e., diluted playing population.

D.  Baby boomers aging, and getting worse.

E.  All of the above.

And here I used to think you were decent at logic!  :(
A & B - adjusted for by the course rating system.
C pure BS
D purely silly observation
E totally laughable
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Rich Brittingham

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #51 on: March 12, 2008, 02:31:22 PM »
Add me to the list of Mizuno players.  Purchased a slightly used set of MP33's two years ago for $200, an absolute steal.  Nothing compares to the purity of their lines.  Last year I added a pair of MP60 wedges, used as well. 
I doubt I'll ever buy new clubs again, whats the point when a new set of irons could fund 1 or 2 great golf trips throughout the year?
I think all the technology talk only helps me find these great clubs, hardly used, for so cheap.  I applaud every equipment manufacturer for their relentless pursuit of the perfect club, because that in turn forces the consumer towards a relentless pursuit for the perfect club.  Leaving me to pick up their scraps  ;)

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #52 on: March 12, 2008, 02:35:04 PM »
Garland, I'm tired of your crap. 

Go ahead and continue to believe your drivel.  I'm not responding to you anymore.  Unlike most here, you detract from my life.  Thus, you're out.



You want the truth? You can't handle the truth!

I know, I know, more of my crap.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #53 on: March 12, 2008, 02:39:00 PM »
One last time.  Don't bother addressing me.  I can assure you that the favor will be returned.

Having a bad day, eh?
 :)
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #54 on: March 12, 2008, 04:39:48 PM »
...
If you want to continue to break 80 as you near 50 going from blades to helper irons makes a hill of beans.

You have any proof to your claim? And, I don't mean the statistical sample size of one that one being yourself.

While you are at it, explain why the average handicap does not change given the billions of dollars on new equipment that gets spent.


Actually, when I take more time to think, I may agree with you some on this. My theory, which of course I don't have the scientific data to prove either, is that the impovement in technology helps a small percentage of golfers. The golfers it helps are the best golfers who don't have the run of the mill swing problems the rest of us have. What I overlooked in your statement was the specific score (which I assumed to be yours) and read it more along the lines of aging people trying to maintain their scores in general. The fact that you mention 80, and the fact that only 8% of golfers can break 80 starts to bring your statement in line with my theory. So our disagreement is about the size of the hill of beans. I claim that for breaking 80 it is a very small hill indeed.

The other thing that can be noted is that my theory clearly conflicts with the reasons given by Shivas. They are "lawyer" reasons. Perhaps good enough to convince a group of the uninitiated, but not good enough to convince me.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Steve_Lovett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #55 on: March 12, 2008, 07:45:42 PM »
Isn't putting one of the biggest variables regarding our scores? 

Do you think that most someone (an average player) who plays with the most gawd-awful tough to hit blades has THAT much difference in their shotmaking than they would with the most helpful game improvement clubs?  Does that equate to a stroke a round?  Or a stroke a nine?  Or a stroke every other round? 

If someone is putting really well, doesn't that have the biggest effect on score?  Does equipment do THAT much to help the average player's typical SCORE - or is it more a "FEEL" prescription on a short term.


C. Squier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #56 on: March 12, 2008, 08:31:43 PM »
Back to the original question:

Finally retired my Mizuno MP29's.  I've been hitting them for almost a decade now and the grooves are just plain gone.  Coupled w/ the new balls out there, I just can't spin the longer irons enough to get the trajectory I want.  Every once in awhile I'll break out a sleeve of Tour Balatas, I have still have a few left from years ago just to hit them I think.

In their replacement, Callaway prototype blades.  Not a true muscleback, but pretty close....the word blade has been bastardized lately.  Hope to get them any day now. 

CPS

JR Potts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #57 on: March 12, 2008, 08:33:17 PM »
I just picked up a set of MP-67s and a new Ping G-10 driver.  I hurt my back so I haven't been able to swing them yet but I hope to be healed enough to swing them next week in Birmingham.

Matt OBrien

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #58 on: March 12, 2008, 09:42:08 PM »
I have a set of MP 60's with 5.5 rifle shafts in them for anyone who is interested. I am not allowed to play mizuno's but i liked them so much that I snuck them into the bag for a sew rounds. I love them and wish i could play them but im forced to get rid of them. any offers?

John Kavanaugh

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #59 on: March 12, 2008, 09:51:20 PM »
The last iron shot I hit today was a 4 iron that felt poor enough I figured it to be bunkered.  My Callaway X-20 tour helper iron got me just over the fronting bunker onto the green.  My old knock dead gorgeous Titleist 863 blade would have found the bunk.  It makes a difference.

I also used a $100 gift certificate my employees who love me gave me for Christmas to by a 64 deg Callaway wedge.  If I'm not careful I might lose an extra chin hitting that thing.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2008, 09:57:45 PM by John Kavanaugh »

Steve_Lovett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #60 on: March 13, 2008, 12:27:50 AM »
The last iron shot I hit today was a 4 iron that felt poor enough I figured it to be bunkered.  My Callaway X-20 tour helper iron got me just over the fronting bunker onto the green.  My old knock dead gorgeous Titleist 863 blade would have found the bunk.  It makes a difference.

I also used a $100 gift certificate my employees who love me gave me for Christmas to by a 64 deg Callaway wedge.  If I'm not careful I might lose an extra chin hitting that thing.


John - If, by chance, you'd struck that 4-iron of yours squarely on the sweet spot do you think you'd be searching for your ball over the back of the green somewhere?  And if you had, would the likelihood be more or less of making a worse score from back there than from the fronting bunker you cleared?


Matt O'Brien - you are not allowed to play Mizuno?  What equipment are you allowed to play?

Doug Siebert

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #61 on: March 13, 2008, 01:51:56 AM »
I wish I had the actual article, but I remember seeing a discussion on the web maybe 10 years ago about an article in Golf Digest where they tested cavity back versus blades using Iron Byron and found that blades actually performed slightly better on off center hits than cavity backs, and put high handicappers' preference for them down to marketing and making the mishits feel better.

My irons are slightly cavity backed (and approaching 20 years old now) but I've screwed around with blades and with full bore cavity backs ala Ping here and there when forced to borrow a friend's set in a pinch.  I recall the cavity backs hitting a bit further than my irons while the blades hit a similar distance (based on the number on the club) but I'd put that down to the game improvement clubs having lower lofts.  Obviously I didn't play either enough to make a judgement as to whether one was better than the other for mishits.  I just know that it was a lot harder to tell where and by how much I missed with the cavity back, but not so with the blades (or with my irons)

If/when I get new irons I'll probably get something like what I've got that's kind of halfway between a cavity back and a blade.  The hybrid sets that are blades in the short irons and halfway between in the mid irons and full cavity backs in the long irons are interesting, but I'd rather than transition be from blade to halfway between, and not go all the way to full cavity backs.  I'm good with the long irons, and I think one of the reasons is that I know if I'm even a fraction of a inch off with my 1 iron.  Plus the feeling when I nut it is wonderful!  I'd hate to give that up like we have given up the feeling of a nutted persimmon driver (please, don't anyone try and tell me that metallic sound echoing off the nearest hillside is music to anyone's ears but equipment makers and owners of titanium ore mines...)
My hovercraft is full of eels.

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #62 on: March 13, 2008, 02:26:18 AM »
Having been 13 st 10lbs last autumn (192lbs for those over there) I set myself the target of getting below 12 st (168lbs).  My reward to myself, if I manage it (I'm at 12st 5lbs now, so things are looking good) will be a new set of irons, custom fitted.  


Congratualtions Mark, I look forward to seeing less of you (and the new clubs) at BUDA 2008!

I'm 19lbs down so far this year and have invested in some new toys.  Looking forward to playing with my (new) hickories.  JK is right, keep an eye on eBay and you'll get a small set for less than $100.
Let's make GCA grate again!

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #63 on: March 13, 2008, 05:14:39 AM »
Pretty impressive, Tony.  We can be the slim twins at BUDA (self discipline allowing).  A set of hickories sound fun, I might investigate.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

John Kavanaugh

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #64 on: March 13, 2008, 06:48:35 AM »
The last iron shot I hit today was a 4 iron that felt poor enough I figured it to be bunkered.  My Callaway X-20 tour helper iron got me just over the fronting bunker onto the green.  My old knock dead gorgeous Titleist 863 blade would have found the bunk.  It makes a difference.

I also used a $100 gift certificate my employees who love me gave me for Christmas to by a 64 deg Callaway wedge.  If I'm not careful I might lose an extra chin hitting that thing.


John - If, by chance, you'd struck that 4-iron of yours squarely on the sweet spot do you think you'd be searching for your ball over the back of the green somewhere?  And if you had, would the likelihood be more or less of making a worse score from back there than from the fronting bunker you cleared?


Matt O'Brien - you are not allowed to play Mizuno?  What equipment are you allowed to play?

No, it was a deep green to a back pin.  I ended up on the front of the green some 40 feet short.

Peter Pallotta

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #65 on: March 13, 2008, 09:40:17 AM »
John's right about those helper irons, but I gotta look at the things for 4 hours and so their help comes at a price.

I'm determined to take my first ever golf lessons this spring so that I can get good enough to justify buying (used, as they don't make them anymore) the prettiest set of irons I've ever seen, the Macgregor VIPs/1025M -- just beautiful muscleback blades that, I'm told, didn't sell at all because they were frighteningly hard to hit by modern standards.

Me and Jack and our Macgregor VIPs. Hehe...how could I NOT play better golf strutting around with those in my bag!

Peter 

John Kavanaugh

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #66 on: March 13, 2008, 09:42:52 AM »
These irons are not ugly at all.  I only include this pic because it googled up first as I of course bought my set from my local pro.  http://www.golfdiscount.com/products/callaway-x-20-tour-irons?gclid=CN2g-qmbipICFQ7GGgodKTodDA

Peter Pallotta

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #67 on: March 13, 2008, 10:01:48 AM »
John - I'll agree that it's a matter of taste. But I bet you'd love the 1025Ms. 

Of course I knew that you buy your clubs from your local pro. And it reminds me that guys like you are the backbone of the game in North America. I mean that. You're a member at clubs both fancy and modest, you travel and pay to play the well known greats and to promote the lesser known gems, and you support the golf pro in your community. Good stuff.

I wish I could be more like that myself.

Peter 

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #68 on: March 13, 2008, 10:36:47 AM »
The last iron shot I hit today was a 4 iron that felt poor enough I figured it to be bunkered.  My Callaway X-20 tour helper iron got me just over the fronting bunker onto the green.  My old knock dead gorgeous Titleist 863 blade would have found the bunk.  It makes a difference.

I also used a $100 gift certificate my employees who love me gave me for Christmas to by a 64 deg Callaway wedge.  If I'm not careful I might lose an extra chin hitting that thing.


John - If, by chance, you'd struck that 4-iron of yours squarely on the sweet spot do you think you'd be searching for your ball over the back of the green somewhere?  And if you had, would the likelihood be more or less of making a worse score from back there than from the fronting bunker you cleared?


Matt O'Brien - you are not allowed to play Mizuno?  What equipment are you allowed to play?

No, it was a deep green to a back pin.  I ended up on the front of the green some 40 feet short.

So you gave up the thrill of an up and down sandie for a routine two putt.  :)
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Doug Siebert

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #69 on: March 15, 2008, 05:14:05 PM »
These irons are not ugly at all.  I only include this pic because it googled up first as I of course bought my set from my local pro.  http://www.golfdiscount.com/products/callaway-x-20-tour-irons?gclid=CN2g-qmbipICFQ7GGgodKTodDA


John, I'll grant you that they aren't particularly ugly (not nearly as ugly as Ping Eye2 was, certainly)  But the price sure is ugly!  Are those really $600 better than these?

http://www.diamondtour.com/grand-hawk-xp22-4pw-rh-golf-clubs-p-1969.html

I've bought a few drivers from diamondtourgolf.com and they do a great job of assembly, including spining, trimming shaft for an exact frequency match, and swingweighting to within a half point.  And I really have a hard time believing that what you get from Nike or Callaway is really any different performance-wise than these knockoff brands they sell.

Sorry, don't mean to sound like an ad here, but I see that link that shows $1000 list price and a "big" discount down to $799 for a set of freakin' irons and have to laugh, especially since you often have to take the crappy shafts and grips that the big names include with their clubs rather than getting to select your own even if the heads were somehow better the entire club probably wouldn't be.

Think of it this way, the money you save can mean that either you get to buy 4 sets of irons to figure out which one you really like, or replace your irons 4x as often, or just get the one set and use the savings for one round of golf at Pebble Beach :)
My hovercraft is full of eels.

Will MacEwen

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #70 on: March 15, 2008, 05:38:13 PM »
I got some brand new Armour Silverscot forged blades with rifles off ebay for $73.01.


Jeff Shelman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #71 on: March 15, 2008, 06:09:37 PM »
What, are we turning into bombsquad or golfwrx? Kidding.

I do like getting new clubs. It's kind of a vice of mine.

I went to Golf Galaxy for a bit today (unfortunately there's still snow on the ground here in Minneapolis) and the new Titleist irons look really sweet. I am certainly going to hit the AP1s at some point this spring.

There's less offset than my current Callaway x-18s, but there's still a little offset to help a guy who doesn't practice much like me.

Lloyd_Cole

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #72 on: March 15, 2008, 06:15:17 PM »
Pretty impressive, Tony.  We can be the slim twins at BUDA (self discipline allowing).  A set of hickories sound fun, I might investigate.

Mark and Tony

Here's hoping I'm not Fat Boy (old (fat) boy) in June. I'm trying to get to 175 for my April tour and I may have to cut out the beer if I don't start dropping some lbs soon. I'm 186 right now - almost the heaviest I've ever been... yikes

Regarding new clubs - I'm now of the opinion that one should play clubs one likes the look and idea of. Just like clothes. I'm currently getting a circa 2000 TM 300 tour driver shafted. It's about 350cc and that looks good to me. It also helps to think this way when you're resigned to having little chance of being competitive... if I get a doctor's note for Buda, can I get a handicap adjustment?

Hit 5 balls in a net at golf store today - first 1/2 swings since the surgery. Felt OK, touch wood.

What I'm not looking forward to, this year, and onward, according to my physical therapist, is a life in 'sensible shoes'. I love my brown Ecco shoes, but I'll most probably be wearing some super supporting sneaker type with special insoles. The addidas ones look like they'll do the best job, but they are quite hideous. But if it's hideous or no golf...

wsmorrison

Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #73 on: March 15, 2008, 06:37:27 PM »
Hate to say it, Lloyd.  But those Eccos look like orthopedic shoes to me  ;)

Wayne_Freedman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Who bought or is buying new clubs for 2008?
« Reply #74 on: March 15, 2008, 06:39:27 PM »
Fitting, a real fitting (not some yahoo in the pro shop with a swing machine) is the way to go. My guy spent hours in the process.

And then building...I mean spining in three axis,  oscillating, weight matching, the whole thing. The difference is like  tasting chocolate. You won't know what you're missing until you try it.

Did a test a couple of years ago. Had been hitting a Ping G2, and then they sent me the new G5 to compare. The difference was five yards.

Then my fitter/bulder,  David Butler, asked to do some experimenting with shafts based, not on swing speed, but loading. By the time he was done, we'd added 20 yards to that G5 by finding the proper shaft (in this case, a Diamana Blue Board, 63 gram stiff). For grins, we tried that shaft on 15 different driver heads, with minimal differences in performance. Eventually, we mounted it on a Clevelenand Ti460, and two years later, it remains the club in my bag.

Same with irons. Based on swing speed, I assumed I might be ready for a Regular shaft. After testing, he put me into an extra stiff, and I gained 10 yards per iron, again based on loading.

Wishon makes a very good point in his book...that you wouldn;t buy just any pair of shoes off the rack. Nor should you do that with clubs. They're mass-produced, thrown together, and incinsistent.

You might order clubs to specs, but good luck if they measure up. And the shafts? Pot luck. Good enough is good enough, but usually, not very good at all. One size does not fit all.

Get fitted. Have them built. You'll like the the result. And, you'll spend less in the long run because you will have had them made right the first time.

Good luck.


« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 06:42:57 PM by Wayne_Freedman »

Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back