[David Stamm]

Just curious if the No Cal guys could give some insights on some of the less talked about courses on the MP, such as Laguna Seca and Rancho Canada (West and East). It maybe helpful to those that are coming in earlier in the KP week who want to squeeze in another round somewhere just to play.

[Kyle Henderson]

I don't have first hand experience at Rancho Canada or Laguna Seca, although the latter didn't impress me from what I can see from the highway and most of the people I've asked gave them lackluster reviews. Cheap options for the area but probably no bargain for what you get if you put them in another geographical region.

I have played Poppy Hills which is definitely worth the $60 NCGA rate (they'd probably give you the same if you're an SCGA member). If you're willing to head 30 minutes north of Monterey, San Juan Oaks (Bates/Couples) is worth a look.

[Adam Clayman]

David, I'll try to shed some insight. Laguna Seca is a much better golf course than Rauncho Canada. But if you want to see one of theoworst holes in all of golf, by all means, check it out.
Also, if you want to see proof that you cannot have a bad time golfing on the peninsula, go to the old Navy course, Monterey Pines. If conditioning is what people are all about, skip that suggestion. But, if you want to see some holes with real character, check it out. The twilight there use to be $10.
I would seriously consider going to Pajaro Valley, around the bay, near the Elkhorn slough.

[Bob_Huntley]

I don't have first hand experience at Rancho Canada or Laguna Seca, although the latter didn't impress me from what I can see from the highway and most of the people I've asked gave them lackluster reviews. Cheap options for the area but probably no bargain for what you get if you put them in another geographical region.

I have played Poppy Hills which is definitely worth the $60 NCGA rate (they'd probably give you the same if you're an SCGA member). If you're willing to head 30 minutes north of Monterey, San Juan Oaks (Bates/Couples) is worth a look.

.

Laguna Seca is a whole lot better than Rancho Canada, the latter has some of the weirdest holes in golf. Poppy Hills can be a good test and you should try it.

Two or three miles east of Laguna Seca on Hiway 68 is a private club, Pasadera, they might let you have access. Call them and find out.  A Nicklaus design with a couple of holes that might  raise some eyebrows.

Bob

[Tom Huckaby]

Two courses at Rancho Canada - and neither is THAT bad, but also neither is worth seeking out.  As others have said, Laguna Seca is pretty darn good... and Adam's right, the Navy course (now called Monterey Pines) is quirky and weird and while conditions are often iffy, it's cheap and pretty darn fun.

Re Pajaro, remember the great Steve Pieracci set up a group event there on the Friday.  I'd highly encourage one and all to attend.

Outside of this, obviously there are Poppy Hills and the other mega-expensive courses inside the drive...

A bit of a drive away, San Juan Oaks is darn good, as is Salinas Fairways, a surprisingly good muni.  DeLaveaga in Santa Cruz is to Pasatiempo as Pacific Grove Muni is to Spyglass Hill - that is, a "poor man's" version of the more famous big brother.  Aptos Seascape up that way is decent... and Spring Valley in Watsonville is an absolute trip, putting the q in quirk....

The choices are pretty large.  Just how much time are you going to have?

TH

[Adam Clayman]

Great catch Tom, I'd forgotten about ol' Spring Valley and Aptos. They are both miles ahead of Canada.
Aptos was, in a previous configuration and before American Golf got their hands on managing the place, was a Marion Hollins project. If 'm not mistaken.

[rchesnut]

I agree with Tom, it's a matter of how far you want to drive.   I don't think too much of Rancho Canada, Laguna Seca is better though not anything to get excited about.  Delaveaga is ok, but not worth the drive from Monterey.

My first choice would be Harding Park up in SF...true, it's a drive, but it's not far from the airport if you go there first, and if you drive up the coast from Monterey, Route 1 is simply spectacular, a coastline drive you won't ever forget.  Second choice would be San Juan Oaks, Poppy Hills a close third.   If you can find a friend who's a member, Cordevalle is a good course, and the facility there is first rate.

Rob

[Stan Dodd]

Old Del Monte is good fun and they have a Wed. Skin game starting at 3 for $50 with cart. And a lot of really good players but they have a game for all us others too.

[Tom Huckaby]

Rob - your FIRST choice outside of the biggies would be to drive all the way to SF for Harding?  Wow, I really disagree with that.  I don't find Harding to be even close to worth the $90 fee; I wouldn't advise people staying in SF to go out of there way to play it!  Others here do play it often though and like it a lot better than I do. But man, I sure wouldn't drive all the way to SF to play Harding.  But the drive is nice.  In any case I'd stick to many of the courses closer to Monterey before I'd trek to Harding.

Stan, good call re Old Del Monte, also... that's another course I prefer to Harding, btw.  Can you tell I have no love for that course?
 

[Mike Benham]

Assuming you are in the Monterey area for KP week, or driving to/from one of the airports, here are my suggestions:

Monterey Area:

Old Del Monte is nice layout, smallish greens and many challenging shots.  On 17, you can have a shot at going for the green in two and puring your shot into the crowd having lunch on the hotel's veranda ...

Laguna Seca ... short and quirky, off camber fairways, doglegs around hillsides

Bayonet / Blackhorse - depending on the renovation. either of these courses is a good test.  Bayonet is longer and straighter, Blackhorse has more doglegs and elevation change.

I would avoid the Rancho courses.  If you do play there you will kick yourself because you will realize that you should have scored 10 strokes better then you did ...

San Juan Oaks is a bit of a drive as is Salinas Fairways.

If you want the best option within 40 minutes of Monterey, another round at Pasatiempo should be an option.

To/from Airports:

San Jose - unless Huckaby invites you to Santa Teresa or you want to see first hand the course  known as "The Ranch", drive over the hill directly to Pasatiempo or onto to Monterey.

San Francisco - Sure, Harding Park is an option, more so if you want to play a course the Pro's play but Presdio is also a decent option.  Any other options down the peninsula are not worth it unless you can swing Stanford ... Half Moon Bay, the Ocean Course, is a decent option but by all means, avoid driving down Hwy from San Francisco.  Yes, it is beautiful but you aren't bringing your wife, a bottle of wine and a picnic lunch so the extra hour of driving time isn't worth it.

Oakland - flying into Oakland gives you 2 decent options, Metropolitan (a co-Johnny Miller design where he must have let someone else do the work) and Monarch Bay (the old Tony Lema) in San Leandro.  Distinctive bunkering and a solid test set along the bay but turf conditions have been tough the past few years).


Traffic patterns in the Bay Area can be a mess, depending on your arrival / departure times, it might be best to skip the golf and head away from the airports to avoid the traffic ... 

[Stan Dodd]

The Rancho courses are no great shakes from the GCA stand point but I think the East has some interesting green complexes.  It is a peaceful walk and reasonable.

[Kalen Braley]

Hey Mike,

Wouldn't you agree that taking 101 south to the PruneDale (156) turnoff is a better option for those flying into SJ or Oakland?  Taking the Nimitz down thru Santa Cruz may be slightly shorter, but that drive thru the Santa Cruz mountains is ~20 miles of twisties with 35-45 MPH curves.

I can 2nd Metropolitan as well.  Literally right at the OAK airport and has some very neat holes on the back 9.

And if time isn't an issue the drive down Hwy 1 from San Fran via Half Moon Bay is worth it..just a gorgeous drive with unspoiled views for the most part.

[Tom Huckaby]

Hey Mike,

Wouldn't you agree that taking 101 south to the PruneDale (156) turnoff is a better option for those flying into SJ or Oakland?  Taking the Nimitz down thru Santa Cruz may be slightly shorter, but that drive thru the Santa Cruz mountains is ~20 miles of twisties with 35-45 MPH curves.

I can 2nd Metropolitan as well.  Literally right at the OAK airport and has some very neat holes on the back 9.

And if time isn't an issue the drive down Hwy 1 from San Fran via Half Moon Bay is worth it..just a gorgeous drive with unspoiled views for the most part.

Kalen - this coming from a man who drove said Nimitz every day of his life for 13 years, San Jose to Oakland and back:

there's NO good way to get from Oakland to Monterey during commute time - which will be later in the day going that direction.  Any time from 3pm on, you're screwed.  Traffic is ok on 880 from Oakland to about Millpitas, then after than going further south, 101 is awful all the way to the 156, and 880-17 is horribly packed also.  These are the prevailing commutes for people going back home from their jobs in Silicon Valley.

Outside of traffic times, I do believe 101-156 is a much better option.  880-1 might be technically shorter, but as you say the roads are smaller and more windy and I have to believe will take longer. The drive isn't all that scenic either way.  Just remember that at commute time BOTH options are going to suck mightily.

Now as for the golf courses, Mr. Benham covers it well.  But anyone who wants to try the glory that is Santa Teresa, well... I'll have recently started a new job then, but I could be persuaded to do an afternoon.
 

[Mike Benham]

From late morning on, weekdays, either route works fine.  If you drive Hwy 17 through the Santa Cruz mountains at 35-45 mph, you will be the slowest car on the road, even the cement trucks will be passing you

[Tom Huckaby]

From late morning on, weekdays, either route works fine.  If you drive Hwy 17 through the Santa Cruz mountains at 35-45 mph, you will be the slowest car on the road, even the cement trucks will be passing you

I'll take this as temporary insanity.

Michael, the worst commute going south is in the PM.  Yes, morning won't be a joy either.  But a version of hell is trying to go south from San Jose on 101 or over 17 at 4:30pm.   You know this.

TH

[Mike Benham]

From late morning on, weekdays, either route works fine.  If you drive Hwy 17 through the Santa Cruz mountains at 35-45 mph, you will be the slowest car on the road, even the cement trucks will be passing you

I'll take this as temporary insanity.

Michael, the worst commute going south is in the PM.  Yes, morning won't be a joy either.  But a version of hell is trying to go south from San Jose on 101 or over 17 at 4:30pm.   You know this.

TH

Yes, to clarify, the window is from 10 AM to 2 PM to go south from Oakland airport ...

[Tom Huckaby]

Much better.  We don't want to give our visitors TOO rosy of a picture.
 

[Mike Benham]

Much better.  We don't want to give our visitors TOO rosy of a picture.
 

Of course not, because if it was too rosy, they might want to move here ...

On the other hand, if their flight lands at 3 PM in Oakland, they might as well squeeze in some holes to let the traffic go by ...

[Kalen Braley]

Its been a few years since I've lived in the bay area, and Tom is absolutly correct, both routes get way backed up.

Luckily for me, my flight doesn't get in to SJ airport until 9 PM...so I probably won't even be on the road until 9:30 at night.  Are you guys saying that 101 headed south out of town is still backed up this late at night?

If this is so, man that is just craziness.....rush hour would normally settle down by 8 at night from what I can remember.   

[David Stamm]

After hearing all this, I may have to rethink my flight plans. I was going to get into SJ around 5:30 or so, but maybe not.

[Tom Huckaby]

Traffic will be horrid from San Jose toward Monterey until at least 7:30pm.  After that it should be all right.

Such is the Bay Area... site of the $500K median home price.  Sigh.  But then again, we do have nice weather most of the time.  65 and sunny today.

[David Stamm]

Well, I'll have to either get there much earlier, or get a later flight. If there's no traffic, how long to the Ramada in Marina? 1 hour?

[PThomas]

  But then again, we do have nice weather most of the time.  65 and sunny today.

 

[Mark Bourgeois]

Re Laguna Seca, I like the reference to "camber." But shouldn't the doglegs be called chicanes?

[David Stamm]

Re Laguna Seca, I like the reference to "camber." But shouldn't the doglegs be called chicanes?

LOL! Good one, Mark. Perhaps the chicanes and S's should carry names like in F1. The Mackenzie, chicane, the Thomas turn, the Tillinghast straight.......

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