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Bill Brightly

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Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« on: January 14, 2008, 08:49:33 AM »
Just heard that the Barclay's Classic is leaving Westchester and going to Ridgewood 8/21.

Is this true?

John Gosselin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2008, 08:53:26 AM »
Is this a one year deal before going to Liberty National?
Great golf course architects, like great poets, are born, note made.
Meditations of a Peripatetic Golfer 1922

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2008, 09:31:57 AM »
See www.geoffshackelford.com for complete details including the letters from the PGA Tour to Westchester and Westchester's letter to their members and links to articles in the NY Times and elsewhere.

"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2008, 11:28:51 AM »
Very interesting situation.

Be curious to see if the club and the Tour can kiss and make-up before things move even closer to a "War of the Roses" finality.

For RCC to handle a major men's event the logistics will be quite daunting given past situations tied to the Sr. PGA and Sr. Open.

The club's location to Rte 17 is a plus in some ways but also a major negative given the daily life that is Paramus.


Bill Brightly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2008, 11:38:31 AM »
I think they handled the Sr. PGA quite well, and I assume the PGA now knows exactly what has to be done to host an event at RCC.

One big advantage is the RCC backs up to a ccounty college with tons of parking, as well a 9 hole county course where they parked cars for the Sr. PGA.

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2008, 11:46:15 AM »
Bill:

With all due respect -- a senior event is nothing more than a pro-am compared to a mega event like the Barclays and all the fanfare / field that comes with it.

Accessing RCC through that t-i-n-y road to the club will be a major issue -- ditto the close proximity to Rte 17 and Rte 4 and all the daily hustle and bustle that comes with it.

No doubt Bergen Community College is central to helping with the parking problems but if Tiger does play the overall intensity will be far greater than the club has ever experienced before.

Keep in mind the existing pratice range will likely be the home for the coroporat tents and I have to question if using the 1st hole of the East as the practice area is sufficiently big enough to handle such a large field.

I'm happy to hear about the news as a Jersey person, however, the mega logistics are nothing near what happened with the Sr. Open and PGA events.

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2008, 04:37:24 PM »
If things do pan out for RCC and the club does in fact host this year's Barclays it will be very interesting to see the exact routing used for the event and how far back the course can really play.

The two senior events resulted in 72-hole totals of 274 and 275 respectively, if memory serves.

This time around it will be interesting to see how the world's best handle all of the holes previously mentioned -- e.g., from the five'n dime to 8W and all the rest.

I don't see RCC being capable of containing the guys and keeping them from breaking the four round totals I just mentioned.

We shall see if that should come to pass.

I'm pulling for RCC to host the event -- be another feather in the cap for NJ.


M. Shea Sweeney

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Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2008, 04:39:00 PM »
Ridgewood will be hosting the Barclay's--a composite routing will be  created.

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2008, 04:55:45 PM »
There going to have to s-t-r-e-t-c-h the place until they hit the hedges with some of the tees. Having the world's best is far beyond just having the seniors and gals teeing it up.

Joe Hancock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2008, 04:58:42 PM »
I bet someone here already knew this, based on the fact that two good, meaty threads about Ridgewood have been started since the beginning of the year.

Make that three, now.

 ;D
« Last Edit: January 15, 2008, 04:59:04 PM by Joe Hancock »
" What the hell is the point of architecture and excellence in design if a "clever" set up trumps it all?" Peter Pallotta, June 21, 2016

"People aren't picking a side of the fairway off a tee because of a randomly internally contoured green ."  jeffwarne, February 24, 2017

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2008, 05:04:40 PM »
Joe:

Maybe.

The simple fact is that Ridgewood has not really been tested at the highest of high levels. I also have to wonder how much lead prep time will go into growing the rough deeper in many different spots.

Sometimes the aggravation (see Westchester CC) is worth more than the positive derived.

I also have this feeling that the Tour moved ahead with the Ridgewood option in order to get the existing layout to snap into line with what they want done.

Bill Brightly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2008, 08:02:09 PM »
Joe:

Maybe.

The simple fact is that Ridgewood has not really been tested at the highest of high levels. I also have to wonder how much lead prep time will go into growing the rough deeper in many different spots.

Sometimes the aggravation (see Westchester CC) is worth more than the positive derived.

I also have this feeling that the Tour moved ahead with the Ridgewood option in order to get the existing layout to snap into line with what they want done.

Matt,

If you read Goeff S.' article, and the attched letters from the PGA and the Westchester Club president, it's pretty clear that the PGA moved ahead with Ridgewood because of difficulties they were having with Westchester, not to get Ridgewood to "snap in  line."

What do you have against Ridgewood? Did they not let you caddy there when you were young or something?  ;D

Ridgewood and Westchester are on a par, and I think the scores at RCC will be very close to what they were at Westchester. The greens will be excellent, fast with a lot of contour, and plenty of places to tuck some pins if they so choose.

Lastly, they do not need a long lead time to let the rough grow...just a few days, maybe a week, of not cutting, and missing the fairway will be a significant penalty. They are setting up for a PGA event, not a US Open.

Personally, I will be fascinated to see how the pros score on another ODG course.

But it sounds like it is not yet a done deal, I think Westchester may fight to keep it.

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/Barclays_to_Bergen_County.html
« Last Edit: January 15, 2008, 08:06:36 PM by Bill Brightly »

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2008, 10:39:32 AM »
Bill:

Read what I wrote.

I said the tactic taken by the PGA Tour was to snap Westchester CC into line. Sometimes the illusion of a spat is more about getting others to fall in line with what the Tour is seeking.

Ridgewood may be nothing more than a negotiating ploy but one that Westchester CC needs to take seriously.

Bill, the event is more than just a Tour event -- it is part of the season ending tournaments that determine a great deal.

Candidly, I wish I could have looped at RCC -- it's a great club and if the event lands there a real plus for the flks associated with it and for the immediate area. Now, let's be sure that all that traffic can fit through the small road leading up and into the club. ;D

David Federman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2008, 03:53:44 PM »
Interesting article on Ridgewood from TGC.com posted today:

Why Tiger Might Play Barclays - 01/30/2008
By Brian Hewitt
The wooing of Tiger Woods has officially begun. Now that New Jersey’s prestigious Ridgewood Country Club has acquired the rights to host The Barclays, which will also serves as the FedExCup playoff opener in late August, the drive is on to get the world’s No. 1 into the fold.
 
By all accounts, Ridgewood Country Club, a classic 27-hole A.W. Tillinghast design complex in Paramus, N. J., is golf in its purest form. There is an East nine, a West nine and a Center nine. The tournament course will be a composite of seven holes from the East, five holes from the Center and six holes from the West. That configuration will play 7,304 yards to a par of 71.
 
“It will flow very well,” said David Reasoner, Ridgewood’s head pro. “And that particular composite course will allow us to handle the infrastructure concerns.”
 
One high-ranking USGA official told GOLF CHANNEL that room for corporate tents and other on-site support trailers and equipment could be a problem at Ridgewood. But that same official said it wouldn’t matter what 18 holes the TOUR selected for The Barclays. “They’re all great,” the official said.
 
The USGA’s headquarters are also in New Jersey. So are other Tillinghast designs at Baltusrol and Somerset Hills. Tillinghast also designed Winged Foot across the state line in Westchester County.
 
The sixth hole for the Barclays (normally the third hole on the Center nine) is a drivable 294-yard, par-4 and Ridgewood’s signature hole. In the old days the members called it the “five and dime” because most played it 5-iron off the tee and a 10-iron (now a wedge) into the green. Woods, who recently began designing courses himself, is on record as saying golf courses should have a drivable par-4.
 
Woods tied for fourth at the 2005 PGA Championship at Baltusrol and missed the cut by three strokes, not long after the death of his father, in 2006 at Winged Foot. But Woods has often spoken fondly of his rounds at the San Francisco Golf Club when he was a member of the Stanford Golf team in the mid-90s. San Francisco Golf is also a Tillinghast design.
 
“I believe Tiger would love Ridgewood,” Reasoner said. “It’s an old, traditional, tree-lined course and you have to be able to work the ball both ways.”
 
It was no secret that Woods didn’t like the layout at Westchester Country Club which preceded Ridgewood as The Barclays’ venue. And to be sure, if he decides to skip The Barclays this year it might be purely a matter of scheduling and have nothing to do with Ridgewood’s relative merits.
 
But if he stays away, most course critics will tell you, he will be missing something special. “Ridgewood is not overly tight,” Reasoner says. “But it has incredible green complexes.”


tlavin

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2008, 04:12:20 PM »
I love this quote:

“I believe Tiger would love Ridgewood,” Reasoner said. “It’s an old, traditional, tree-lined course and you have to be able to work the ball both ways.”

Isn't Tiger the same guy who doesn't play Colonial (an old, traditional, tree-lined course where you have to be able to work the ball both ways)???  Some of our Euro-brethren were trumpeting Tiger's quote to the effect that he likes links golf the best.  I'm sure that Tiger really loves Fazio's quarry courses, too.

Bottom line, Tiger will play a course if it is hosting:

1. A major
2. A Buick Event
3. Something that benefits his charity
4. Something that Jack or Arnie is in charge of.
5. a championship he really wants to win, for whatever reason.

I don't think Tiger gives a damn whether it's a modern course, an old course, a links course or a combo course like Warwick Hills.  He plays to win and for sponsorship reasons and for relationship reasons, not because of the architecture.

Tim Pitner

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2008, 05:31:45 PM »
I don't think Tiger gives a damn whether it's a modern course, an old course, a links course or a combo course like Warwick Hills.  He plays to win and for sponsorship reasons and for relationship reasons, not because of the architecture.

But Terry, Tiger didn't play Westchester even when it was a Buick-sponsored event.  

Matt_Ward

Re:Barclay's moving to Ridgewood?
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2008, 06:35:35 PM »
In most instances the overall "New York meto area" draw would bring just about any player to the area.

Tiger, though, is the dog -- not the tail.

I don't expect seeing him because of the sheer number of tournaments that would come at the end of the year -- plus it's a Ryder Cup year too.

One other note -- don't count on Ernie Els playing. The South African was quite fond of Westchester (he won there) and he's stated in the past that should matters change his itinerary would likely be altered.

Should those two bail and the probability that Phil is not a 100% certainty could make the event a lot less in overall fan attention.

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