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JESII

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #25 on: January 24, 2008, 03:41:32 PM »
Just move the clubhouse and the problem is solved.

Right? or Left?

PThomas

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #26 on: January 24, 2008, 03:51:12 PM »
Paul, Here in Ogallala, at Corey's West Wind, both nines start with par 3's. The first hole has OB on the right, and believe me, it is rather intimidating. The tenth has OB on both sides, is more exposed to the wind, and, is twice as intimidating. Both holes play at relatively the same yardage (175 from back tee)


hmmm...OB right on a long par 3 Adam....now that's a bit much esp if its a public course where a lot of beginners are playing
199 played, only Augusta National left to play!

Mike Tanner

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2008, 10:02:27 PM »
Before I read the comments on this thread I would have automatically answered the question by choosing the finisher for the par three. But I detest slow play, so the idea of an opening par-3 that would create a natural interval is compelling. Thanks for the enlightenment.
The determining factor in this question is the lay of the land.There's a par-3 eighteenth hole at Ingleside (Fred Findlay, 1927) in Staunton, Virginia that couldn't have been anything else. The tee is shelved into a small hill and the green is benched at the same elevation into a  larger hill that dominates the property. The tee shot is a 189-yard (from the back tees) carry over a deep ravine and has to avoid a pair of bunkers that flank both sides of the front of the green.
   What's really fun is the patio behind and above the green. You can finish your round, open a cold one and make bets on the skills, or lack thereof, (on the green in regulation, up and downs, putts) of other players coming in.
   
Life's too short to waste on bad golf courses or bad wine.

Adam_Messix

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #28 on: January 24, 2008, 10:04:04 PM »
Green Spring Valley Hunt Club in Baltimore starts AND finishes with par 3 holes.  The 1st is about 190 yards and the 18th is 135 yards to a small, interestingly contoured green.  It works really well given the tight property lines near the clubhouse.

Gerry B

Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #29 on: January 25, 2008, 12:25:56 AM »
I Like the opening par 3 at Walton Heath Old -(one of my favorite places to play)- then you cross the road for the rest of the course - works  for me.


Dean Paolucci

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #30 on: January 25, 2008, 12:51:57 AM »
In a perfect world, I prefer to begin the round with a medium par 5 like the first hole at either the upper or lower at Baltusrol.  I always favor a brutal par 4 to end the round like the eighteenth at the Knoll or Sleepy Hollow.  Given my druthers, I would resist par 3's at #1,9, 10, or 18.
"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."  --  Mark Twain

Lester George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #31 on: January 25, 2008, 12:58:02 AM »
Opener-No

Closer-if it is extraordinary

Cavalier, #18 a Redan over water, yes

Cascades, #18 a marginal finish considering the other 3's, no

Castle Harbour, #18 reasonable par 3 over a ravine, yes

Old White, #18 a short hole over Howards Creek, yes

Lester

Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #32 on: January 25, 2008, 02:02:56 AM »
Opener  -  Dalmunzie  GC    Scotland  Mackenzie
  Par 3 3/16  tester -  Stretch out first.

Opener - Carradale, Mull of Kintyre, Scotland     Archie - Unk
  150ish up to top of dune ridge - false front . . . and back.

Closer  Front 9  Wildhorse GC, Gothenburg, NE  
Beautious and beer is close.

I don't see a problem with par 3 bookends; whatever fits the land.  



"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Brett Hochstein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #33 on: January 25, 2008, 02:33:44 AM »
If it produces the best overall routing, then do it.

My question is, what does everyone do when they warm up on the range?  From anyone I have seen, it is short irons into mid irons into long irons into woods and driver.  Considering this, wouldn't a par 3 opener actually be a more natural opener, especially for those who haven't warmed up?  
Nonetheless I would still only opt for one if it involves my first point above.
"From now on, ask yourself, after every round, if you have more energy than before you began.  'Tis much more important than the score, Michael, much more important than the score."     --John Stark - 'To the Linksland'

http://www.hochsteindesign.com

michael_j_fay

Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #34 on: January 25, 2008, 08:35:00 AM »
The par three finisher at East Lake is a wonderful hole for both match and medal play.

Jimmy Muratt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #35 on: January 25, 2008, 09:26:44 AM »
I think a par-3 finisher is a great and often dramatic way to end a round, especially in club tournament or match play.  Having a group walk to the 18th tee, all hit from the same spot as onlookers watch everything from the nearby clubhouse is an excellent way to end a round.  

It definitely helps if it's a great golf hole, of course, but that same thing can be said for a par 4 or par 5 finisher as well.  No one likes to end on a weak golf hole....

Alfonso Erhardt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #36 on: January 25, 2008, 05:40:13 PM »
In a post a couple of weeks ago I mentioned how in my home club, both courses start with a par 3. It really does help traffic, as it spreads people out.

As a finishing hole, par 3 doesn't seem the best option for a course that gets a lot of matchplay (which is the norm, at least for amateur play).

JNagle

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #37 on: January 25, 2008, 08:03:13 PM »
Brook Lea in Rochester ends with two par 3's.  The Clubhouse location was relocated forcing the club to modify its routing.  #9 is a decent finisher but #18 is lacking.

Dellwood Country Club in New City, NY finishes with two 3's.  Both are very stern holes and were designed by Tilly to finish as such.  
It's not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or the doer of deeds could have done better.  The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; .....  "The Critic"

Brock Peyer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #38 on: January 25, 2008, 09:12:02 PM »
The course that I learned to play on, The Murray State University course ends both nines with mid length par threes.  I don't think that I would want to start a round with a par three but I think ending is ok as long as it is a challenging and interesting hole.

I agree that 18 at East Lake is a great example.

J_ Crisham

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #39 on: January 25, 2008, 09:41:52 PM »
East Lake is hard to complain about. The 18th is 230yds and somewhat uphill. I've hit driver into the wind and my hybrid downwind. Probably one of the harder holes on the back 9 . As far as pressure its all about that tee shot .

Michael Whitaker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #40 on: January 25, 2008, 09:49:42 PM »
Royal Lytham & St Annes begins with a famous par 3. It's a wonderful start to your round... unless you discover you have an extra driver in your bag!  >:(
"Solving the paradox of proportionality is the heart of golf architecture."  - Tom Doak (11/20/05)

Zack Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #41 on: January 26, 2008, 09:01:02 AM »
Opening on a par 3 not for me, but if I hired a great architect and hes said it was going to start with a 3 par then I'd be fine with it.  Closing on a par 3 I really like, on of my favorite clubs here in NC closes on a par 3 and I think its a great hole (18 at Hope Valley CC in Durham).  But I believe we hire architects to design the best course for the property that they have been given.
Fairways & Greens
Zack Quinn Kelly

Anthony Butler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:starting and/or ending with a par 3?
« Reply #42 on: January 26, 2008, 11:05:18 AM »
Westchester CC opens with a par 3. When I lived nearby it was about 3-4 iron for the pros at what is now the Barclays. No-one looked too thrilled having to hit a green with a long iron for the first shot of the day... It's probably a 6 with the Pro VI.

A par-3 closer seems like a more natural fit to my way of thinking.
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